When's TR actually getting a MBT?

There is some room to argue about two shots being good or bad, but there is no room to argue an objective fact. The Prowler has the same armor ratings and health as the Magrider. The Prowler doesnt just have the highesr DPS in class, it has the highest DPS of any ground unit even before it engages Barrage. The Prowler has the highest ROF in its class specifically because it has 2 shots. Its combination of best in class acceleration, best in class speed and the inbetween option for turn speeds make the Prowler arguably the best or second best, but never the worst. The recoil even on the Vanguard is barely noticeable and the Prowler has even less recoil.

If we cannot agree on objective facts, facts that have been true since the beginning of the game, then there is no reason to continue discussing anything.

That is also ignoring the fact that the Prowler isnt underperforming. How can you claim the Prowler being so bad, when its not actually doing badly? What explanation can you give?

and triple the hitbox! With no turbo or strafing capabilities!

That is simply untrue, papa vanu swapped reloads with the prowler a long time ago to "fix" this.

Who cares? My diarrhea has the highest ROF, yet it's inaccurate and has insignificant AV capabilities, and has harsh drop-off at range. Being able to fire a lot of stuff doesn't mean anything if it deals little damage and is slow and inaccurate.

yeah, the best at being worst. It's maybe funny if you want to farm a bit of infantry, maybe scare a lightning, otherwise it's pretty much useless.

it's so trash only skilled players use it, and they do so carefully. Obviously, the more disadvantaged you are, the more advantages you look to stack on your side in order to win. Playing stuff like this requires you to think. It's actually why I can get relatively frequent 150 streaks in a post nerf scattmax when I occasionally pull them, while the best I've done on a blueshift/mercy would be a bit past 80.

Also I might point out that force someone who promotes facts/stats whatever, you provided us with a whole lot of nothing to support your statements. Thanks for assuming I am smart enough to infer your objective facts, but please don't refrain from citing them, so other players won't get confused.

Compared to what side? From the front it's larger than the Vanguard. From the side it's smaller than the Vanguard and Magrider. Example:


See how the difference in thickness isn't even that pronounced compared the the Vanguard? You can even argue that the Prowler has the smallest hitbox as it has less height and thickness in it's small turret. Although the features of the Magrider naturally make it a much harder target as well.

Again: Confirmation bias is a powerful thing, you call it 3x the hitbox, while in reality what is gains in it's frontal thickness it loses in it's small turret size.

I'm using these and only calculating the AP versions right now as those hold the highest user numbers:
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/Prowler/Weapons
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/Magrider/Weapons
https://planetside.fandom.com/wiki/Vanguard/Weapons

First the Prowler:
600 damage per shot. 2 shots. 0.5 seconds between the first shot and second shot, another 0.5 seconds before the reload starts. I'm using unmodified reloads so 3.5 seconds of reload for a total of 4.5 seconds to unload one magazine and ready the next one. That means 1200 damage across 4.5=266.67 DPS.

Magrider:
750 per shot. 3.25 seconds per reload. 230.77 DPS.

Vanguard:
850 per shot. 3.75 seconds per reload. 226.67 DPS.

Which vehicle has the highest DPS?

I care when people proclaim false things for personal gain.

The Prowler's shots are accurate, amazingly so. At 100m firing two shots at a MAX the recoil won't be big enough to throw off your aim. Your shots are just as accurate as the Magrider's, only you deal more damage over time. In closer ranges it should not be harder to hit the second shot, in fact on a zippy target like a Harasser you have a higher likelyhood of getting enough hits in to kill it than the Vanguard or Magrider have as you can spread your shots. Then at range your two shots are again an advantage: It is easier and faster to gauge the distance your enemy is at when you fire two shots allowing you to start hitting your enemy more and faster than your opponents.

These shots also don't deal "little damage". They deal 30% damage less per shot than the Vanguard, but together they deal 40% more damage than that same Vanguard. The shots are also just as fast as the Magrider's and when you get at enough range that the muzzle velocity starts mattering you can also use Anchor to speed it up. An option the other two don't have.

If it's so useless, then answer this: Why does the Prowler not have a significantly less amount of users (in fact it's almost tied with the Vanguard), why does the Prowler not get worse performance by that same playerbase?

False, as can be seen here:
https://voidwell.com/ps2/oracle?sta...,4009&startDate=2020-10-09&endDate=2020-12-03

The Vanguard and Prowler are about tied with the BR that uses them.

How is that obvious? Because you want it to be? Can you point me to any data that supports this besides "I've seen it I tells ya"?

If I say you are breathing air, do I need to show you a composition of the air surrounding you, your lung content and the way your lungs work? Then throw in some definitions on what constitutes "breathing" and add some electromyograms showing the activity in the intercostal muscles and diaphram? Or are there some things we can take for granted to be true? Such as the damage potential of the Prowler which has been a set value that is easily found and used, not to mention easily observed in the game if you wanted to?

Are you serious? They have huge DPS. Some people switch to TR side just to farm with Prowler, in Cobalt we have many Prowler-only players. It's the best MBT for attacking at the moment,
they wipe Magriders instantly in 1v1 situations. I would gladly have a Prowler instead of Magrider. I have a solution: Make all tanks available to all factions just like in Planetside 1 so people can play with whatever they want.

In PS1, you could only get other empire MBTs if you hacked into one that had already been spawned.

....are we going to avoid the fact you didn't mention anything about the back? Yeah, bias is a wonderful thing. You omitted the fact that the prowler has the biggest behind of all the tanks, which sucks because damage from the real counts more than damage from the from AND sides combined!

but I must just be imagining things.

Maybe back in the good old days, but not anymore.

Here's a great indication you're wrong. We do have access to mbts from other factions. Through the escalation update, we can salvage other factions mbts. Why do very few people do it? Because the vanguard and prowler suck. And because they are the worst tanks, the devs added prowlers the most, then vanguards, and finally, they scattered 5 magriders in a near inaccessible area of the map.


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1PB-H5tSfzfsUHvPemoq7HrZNvb-lo3kB/view


I wonder why. I guess they didn't want everyone to switch to VS once they test out the best mbt there is. And of course, they threw a significant amount of prowlers in there, because it makes no difference how many there are, they are so trash few people would pull them, and few would last long if they did.

So yeah, I'm sure you're entirely honest about rather having a prowler than a mag or a vanguard, but the devs seem to disagree.

you said the prowler was 3x larger hitbox then the other tanks, now that you've been proven wrong you are nitpicking?
the size of the tanks only really matters for handling terrain any reasonably adept player will aim center mass on a tank rendering the small difference between the prowler's rear and the other tanks rear moot.

even if you presume that the small difference in rear size actually matters by any other metric prowler is anything but UP.
prowler has and still is the #1 or #2 MBT, on the other hand the vanguard has consistently been stuck in 3rd place.

there's nothing wrong with the prowler.

The front and back of the MBT's have the same size, so any argument made about the fronts of the MBT's being almost the same size also counts for the rear.

On top of that there is the question of how likely you are to be hit in the rear. If it rarely happens then it doesnt matter that much, on top of the fact that when you get attacked in the rear the size of your hitbox rarely matters as they got the element of surprise and probably got close enough to guarantee hits. On top of all that its easier to prevent getting hit in the rear if you have better options to dictate the fight. Things that help with that are having the highest acceleration, highest top speed and a solid turn capability.

Could you give a reasonable comment on other things I mentioned as well? Like the fact that the Prowler isnt actually underperforming despite how you feel about it? How can that be possible if the tank is supposedly bad? You made one attempt by saying the drivers are more skilled but the average BR levels prove that false.

Ever heard of an alt?

Since when do low BRs mean anything?

In fact, most vets don't play on TR cuz it's the least loved faction the hardest to play, since weapons suffer extreme random recoil, which can't be compensated for. So in fact it's pretty reasonable to assume the skilled players who hop on from time to time have low progression on TR.

Also, there's a reason the prowler is the most available and abundant salvageable mbt, while the few magriders available are all placed in a part of the map that's rarely ever used.

I guess wrel doesn't want any TR tankers to feel the benefits of having a decent mbt.

Also I guess you're more likely to hit the rear of a prowler, considering it's the size of a PLANET. Weird they gave the best maneuverability to the hovering tank that barely even has a rear, but I'm sure it means nothing in a game where vehicle combat is focused entirely on landing butt shots and dodging them.

So your argument is that all the people on TR are veterans because you think this is true, and the fact that the BR's don't show that is because of alts?

Well in that case I can make my own case: Vanguard users are much more skilled as anyone else, but the bad Vanguard chassis makes them barely keep up with the other two MBT's. We don't see that in the BR's because of the amount of alts they use. Which can be "proven" by the amount of new NC characters there are compared to the TR and VS which historically has been higher.
Want more proof? Look at the NC Lightning scores. The NC overall scores better with an NS vehicle like the Lightning than the other two, proving they have more skill.
Can you dispute that scenario? It's more likely than the TR players all being more skilled because there's some evidence you can twist far enough within reason to prove it through the amount of new population NC gets and the stats on NS weapons. But we can't create hard evidence for it.

You can't just make up scenario's. Where's your evidence that most vets don't play TR? And is that not the direct opposite of what you are claiming about MBT's? You can't have it both ways with TR having more vets in tanks but vets avoiding TR because it's the hardest to play (according to you).

And you say that Wrel doesn't want TR to have a decent MBT, yet it still performs decent if not the best.


As for rear shots, you already admitted you don't tank as often and it shows. Rear shots are devastating yes, but they aren't the norm. If you get shot in the rear often and repeatedly its not the fault of the Prowler chassis but the driver.

TR will always be op no matter what they do to us or how hard they nerf our weapons. Its our ideals that make us stronger than rebel scum and alien wannabe degenerates.

Long live the Republic. Strength in unity!

P.S. Merely roleplaying, not meant to offend anyone or break the rules (though I did tell the truth).

^

This I can agree with

We can actually test that hypothesis. If the TR is always OP because of your ideals and unity that you should have superior performance with NS weapons right?

https://voidwell.com/ps2/oracle?sta...,3158&startDate=2020-10-11&endDate=2020-12-05
https://voidwell.com/ps2/oracle?sta...,3158&startDate=2020-10-11&endDate=2020-12-05


Notice how the TR have a severe lack of superior performance when it comes to the NS Lightning for example. So your assumption that the TR will always be OP no matter what is wrong.

TR needs an MBT ? But what is an MBT in this game ?

Basically, a tool for those that feel a bit too challenged by the conventional infantry sniper role.

You want to sit on some hill way over there and kill all the enmies, but instead they kill you all the time ? You are easily discovered, countersniped, not getting any kills because hitting something with scope sway is way too difficult ? Then the MBT is your solution. Pretty much an exoskeleton that lets you shrug off any counterfire. Yes, you are even more visible, but it doesn't matter anymore. And your magnificent MBT main cannon can easily compensate for any aiming inabilities. Just sit on the hill and be the sniper you always wanted to be, for the low price of just 450 nanites*

*Killstreaks not guaranteed. No refunds. Avoiding aircrafts requires advanced tactix™. Enemy AP vehicles may happen. C4 fairies WILL happen. Liberal use of strength in numbers recomended - the zerg is your friend.

Idk, but in this role, the prowler excells. As long as you avoid making noob mistakes, like going after other vehicles, you're golden. Learn from the skynights - don't take any risks, just go after the targets that can't fight back instead. It's what all the cool kidz do, so don't get left out! This is not a game about vehicular combat. Apart from deployed sundies, killing vehicles is about as optional as killing construction bases, so just don't fall for that noobtrap.

Thankfully you're always right. You must be fun at parties

Oh noes a comment at my expense! The horror! If only you had done some actual research instead of throwing your extremely biased opinion around it would have saved us all this horrible exchange of words where you cut me to my soul!

The Prowler does perform very well. I played TR up to BR 35 and loved it.
As for infantry weapons they're the most accurate ones I've used (compared to VS at least, never really tried NC). I found it easier to get kills with them (accuracy + big magazines = great efficiency).
And please stop thinking Magriders are the best MBTs just because you watched some Youtube videos where a couple players show off their "skill" (sometimes just more luck than skill).

We don't negotiate with terrorists!

TR really is the ultimate LARP faction, at least we got style!
(and probably war crimes)

30-40 dps more means nothing in an Armor fight when the effective HP pool of the Prowler is significantly lower in terms vs Vanguard and Magrider, as I wrote originally, Mag rider able to strafe and boost away, gives it 'evasion' effectively multipling its HP pool, and Vanguard has a shield that lowers damage by 30-67% on top of its 1k more HP, even in a direct fight of faction "perks" Prowler doesnt beat VS or NC's, not even to at least a stale mate