[Vehicle] Harasser weapons

ESFs take 10x the skill a harasser requires and cost over 2x harasser cost, yet MBTs get to OHK ESFs, but not Harassers. Now I do think it is balanced for ESFs to be in OHK danger from MBTs because, as you state, ESFs can hover above MBTs and after about 45 seconds kill MBTs unless the MBT has help or cover. Although, as all ESF pilots know, 45 seconds of hovering is a death warrant in a battle.

Harassers are only OP because they cost so little. Change their cost to 350 and presto they are balanced. Without the cost increase, they need nerfs and imo those nerfs should be to durability instead of damage.

ESF has very steep learning curve but when you master controls and learn reverse maneuver it's much easier to fly than it seems. When you get some experience with both i don't think the skill difference is too noticeable.

Once again. Harasser can't fly, doesn't have 2 weapons, has waaay lower speed and requires 2 people.

Indeed takes weeks to learn an ESF to be even decent (meaning not crashing 1x every hour or so) and a harasser can be played reasonably well after 2 hours in the VR. You can't even learn an A2A ESF in the VR without a partner because aiming in a hover duel is vastly different than aiming A2G against a stationary target. Not to mention the RM, which is very very hard to learn, unless you read how to do it.

A harasser does not require 2 people for skilled harasser drivers why can jump seat, just like skilled Lib. pilots can do very well doing the jump seat maneuver (of course Lib. jump seat piloting is 10x harder than harasser jump seat driving).

There is no reasonable balance argument that a harasser is not too cheap. The 1 and only 1 reason to make it cheap is for new players to have an effective vehicle they can get many kills on without spending very many certs. and is very forgiving for mistakes even if the mistake is fatal.

I'd pay good money to watch a server smash type event, with god like awesome MLG ready players, where twenty Harassers take on twenty MBTs.

No L2P, no yeah but get aim, no excuses we'd see

harrassers would win, 20 halberds oneshot tanks from the front easily and on an otherwise empty server the harrassers can easily kite render ranges/sightlines

Yep the harassers would win especially as the harassers each get 2 respawns and the MBTs get zero. Of course, PS2 has no MLG players so it doesn't matter.

...if terrain is completely flat with zero cover and the MBT's don't move.

ppppppfffft one clip an mbt ahahahahhahahahahahahhahahahahhaahahhahahaaaaa

dude it cant one clip other harrasers and you want it to oneclip an mbt? pfffft

usually its 2 clips for harrasers(you cant always stay in perfect bloom(less than 10 meters) so you start missing rounds and damage and you dont always want to loose the spinup so you loose some more stray bullets sometimes so eventually you are left with 2 min clips for harrasers and 2 or 3 for mbt(unless you are in a sucide run))

the mjolnir can do it better in one clip and over a hill so........ you know id rather use the mj than the vulcan... at any scenario ive ever been to after the latest buff...... yeah...........(........)

And when you miss with the MJ, after closing the gap with the MJ against more mobile opponents...
You realize you have no ability to fire as you retreat to repair unlike the Vulcan.
Which if given the reload speed certs, couldn't give a damn about missing much.

Not to mention, you seem to forget rear-damage amplification.
Which is pretty easy against a massive vanguard.
Or when wedged under a Magrider.

Not to mention, if an MBT is being hit over a hill by an MJ, and sits there... that's some serious lack of attention.
Given the Harasser can't even see the target unless nearly over the hill, and well within firing range if visible.
Let alone when the target is a strafing MBT or a fast MBT, both easily with long-range AV weapons.
And both easily able to use rapid-fire AV weapons, added to their primary firepower at the much closer NC Harasser.

Which due to the Harasser durability, is what makes any of the Harasser weapons devastating since it's so low priced.
An MJ on a more fragile or expensive Harasser? Not as viable as the present, nor a Vulcan.

im sorry to disappoint you... i use the mj just like i use the vulcan
but i can use it in more aggressive ways to fight harrasers as i know that if i use it well ill win most of the times(even solo)
if i dont make any sudden mistakes like going 1 vs 2 or more

against mbt's - prowler is weak why? he need to hit you 6 times with armor upgrade, its not so easy to aim a fast moving harraser and if you miss one shot then you need another reload, in this time you autowin unless he's got a support gunner

how do you deal with support gunners?
vulcan - stay far and move fast in an unstable movement
halbert - easy - medium range dont go below half health - if you get to this situation just run to cover alot so he would miss alot
rest - same as no gunner

vanguard - if you are in close range without support then you are in a death run - you will die from any harrasers unless you can hit them twice(4 sec) or if they have armor then its 8 sec(close to death and yet you still have the ability)
so in that situation the harraser will most likely run for its life after getting shot once and if the vanguard has a gunner then he is in less danger as you are twice situationaly aware(very important in any tank anyway...)

btw mj and vulcan can kill from behind in one clip(the mj does this better as it can even utilize cover for its advantage)

so in conclusion harrasers are hard to deal with for all mbt's as they have the firepower of a tank and yet a weak shield
mbt's should be more defensive with support
harrasers should be more agressive as they can

an harraser can easily kill mbt's in pairs with little risk to death as it has the speed to do so unlike the mbts...

Prowler's 6 rounds..
Here's the thing about Prowlers: They fire twice, for more damage than the Vanguard's single shot.
A single miss for a prowler, isn't as problematic as a Vanguard's - which has the longest reload, and is single shot.
If the Prowler has trouble hitting a fast mobile target, imagine trying to hit the same target but further away with only 1 shot to do it, several times.

What MBT lets a hill that even allows the barrage to be behind them?
Hell, what MBT is stationary in that position, and still doesn't move?
That's situational as hell to be able to use Cover.


MBT's... defensive...
Harassers presently can basically ignore any minefield, take 2 C-4 (good luck getting that on there), rumble repairs, Boosters to grant damn excellent acceleration, and MBT level top-guns.
Firing at a Harasser with an LMG is more effective than using a Dumbfire Rocket Launcher often enough.
Add in the price of the Harasser platform vs the MBT platform costs.

Any Harasser weapon is empowered by the Harasser platform itself being insanity at a cheap price.
Not to mention, what bloody idiot sits still inside a barrage of close-range shells?
Likely the same kind of Prowler that tries to face-tank a shielded Vanguard, expecting Victory for doing less than the Vanguard.

I do not post a lot , but If the harasser is left as a "MBT W/2x the speed ,either it's weapon's or it's armor" must be adjusted.

I hate to use nerf as a term for any weapon ,but the Vulcan har. needs it ,or every faction should be able to use it

I ment every faction should be able to use it

heres another thing for a prowler - he needs to have twice the accuracy
and theres a 0.5 sec delay between the first and the 2nd shot, and a 0.5 delay before the reload so its +1 sec +3.5 sec(stock)
so to kill an harraser its 2+3.5=5.5 sec to kill an harraser without armor and 9.5 to kill an harraser with armor
sounds nice eh? nope you need to shoot and hit those 6 shots which isnt always as easy as it seems if the harraser isnt a ******* who facehugs a tank(you know what i mean)
so the average(not main) player has about 50% accuracy... this is really bad for a prowler driver(good drivers usually end it by 9.5 sec)

for the vanguard its either 0.5+4=4.5sec (2 shots) or 1+8(3 shots) and with 50% accuracy its really better than the prowler
prowler vs harraser no armor, 5.5 sec(twice more accuracy is needed)
vanguard vs harraser no armor 4.5 sec
pr vs harraser with armor, 9.5 sec(twice more accuracy is needed)
van vs harraser with armor 9 sec


of course you can say its easier for the prowler but honestly, i like the van better as a tank(my fav one) and i can push harrasers awhole lot easier as a vannie without worrying about them too much and thats more because of the lower ttk against them
because the prowler doesnt really have any defence for a out of nowhere harraser unlike the vanie which has
anyway an harraser with armor is better against prowlers and an harraser with stealth is better against the vanguard(get shot once run!)

(and yeah i feel that the harrasers get too bang for the buck than mbt's and lightnings(which in my opinion should be able to 2 or 3 shot harrasers)

with flat terrain the MBTs would win instantly cause the HRS couldn't hide anywhere to rep and a HRS thats not bouncing up and down over hills is easy to hit.
with cover and hills however it instantly becomes a fight in favor of the harrassers

Well a MAX can’t fly, has 2 completely garbage tier DPS weapons, has way waaay lower speed than a Harasser and requires your own personal Engineer to live more than 60 seconds outside of the spawn room. Yet costs 3x more than the Harasser, which can roadkill Flashes, MAXs, and infantry while taking no damage.

Harasser nanite cost should be 500.

When the Prowler has a faster reload, twice the shots, more damage if both land...
I'd say the Prowler does not need twice the accuracy: The value of each shot is halved.
A Magrider or Vanguard, has 1 shot to deal their damage: 1 shot, no second shot after the range is found.
No follow-up shot near instantly, just 1 shot.

If a Vanguard misses their single shot, they deal 0, and begin the full reload.
If a Prowler misses their first shot, they have a second shot before the reload.
Vanguard has 1 chance to deal damage, prowler has two chances: If the prowler lands both, it even deals more damage.

In order for a Vanguard to kill the Harasser, which deals less damage than the Prowler's double shot, with a longer reload time...
It has fire to & hit, with singular rounds - with no quick follow-up shots - on a rapidly moving target.

As if the logic of "More rounds, and deals more damage from it" demanded twice the accuracy...
A Sniper rifle's accuracy demands are quite slim compared to a semi-auto's.. which you should know is bull.

It's not about how-many-shots fired.
If one gun deals 100 damage, and needs 10 shots, while another gun deals 125 & needs 5 shots.
If the fire-rate of the 100 damage shots, is twice or more than the other, it ends up being in the same time frame.
Expect the 100 damage shots, each is less crucial to land, as there is enough time & rounds for follow-up shots.

The Vanguard can not afford a miss.
A Prowler can miss, and still deal half their damage: if both land, they even deal more.
This is compounded by a fast reload on the Prowler's part: More damage, less cost to a miss, and a quick recovery.

When the Prowler can miss half the shots, and have fired them in half the time..
While the Vanguard can not afford to miss that many shots, and took longer to fire them, You can't say the Prowler's double-shot is higher demanding in accuracy.

Prowler's higher top speed, the ease of having more damage & more shots to fire against a highly mobile target...
Even at 50% of the potential damage of the barrage, that's better than 0 - and is quickly reloaded.
Land both, deal more damage than any other MBT's shot before a reload.
Land one, and still have dealt severe damage -- with the advantage of having a follow-up shot if the first missed.

lord you missed the point - you need 6 shots by the prowler(with armor) and 3 shots by the vanguard(with armor)
anyway you need to have 2 reloads on both at minimum to kill an harraser
a miss on the prowler is worse than a miss on the vanguard on a small amount(by 0.5 sec)
a vanguards miss is equal to a prowler miss but the prowler has 0.5 sec to kill more
which means that you get more damage done to you in that time
so this 0.5 sec is getting worse and worse as you need to re-aim every shot or hope he doesnt start kiting you

a kite on the vanguard is dangerous to the harraser why? because exposing yourself for 1 shot is 1/3 health gone
for a prowler its 1/6 health gone
so what sounds more dangerous for you? 1/3 or 1/6?

also
you have a freaking shield as a vanguard use it!
as a prowler you cant use the deploy every time you want as its basically asking for trouble in close range(not in smooth areas)
as a vanguard you have a shield exactly for this kind of situations!

you can negate damage!
a prowler cant and a miss for a prowler without any shield can mean death! consider aiming twice for an enemy in which you need to hit twice out of them
lets consider re-aim as+0.3
prowler: 0.3X6+3.5X2+2.5(delay between shots and between shot to reload) =11.3
vanguard: 0.3X3 +4X2+1.5=10.4
a miss for both of them is really bad but for a prowler its huuuuuge(10% worse ttk with this 0.3 aim time between shots)
if a prowler cant aim properly then 1 miss is +4.0 sec, if you miss twice its +4.5 sec!(and its still 1/6 for each shot)
for a vanguard miss once its + 4 sec
and even if you miss even once on any mbt it might mean death to you(considering re-aiming).

anyway your opinion is based on a TR OP pls nerf kind of style

remember prowler - medium tank
vanguard - heavy tank

prowler - long range
vanguard - close range

dont facehug a vanguard
dont stay in the open if you see a prowler

i call bullsh*t on this - 5 kmph less is total utter bs
if you think the vanguard is slow go play as a magrider

ahhh im so slow 67 kmph(prowler 72)
sooooo slooow im a snail!

remember that running away at the speed of 5 kmph is useless
in combat you rarely get to 50 kmph(running away usually mean death if you dont do it right and those 5kmph are not gonna help you too much.........................................)

ive played as a vanguard, climbed the same hills at a prowlers, prowled my way trough prowlers and i rarely even started skiing down hill!

i can only say this: do what i did play as every tank untill you feel more than decent on both!
ive played like 40 hours straight(not even trying to play as inf in that time as a prowler) only to be able to counter vanguards in every situation(it all changed because of the mj but i dont have the time to invest in training).

6 shots by the Prowler.
Which has twice the shots of a Vanguard per magazine, and deals more damage than the Vanguard - and in less time.

Given the fact, of the matter, if you can aim: That Prowler has a buffer of shells, and more damage if you're accurate.
Vanguard, no buffer, and less damage even if you hit every round.

At a distance, Prowler has an easier time with misses.
Vanguard has an easier time at range with velocity.

I don't have a problem with TR's equipment, nor say they are OP.
They aren't preforming better with less, consistently.
They are the preferred opponent.

For a Heavy Tank, the Vanguard's lack of superior firepower with the largest cannon... is laughable.
For a Medium Tank, the Prowler's DPS is murderous.
For a Long-range tank, the prowler's lower velocity is kinda laughable (compared to Vanguard)
Since the Vanguard is longer, and slower, not to mention has a longer-reload, it's actually better suited at range due to the velocity as well, which makes the longer ranged shots a bit simpler in terms of leading the target.

Prowler is artillery yes.
However, it has the highest DPS, the ability to have a spare shot, the best damage result for the magazine, and has the highest top speed.
It's akin to saying the guy packing two shots for a double-tap is worse off than the Guy packing 1 shot for a blind accuracy test.

Prowler is the fastest MBT.
Magrider is the slowest.
Prowler literally has the top speed.

Like Jesus.
You literally had an issue with the Prowler being underpowered against a Vanguard, you had an entire thread.
You couldn't fathom winning against a Vanguard... the tank with 1 single situation it excels at.