Is C4(in its current state) good for the game?

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Scr1nRusher, Sep 12, 2016.

  1. FateJH

    22? More like 8 available to any given Heavy - their faction default, their faction AA, their faction AV, their faction special, the Annihilator, the Decimator, Swarm, and the Kraken.
    I think we can appropximate an answer to this. Let's just assume all rocket launcher AV is MBT deaths. It's an extremely naive approach but we can run with it for the moment.

    Let's say from this kind of data that the average VKPH is 7.5 for the default launchers over a 30-day period. That's 5400 each (30 x 24 x 7.5). We'll do the same for the other launchers:
    AA launchers - 3600 (x5)
    AV launchers - 5760 (x8)
    Decimator - 7020 (x9.75)
    Annihilator - 3168 (x4.4)
    Swarm - 1944 (x2.7).
    The special launchers diverge so we'll separate by faction rather than just average them:
    Striker - 4140 (x5.75)
    Phoenix - 4680 (x6.5)
    Lancer - 6120 (x8.5)
    Since the Oracle doesn't differentiate the Kraken between factions, and the weapon has less than 100 uniques an hour, I am going to exclude it from the count.

    We also need to do this with anti-vehicle grenades. While there's a little more divergence, we'll run with 410 (x0.57) each.

    We're going to willfully ignore Heavies equipped with C-4 just for convenience, mostly so we can run with the C-4 numbers from the Oracle's other chart above in my post. Discussing HAs with explosive bolts is also going to be ignored only because we might never separate the classes properly. There's also the possibility of kills being allocated by shooting explosives, which means we'd have to tally for each weapon the HA has access. It doesn't feel like it's worth going out on that limb in this case.

    So, adding up our numbers, taking C-4 from the chart and all the HA numbers above:
    TR, C-4 vs HA: 24563 < 31442, difference of 6879 in favor of HA
    NC, C-4 vs HA: 26882 < 31982, difference of 5100 in favor of HA
    VS, C-4 vs HA: 30931 < 33422, difference of 2491 in favor of HA
    It looks decent until we remember that we're perfoming very naive approximations in favor of the HA. In fact, if we look at the Oracle's previous chart we should note that the remaining seven rocket launchers and the AV grenades all have to fall below a certain MBTPU threshold - for the TR, that's 3210; for the NC, that's 2502; for the VS, that's 2371 - and our numbers outshine that upper limit in a variety of places. It wouldn't be unrealistic to say that our numbers are at least twice as naive as they should be. For fairness, let's give them only 75% naivete (75% of the HA number).
    TR, C-4 vs HA: 24563 > 23581, difference of 981 in favor of C-4
    NC, C-4 vs HA: 26882 > 23986, difference of 2896 in favor of C-4
    VS, C-4 vs HA: 30931 > 25066, difference of 5865 in favor of C-4
    Either way, our assumptions collide. It's not possible for an HA to kill more MBTs with his launchers (and his grenades), let alone significantly more, than everyone else with C-4.

    For the record of interpretation, I do think these numbers are good for the Heavy Assault's anti-Vehicular career in general; but, I don't think they look good for any component of his unique arsenal.
    • Up x 1
  2. Demigan

    It says "Other all", not "other". Besides if it was one thing it would be at the top rather than the bottom.

    I still don't know how Oracle of Death determines burning deaths.
  3. VastlyBlank

    I realize what it says but it is patently obvious that 40% "all other" is ridiculously high and casts serious doubt on the other numbers. What else apart from burning or perhaps the odd debris kill could be included?
  4. Demigan

    Various rocketlaunchers, just about all Lightning weapons, some of the secondary weapons like the Basilisks, Various aircraft weapons such as each individual Drake option on the Galaxy, Tank Busters, various belly canons for the Liberator, canons on the Valkyrie, ESF noseguns (they still get a few), ESF secondary weapons such as Rocketpods, Hornets (only the VS was shown in all-factions tab) and even Coyote's, Flash Basiliks&fury, Sunderer secondary weapons, AV grenades, all variations of MAX AV weapons, All Harasser secondaries... That's a lot of weapons that do get kills, some not much, some more, but combine all of them together and you can get to that 40%.
  5. LT_Latency

    Sigh, 4 years later and your still trying to get C4 nerfed.

    I don't think anyone is listening.
  6. travbrad


    I think they should get rid of indicators on grenades too actually, get rid of blinking lights on proxy mines/bouncing betties, and even remove spotting (or at least greatly reduce how often you can spam it). You should have situational awareness in a shooter IMO, not rely on the UI to save you.

    The only thing I don't like about the way c4 currently works is the ability to put it on cloaky flashes which is just pure cheese. I haven't actually seen that tactic used very often though.
  7. Scr1nRusher



    "My head is in the sand"
  8. Scr1nRusher


    Not "nerfed", just balanced to figure out what its role is supposed to be & which classes truely deserve to have it.
    • Up x 1
  9. CMDante

    Something killed me so it must be OP: The thread

    How dare those filthy infantry peasants expect to have some form of hard counter to the glorious tankers that wisely park for minutes at a time to farm or funnel through chokepoints.

    It is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE that infantry are a threat to tankers under ANY circumstances.
  10. Scr1nRusher

    I'm still amazed about these responses.