The advanced loot system and it's exploits

Just like the old loot system it's based on some degree of trust and honor. At the very least with the advance loot system that trust and honor relies only on the person running it and to a lesser degree the people rolling.

Rolling need for items instead of Greed is a different matter. I have played with folks who need everything including gems and trade skill items even if they don't actually need them. Others who need on stuff they can actually use and greed the rest and others still who need on stuff they can use plus the stuff any of their alts can use plus anything else they like.

When you join a group clarify looting rules and more often then not as long as the group is doing the same thing it's fine.

I have ran groups that we did enforce NbG and others where everyone would Need stuff even if there was someone in the group that would actually wear it. NbG outside of guild groups or groups of real life friends are not all that common. If your camping in Lguk don't be surprised if melee rolls need on caster items and vice versa if you would wear it make sure you need on it at least that way you get a chance against others who rolled need even if their perception of the word need and yours are different.

Conversely you can always start the groups and run loot yourself then you will be in charge of the loot and it will be your honor and trust that determine how loot is dispensed though even doing this you can't control how people are rolling unless your willing to boot people from the group if they continue to roll contrary to established loot rules after asked to roll need/greed.

I love advance loot, it's great!

The idea behind the 'assign to a character' is sort of the reverse for what happened. Say the group agrees that they're camping something for a character - sword , robe, whatever. Then when it drops the person who wants it selects need, 4 people select greed, but one selects need too, that means that he's got a 50% chance to win the item as a greed item and everyone else is screwed.

So, the assign to character is to protect against that (or for raid drops). Sadly, it leaves this open for the exploit you encountered.

In the game that shall remain nameless, I got cussed out for taking a leather item with spirit on it (green item) for my hunter. I was focusing on having my pet tank, so I wanted some spirit for spell casting, and a druid freaked out and dropped the group mid dungeon (the druid was of course, needing all leather armor because sometimes he was a warrior, rogue, healer etc). There's no perfect system.

Just because a person says they will happily share the winnings of a lottery when an entire workplace pitches in, they don't have to. Some human beings are d-bags.

It has nothing to do with the advloot system at all. Just the person who was the main looter. But I see you let one grouping experience ruin all others that may happen down the line.

Though I also see you went from /advloot to boxing rants. Which is it you are having the problem with? Remember, if you wish to bring up an argument you need to stay on point, be concise so you don't lose your audience, and overall don't go off on a tangent.

I have a 2 box of a SK and SHM. 2 different computers so I'm much slower than many others. I have a set up with which items goes to which of my characters. I also had a 2 box of a rogue and mage, and a Ranger came up asking if I found any micro servers. I said no but invited him to my group to help him get them and exp. I let him know what items I was looking for and he was fine with that. I did the same with the Necro I grouped with. But I also helped by giving the Necro (who was completely new) the cloth armor I found so they could get fully geared, as well as a new weapon and bones. I made sure the ranger got the servos he needed, and I kept the items I was looking for.

Everything else, I made a Free Grab sorta thing, which means whomever in the group clicks on it first gets it. So yeah, not all of us group main looters are jerks.

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Pretty much this.

Watch who the ML is when you're not leading a group. Take note of the guild and the person who does such acts and share it with your own guild and friends. Sure we can't name and shame, but we didn't have a forum to do such in 1999 either, but managed to blacklist peeps off from getting things done. When peeps get booted/denied groups because of guild tag, it'll start stinging.

No offense but in Classic casters particular int casters make out like bandits when it comes to NBG loot rules when you consider all camps. As a Monk this is basically the story every camp in the game besides frenzy. I go to the hole for 4 hours each caster gets 3 or 4 pieces of loam each i. I get nothing. I go to Lord/AM/Hand. Casters get SMR other melees get Yaks rings and plate users get helms. I again get nothing. I decide i can't get loot in grps because literally every pug group camp besides Frenzy is NBG so i go to clan runnyeye and try to farm some bams to sell I get KSed by mages 10 lvls lower then me even though i beat 20% of the mobs health off before they send their pet or start casting a spell. So again i get nothing. I decide it this is i'm just gonna need on loam in the Hole. I will get instant gkicked so again i get nothing.

The nerve of someone who always has the loot rules set in his favor because caster make up 66% of the group and has the ability to KS any melee he so chooses to complain about literally the 1 camp in the entire span of classic that he would have to suck it up like melee have to do.

Congratz you rustled my jimmies

if you wanna make friends, NBG stuff it's just pixels. If you don't give a crap about being friendly just need everything and give the middle finger... to get some nicer pixels.

All other discussion aside, I take issue with the assumption that the TBB is a melee exclusive item. In fact, an argument could be made that it's better suited for casters because melees should be wearing a haste belt, ultimately, and the only real long-term use of a TBB for a melee (besides bards using it for the same reason a caster would) is with a Mithral 2 hander, which, IMO, is really best suited for Rangers...There are better weapon options for every other class that can use it.

It's an ALL/ALL item for a reason....The 8 AC and STR makes it excellent for casters. One dropped in there when I was grouped with my druid and I rolled "need" on it. Didn't win...Lost to an enchanter, actually. Which is fine. Almost bought one when I saw one for sale but was a bit short on cash...Got a Reed Belt the next day so I didn't look for another. But AC does have value to casters and casters tend to be weak races so the STR is a huge boost in avoiding weight issues where other options for that are limited. My druid on another classic server has never been lucky with the reed belt and wears, you guessed it, a TBB in that slot as a matter of fact. And it works nicely.

I did win an EBM in that group over melees and no one had an issue with it....Because good players who use their full ability sets depending on situation understand these things. I still use it now almost a month later although it's taken a backseat to thr RF because it has a better ratio.

All of that said, it does irritate me when master looters take it upon themselves to award loot to any particular group member without prior discussion that it will be happening with a particular drop. Loot belongs to the group and if a group is giving loot rights to one particular player that needs to be discussed beforehand.

this is why i like grouping with guildies or being the ML. i need before greed.

someone groups with me, they tell me what they want? okay, if no one else needs it, they get the first drop, more than one need? they random and i asign it to the winner. i have sadly surprised too many with my attitude about it... and yeah if it is a warrior drop and a mage wants it? yep the warrior who needs the gear to tank for me will get it first if he doesn't have it, the mage can get the next one.

that argument would hold more value if an equal amount of caster and melee item would drop.

since sebilis is comming up soonish.. i'd like to point out 90% of stuff dropping there is melee-oriented. if you expect casters to not roll on any of it... well. sorry my friend. you gonna have mage army roaming through your camp.

regardless of your personal opinions on NBG, if the group agreed to it beforehand, it is EXTREMELY poor to back out on it later. ive been in both kinds of groups, as long as people know what they are getting in to before hand, either way has merits.

The system is only as good as the user. All there is to say about that.

Our server sure did have a forum. The XEV Server Forums were highly active with our playerbase, and the inferno/rant area saw much activity for calling out players on their crap. I don't think it was unique to our server, but I know for certain the XEV boards saw a ton of activity, and it wasn't moderated into the ground like these boards are. Even after ther merger into Druzzil Ro, there was much activity on their forums as well (although a definite and noticable decline from the levels on Xev boards).

Who here remembers Rinquist and his stick figure drawings?

RIP Xev Server Forums. I want you back.

I was in a group last night and one of them whispered me to just roll need on everything because no matter what, everyone else was doing the same. Kinda lame. But yep, friends, guildies solves that.

FBSS was one example , if a group had half Meele , a cleric and a shaman with 1 caster and they were camping AM/HAND all day , should the only good loot drop (SMR) go to the mage who will turn it for 3 krono and camp it again tomorrow ?

You're obviously living in a fantasy land if you think that's fair.

Here's another example , mage loots smr with that group after camping it for 4 hours - here invite new mage he's my replacement.

Oh look another SMR. All you other classes must pass to the new needy mage.

Just stop.

1) No, it shouldn't. I agree NBG in camps where stuff doesn't drop for every class is stupid
2) Get better reading comprehension and reply to what i actually said
3) Your hypothetical is misses the point. Such a group would never exist as AM/Hand doesn't get camp. Hand/Lord or AM or all 3 get camped. Nor does your mythical group comp exist on ragefire.

Last night in guk 5 there was a separate group farming lord ( small group of higher levels ) for yaks and a lower level group farming AM / Hand.

I guess you're just dead wrong about a group like that never existing.

My point stands, in a camp where the ( only ) good drops are caster or meele - such as ( AM / HAND ) OR Frenzie / Sent. - Why should half or more of a party have no chance at getting good loot?

Or are you changing your tune about nbg rolling?

Change your tune bud, you're just dead wrong.

Anyone that argues against NBG is just greedy. They didn't have to join that group, they didn't have to go along to that camp... they damn well don't need to (greed) roll for loot that half the group would equip instantly, when they can't.

So healers should just join frenzie and heal everyone with no hope of getting good loot for themselves.

Everyone should just gear you up.

Got it.

IMO in a pickup group where 1 or 2 highly valuble items drop and only wearable by certain classes everyone should be allowed to need on it, as much as I'd prefer NBG for everyone I can just picture certain classes repeating the same camp over and over and just gettting and selling off the same item that they "need". There is no way to control this either.. and no way to tell if they already have the item. You just can't trust everyone to be honest with NBG unless they are friends (and hopefully guild mates are)

However this HAS to be communicated ahead of time, I've been in groups where everyone knew but me and so I was trying to go NBG and roll greed and something I cannot use, but I can sell anyway, and everyone else rolled need and I lost out on the roll. If everyone knows the deal then it's OK to roll need on a highly valuble item - I don't see any issues. Otherwise what incentive would mages/tanks/healers etc to make a well balanced group if only certain people are guaranteed any loot? Especially if you dont know the other people, why would it be worthwhile to go to the camp where nothing drops for your class?