Allied sundies deploying in allie bases

Guess the only way I'm gonna miss the in base sunderers, that they were used as spawn points next to jump pads and teleports to the Biolabs. Now it's gonna be long stroll or spawning at the Biolab airpads elevators.

The game shouldn't be balanced around cancerous zergs. It should be balanced around semi-equal numbers, and zergs should be dissuaded in other ways.

One has to compensate, that few players also have a chance against a Zerg.
If you look at the population group, you can see that 1 faction has less pop than another.
Vanu vs. NC for example.
How to Balance Zerg if only 1 faction has one Zerg and the other doesn't pop enough for the same.
One has to give something to the smaller faction and that was the Sundy near a.

While the significance of this change will undoubtedly change how the game plays out, DBC does already have a replacement mechanic in the works. As Wrel said in his 5th Anniversary video, the changes over the past year have been the groundwork for greater changes.

A number of months ago, DBG added Forward Spawn Pads, a medic deployable (replacing shield regenerator) which acts as a local spawn point. It could be placed within bases, and had a (too low) lifespan of like 3 or 4 minutes. Anybody within a few hundred meters could spawn on it, and it had proximity shield regeneration.
However, I do not feel that this viably replaces sunderers, as it fails to mimic the force multipliers of its top guns, nor its lifespan.

In all likelihood, a replacement mechanic is on the way in the form of Outfit Tech Trees, which Wrel hinted at in his Anniversary video. With such a groundbreaking mechanic for Planetside 2, I can only find one fitting phrase for Outfit Tech Trees: "Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations"

With that said, I shall allow the proverbial flying monkeys speculate away to their content.

Something I saw in another thread sparked the resolve in this manner. Its a open world game, 'why cant a sundy be deployed anywhere it can physically be allowed to?' but then with the thought of the enemy sundys cant deploy into a unowned base. I dont think it was broken, but you never know what could come from this change. Gasp I could just not play it, if it becomes ugly planetside 2.

ok.

you know those biolabs that used to be a pain in the butt to attack?
i hope you enjoyed that, because thats how it will be once again.

those jump pads and teleport rooms that attackers use to get back into the lab after a death are mostly in no deploy zones, meaning we can no longer park sunderers by them for quick reentry into the fight.
meaning much longer downtime getting back, meaning a much harder grind to take the biolab.

Mani Fortress for example,
you can no longer park your sundy at either the jump pad or the teleport room.

there are a few bases with jump pads or teleport rooms outside of the nodeploy zone,
but for most bases, they're inside the zone.


this is a huge and terrible change and i'd hope they'd change it, but i've lost faith now.
i doubt they'd change a terrible mistake that we've been warning about since they suggested it in april.

you don't remove the only viable defense tool unless a replacement is ready TODAY.
Forward Spawn isn't even on the PTS any more so we won't have a replacement for months.


what annoys me the most is that we've been warning and pleading with them not to do this SINCE APRIL.
and they went ahead and ruined the game anyway.
its lost them my subscription and i've cancelled my plan to buy a bundle,
i won't buy a pricey 12 month booster for a game that the devs seem determined to destroy.

I agree, that's why I said that some bases need to be looked at. Besides it is not THAT bad. Sure, a Sundy near jump pad is really usefull but it is not like we are deprived of this totally now. At some bases will need more creative Sundy placement, maybe a few spawn beacons in the right spot (tho 1 Infil with EMP can trash the fun). So what, we will neeed to run a bit further and if you need Sundy there it just means you are farmed anyway. Biolabs are cancer anyway and I try to avoid those meat grinders at all cost.

Again, with new implant, there will be still possibility to spawn your squad inside bases at even more weird locations and remember that a manned sundy with implant or without still works as squad spawn! They fixed that, didn't they? You just need to have one squad member in it, manning a gun, protecting your spawn. True, you will not be able to use deployment shield or stealth bubble but whatever.

We need to change our playstyle a bit. I, for one, am happy. It will open new possibilities, new game styles, people driving Sundies will get their well deserved credit. Again, take this calmly and look carefully where you CAN deploy your Sundy. You might be surprised how messed up no-deploy zones are in most bases and what unexpected places you can deploy a Sundy.

As long as they won't change no-deploy zones to big ones as we have for construction/orbital strike we will be OK (for the most part).

thats, why i don`T buy a premium Membership, i din`T buy it the last 2 years, and still don`t do it.

runn longer way is chancing gameplay? dunno i don`t feel so, i Play same style in the biolap, but just Need longer to get in :/
i don`T see any playstyle Chance, only Long way to runn

so it lengthens boring stagnant downtime,
makes bilabs that you call "cancer" far worse,
removes the lasts tool that we had to attempt to stop a zerg from washing over base after base,
and noone asked for this change, we've been warning against it for months.

this is a TERRIBLE move and you should be as mad as me about it.
they actually put effort in to ignore us and damage the game.

I'd love that, but this community is largely ****. If the game was entirely unstructured you'd see all of Connery on 1 faction, locking continent after continent with 95% pop till the game quickly died.

I've got my own ideas about easily balancing pops. Better bases and a better playerbase would be great, but we have what we have.

Balance global pop

• +15% XP for ever 1% your faction is under the max pop faction
• +2 second spawn penalty for every 1% your faction is over the minimum pop faction
• -10% nanite generation for every 1% your faction is over the minimum pop faction

Do that and you'll never see a faction with more than a 5% advantage
Similar penalties could be enacted on a local hex basis so that bringing such massive numbers against nothing would be shooting yourself in the foot, especially if you're the over-pop faction. It sucks, but I think it's come to this, as least on my server outside US primetime. I'm sick of logging on day in day out and seeing 3 zergs not fight eachother, nothing but 10:1 fights for hours.

This decision by DBG game designers will rank up there as one of the worst. Why?

1. It will create faster base caps (steam rolling zergs)
2. It will ENCOURAGE one of the worst parts of Planetside 2 (Spawn Room Camping)
3. It removes a layer of strategy (how do I get a sundy in a good defensive spot, what kind of sundy, how do I defend it, and for attackers, how do I take it out?

Given the base design (murder alley for defenders trying to get to A) this is a TERRIBLE idea. The lack of thought put into that...well not shocking.

It seems one guy didn't like that defenders could defend against bigger odds by good decision making.

Say good bye to fun base fights for single cap point bases. GOOD BYE.

BUT WE CAN CONSTRUCT OUR OWN BASES!!!!111!! Oh...ohhhh OHHHHH. Nevermind...

edit add: It also removes more actual THINKING from the game. Do defenders defend the sundy short term to keep flow of fighters to A? Or not? Do attackers hit the sundy first? Does a defender spawn in the room or on a deployed sundy...

Apparently thinking is verboten in PS2.

Hey GAIS! RUN FROM SPAWN ROOM AND BE SLAUGHTERED CAUSE META GAME. Hey GAIS! NEW NS WEAPONS!

If I was AngryJoe, I'd look at the camera, point to the Game Designer and say " YOU DONE F'D IT UP".

You don't remove a thing to replace it when the replacement doesn't exist.

"We see you need a new liver sir, we can do liver transplants! In fact, we're planning a ground breaking liver transplant concept right now! We've even white boarded it and we're planning an Agile Liver Transplant Development Team Discussion Committee that will meet thrice weekly to design Sprints and Scrums. So let's just <rip, tear> pluck your liver out... ok that's done...now let's wheel ya into the cafeteria where you can select from our Hospital Anniversary bundle price points and....well, we'll see you in nine months with that new liver that we're TOTALLY gunna do. Totally. Kthxbuhbye now."

Meanwhile....still waiting on that TR directive LMG revamp for the Butcher to complete. HAHA haha HAHA!

You're A Mean One, Mr. Grinch.

I think this is a very poorly thought-out change. Defenders have little to no advantage when both sides have to spawn from outside the no-deploy radius and walk all the way to the point. Not to mention one of my favorite things to do in the game was to find the most clever places to park a defense sundy before the zerg rolled in.

Beyond that, certain bases have been ruined completely. Since the update, every tech plant fight I've been in has been over in less than two minutes. Either the attacking force is hopelessly outnumbered and quickly fails, or the attackers have competitive pop and take the plant within a minute or so. It's basically impossible to defend the plant against a sizeable force without spawn logistics. Even if the players inside are vastly more skilled, the attackers just have to wait a few minutes until their numbers have dwindled past the point of being able to hold the plant. It's essentially an unwinnable fight. Then comes the 6 minute of spawnroom camping. Really fun "gameplay" if you ask me.

I spent few hours playing yesterday and sadly I must say that change is NOT well thought.
Sure, I have many fun and interesting fights between bases as I expected. Places where people fight inside the bases shifted A LOT (as I expected). People did find a new places to park their Sunderers (as I expected). Cloaked Sunderrers are more important now as any extra spawn is a priority and they all are kinda in the open now.

But...

Some bases are truly undefendable now even if forces are equal. No-deploy zones in current state almost always favor attackers, sad truth. Had few Amp Stations fights on Amerish and Indar and all felt easy to capture and a pain to defend.
Problem with no-deploy zones is that the center of it is usually located at the main spawn point so atackers are always in better position and defenders have a longer run to cap point.

Fights are for sure more dynamic now, there is a lot less stalemates but at the same time it is much harder to hold the territory your side owns and I've seen massive vehicle zergs inside all bases - thing which was not uncommon before but now it feels as new meta.

Am I mad? Not really but it does feel frustrating. The side which has momentum and sizable zerg can take half of the map in like 25 minutes but at the same time it loose it just as fast. Yesterday VS took almost 50% of Amerish and lost almost all of it soon after they triggered the alert.

To sum up, either bases need to be reworked (unlikely to happen soon) or no-deploy zones must be manually adjusted so they do not favor attackers.

To the few that mentioned it: Remember that placing a defensive sunderer was an option to anyone from the get go. Chassis and other upgrades help but all you needed was knowhow. Logistics specialist on the other hand is locked behind a potentially infinite cert/iso-4 investment. Although I have no doubt it will be used later to inflate the value of some other overpriced bundle...

Here's hoping that rare/exceptional implants will become rewards for appropriate directives.

i played last night too and it was awful,
the three factions were simply avoiding eachother and zerging over bases without any way for them to be stopped.

the only time a zerg was stopped was when they reached the biolab,
the entry from the vehicle pad just became a meatgrinder and they couldn't get any further.

terrible change, easily reverted, but DBG won't.

Development is too often like Govt. When something bad is put in place, instead of removing it, it is "reacted" too, and the mess just gets bigger.

Updates to a game that are just reactions to problems introduced by previous reactionary updates are not updates.

Know your game. Know its core purpose. Everything you do (and everything do NOT do) to that game must reinforce that CORE FOCUS.

Avoid scope creep.
Avoid fads.
Avoid reactionary development.
Be of one mind, not many.
Take risks, but never hide failures.
Don't build upon the bad.
Don't double down on dumb, don't get stuck on stupid.
Remember your audience.
Central planning always fails.

This change is lame. Some bases can ONLY be defended with strategically-placed sunderers.

I enjoyed putting sunderers in defensive positions and defending bases like mad.

Change this crap back.