Sleight of Hand <---> ( Yes Another Post )

I will agree its a purely situational spell. It's not something you will use every time its up. Swashies are usually fairly high up the list though if you think about it. Say a main tank dies. Once he is rezzed you can swap and he goes from 0 hate to wherever the swash was. Now rescue and some taunts can help get it back. Maybe a wizard overnukes and you can use it and then deaggro yourself to give it back to the tank. Another spot is when the hate shuffles or like you guys say they mem wipe. Again, I realize it is situational and not going to be something you have on your primary hotbar or run out to buy the master 1 of but it does fit in with the class.

This would be fine if the actual swap worked, it still does not, it is STILL a super rescue not swapping the aggro at all. It is still useless.
Like I said above its not going to be something you use everytime its up. It's a situational spell that does have its uses though. If you have suggestions that keep the general theme then I am open to making it better and more useable but it's not going to change into some sort of attack.

There have been tons of suggestions on this forum on how to change it that is not an attack. A temporary buff, hate buff for someone else. And so on. Even situational it is totally useless because the mechanics have never worked.

I frequently try to use it as Aerlic describes - thas what it's meant to do. It at best works rarely but most of the time it has no discernable effect.

Basically its a very situational ability which 95% of the time appears to do absobloodylutly nothing

Aeralik wrote:

Let me explain a form of hate transfer to the tank that actually works by the way. A good swashy is in the role of a secondary tank. The swashy then sees a possible add, instead of waiting for it to attack a squishy or healer, he intelligently engages the target BEFORE it starts hitting the aforementioned squishy. I can do this far more effectively without using SoH and I will explain how because I have actually played the class until level 80. By attacking the mob, I transfer hate to the tank automatically (thanks for the added Charm's Way bonus). I taunt and hit it, I have agro (I have never failed to grab agro in this manner ever). Then I hit hideaway... All done, and I'm invis for my next attack. I don't need to worry about targeting this one, and that one, and then this person over there. That is the fastest way, and it doesn't involve using a ridiculous spell that NO ONE will put on their HOTBAR to use once every two weeks.
How can you with a straight face give the response above? Go back and read it and listen to yourself? You agree it's purely situation, well I gave you above what I would do in that situation and it works way better. It's called playing smart. Nobody wants the spell, it sucks. Obviously no class is alone in having spells they don't use, I pretty much never have to hit baffle, but I do sometimes just cuz (I still have it adept III at least, which is more than I can say for SoH). Let me see, you have spirits for mystic, deagro spell for Fury's blah blah blah... Is there any other class in this game that does not want a master version of their level 80 class defining spell? I'm pretty sure not based on my reading. I watched 3 copies of this spell on broker for swashy drop to 15 plat, before they were purchased (presumably for muting).
Suggestions for a better spell? Well obviously you aren't going to give us something that defines our class, so I'm ok with that. I'm sorry but hate management is not our job, it's the job of the tank and and the chanter. We can off tank in certain necessary situations, but it's not what we are built for. Aside from that, there are SEVERAL hate management suggestions from people who play high level swashies that would be more effective for us. Read the thread and you will see. If I had more time, I would QFE some of them for you, but I don't get paid to do that.
Again, you wasted your time with your so called "fix" completely. I'm just upset that your time was wasted, when you could have been doing something useful for another class.
Thank you for your time.

Katanallama@Mistmoore wrote:

On a side note ... How do you get rrarwk back once you are done with your epic (fabled) weapon quest ? It disappeared from my inventory once I completed the quest. Is it possible to get it back ? When the mythical is completed for instance (still working on it) ?

go back to the cage on the boat and click again, presto you have Rrarwrk and your sleight of hand replacement on hotbar

So last night my guild is killing Nexona and every time I used SoH on the MT, Nexona turned right to me and killed me. I thought maybe because of direct targetting the mob maybe I should directly target the tank instead. Maybe Nex switched to a squishy and lowered their agro and somehow bumped me up or some crap like that. I don't know. I've always been able to cast it on the MT through a mob without any issues.
So I target the MT directly and the same thing happens. I tried it later on on some VP trash and every time it was like I was rescuing the mob off the tank. I then tried it one time on Xygoz and that was it for me. I've lost all confidence in this spell now as it seems to do the opposite of what it's supposed to.
There are some fights where we rotate tanks like Master P and Phara Dar where I could see this spell to be useful (not in it's current state) but I think the immunity should be reduced from 2 minutes to 1 minute.

Darud@Befallen wrote:

So are you saying that it does what its supposed to now? That when you cast it on the MT (Who had aggro already) that nexona targetted you? Basically Swapping your hate position with the tank?

Read what i said about it only acting as a rescue. the swash two posts above only rescued it.

Aeralik wrote:

Thanks for taking the time to give your input, very kind of you! I still don't exactly agree but your answers are much appreciated.
Since this is going to be our lvl 80 spell, I do think the mechanics need to be tweaked in some way. Because things happen so fast in combat by the time you're able to bring SoH in to play it's too late. (It's usually too late by the time you even see that you need to use SoH).

Last night in Runnyeye I tested out SoH.

Everytime I used it I ripped from the tank. EVERYTIME it swapped our hate positions. I used it twice to save the tank's life and soak up some hits and then I used it a few more times just to prove a point that the reverse rescue aspect of it worked. I even backed off to maximum CA range, so I could at least debuff the mob while hitting evade, hideaway and then SoH. Sure enough the mob was on me after that. I then used evade and hideaway to give it back to the tank when he was no longer in purple/red, needless to say that last example though I almost died . I don't know about you guys but I like this. As for swapping our positions when I rip aggro the old fashioned way I didn't get a chance to use that because I didn't rip aggro.

Another situation that I had a chance of testing was when our ranger ripped aggro from the tank in the group encounters. I popped SoH on the ranger and 3 times out of 5 it worked right when I hit the skill.

In groups this skill works quite well now. I like the reverse rescue aspect of it, and I like the fact that it helps with getting hate off of the dps. Since I was buffed up to 12.5k I was able to take a barrage of hits. In raids I imagine this skill is only useful for memwipe mobs that target you specifically, such as Pawbuster and Doomcoil. But normally when the MT dies the MA picks it up right off the bat, so using it to save the tank's life is kinda pointless in a raid since the MT is back up and ready in no time. No use losing an MT AND a swashy.

Overall I'm an almost happy swashy. I have a skill that requires some strategy to use properly.
But reduce the recast time to 10 seconds so that I can use it for bouncing mobs. The 2min immunity is fine for this particular version of SoH.

I suppose that's great if your tank can't hold agro or sucks. I'm glad there is a swashy out there that gets something out of this. and I genuinely mean it. I'll save the space on my hotbar for something else, and the plat for the master. golf clap ftw..... This is my last post on this spell anyways, I just don't care anymore. I hope all the swashies out there love it. The swashy is good enough without it.

Dreadpatch wrote:

Nah the guy is a fantastic tank. Let's just say it was our first time through RE, and there were a lot of cases where we were pulling mobs onto ourselves.

Also we killed the Blacksmith and the last named very easily. lol. So no he didn't suck.

Katanallama@Mistmoore wrote:

Woot great I'm gonnna get it next time I log
(there si a free spot on my hotbars)

I am in agreance with Dreadpatch..... This will probably be my last post, but LEAVE THE SPELL ALONE... atleast now it has some use. It actualy does something. Even if it is a super rescue then so be it. I can once again use it on PB to pull the mob back off of healers and squishies. I can (intercept ) for the tank lol.. And I have not tested to see if it will drop me if I am at the top before i cast it .. WIll do so tonight... Anyways.. SOE Leave the spell alone.. Even though it may not work as describe atleast it works to a degree.. Before this recent patch the fu**ing thing didn't do sh**.

Hmmm yea, I'm gonna agree that this ability should just be left as is now that some people find it useful occasionally

It's a broken super rescue too. Tonight on silverwing I target the add to SOH it off the MT. Guess who comes? Silverwing, lucky we didn't wipe. It didn't change positions of me and the coercer it had targeted it changed the positions of me and the MT.

To above post:
If both Silver Wing and the add are both on the MT, of course your going to pull Silverwing of the MT.. Reason, you are swapping your hate position with the MT. His Hate applies to both Mobs not just the one you target thus swapping the Hate you have on both mobs for the Hate the MT has on both mobs..

I posted the original target wrong the mob was on the coercer, silverwing was on the MT, I used SOH on the add who was targeting the coercer and got Silverwing.

Gotcha but ya gotta factor in the slite possibility that immediately before you casted it the tank managed to grab agro.. but then again it may have been blunt bad luck.. I have never had it happen but eh who knows..

Aeralik wrote:

Had to have a chuckle at this, Mythicals have been out a while yet you are making considerale changes to them (may I add apart from Swashbucklers) ... just l o l