What does an excellent ESF pilot fear?

that might be worth the ban

Sweet mother of god, call DBG, I want my money spent on reaver cosmetics back, I quit if this is implemented

There is a reason Reaver does well in A2A with Vortek and AH: it can dictate range to enemy ESFs.

Reaver for all practical purposes is the fastest ESF on level flight. Scythe is the slowest on level flight. This is why Scythe Gank Squads often used A2AM and Reaver Gank Squads often used Vortek + Fuel Tank. (oddly, Scythe can reach the highest top speed in dives)

I've run the tests a number of times in VR over the years. Not really interested in running them again now (especially since I can't log in past LaunchPad most the time), but when I ran them a year ago (4/5/15, much more recent than that link) here is what I got for level top speeds:


w + space
==============
Scythe w/ Racer 3: 263
Scythe w/ Hover 3: 230
Scythe (stock): 226
Scythe w/ Dogfighting 3: 224
----------
Mosquito w/ Racer 3: 281
Mosquito w/ Hover 3: 250
Mosquito (stock): 246
Mosquito w/ Dogfighting 3: 241
----------
Reaver w/ Racer 3: 262
Reaver w/ Hover 3: 218
Reaver (stock): 216
Reaver w/ Dogfighting 3: 214


w + space + upside down
==============
Scythe w/ Racer 3: 266
Scythe w/ Hover 3: 232
Scythe (stock): 228
Scythe w/ Dogfighting 3: 225
----------
Mosquito w/ Racer 3: 284
Mosquito w/ Hover 3: 251
Mosquito (stock): 248
Mosquito w/ Dogfighting 3: 244
----------
Reaver w/ Racer 3: 264
Reaver w/ Hover 3: 222
Reaver (stock): 220
Reaver w/ Dogfighting 3: 217


w + space + afterburner
==============
Scythe w/ Racer 3: 352
Scythe w/ Hover 3: 330
Scythe (stock): 328
Scythe w/ Dogfighting 3: 326
----------
Mosquito w/ Racer 3: 353
Mosquito w/ Hover 3: 332
Mosquito (stock): 329
Mosquito w/ Dogfighting 3: 326
----------
Reaver w/ Racer 3: 369
Reaver w/ Hover 3: 355
Reaver (stock): 354
Reaver w/ Dogfighting 3: 352


w + space + upside down + afterburner
==============
Scythe w/ Racer 3: 361
Scythe w/ Hover 3: 339
Scythe (stock): 337
Scythe w/ Dogfighting 3: 334
----------
Mosquito w/ Racer 3: 357
Mosquito w/ Hover 3: 336
Mosquito (stock): 333
Mosquito w/ Dogfighting 3: 329
----------
Reaver w/ Racer 3: 373
Reaver w/ Hover 3: 359
Reaver (stock): 358
Reaver w/ Dogfighting 3: 355

And yes, ESFs fly faster upside down. They have as long as I've tested them, which has been years. Definitely something I wish Devs would have fixed a long time ago: a plane that performs better upside down is silly. The top speed position of a Lib is even more dumb, completely un-aerodynamic.

1.: The Reaver does not well in A2A, it's inferior in every fair 1vs1 DF against Mosy or Scythe.
2.: Your numbers about the ESFs topspeeds are right. With external AB you can use them for 7 seconds and it takes 16 seconds until they are full again. If you now look at the topspeed numbers, you'll understand that a Reaver has no chance to keep up with a Mosquito's speed if they are using the same loadout. Not in a race that is longer than a few seconds.

that's okay i had a 8 swarm locks on me once while flying a valk i think it got up to 9.

Most ESF A2A fights are not "fair 1vs1". I don't know what "DF" means.

Vortek and AH put up good A2A numbers relative to their Faction equivalents.
http://ps2oraclestats.com/monthlystats/

If you fly Mosquito, you know Vortek and AH ESF (with decent aim) can keep up with you until you are dead.

AA Turrets and lock-on weapons from other ESFs. Other than that, lock-on rocket launchers held by HAs can be annoying, but unless there's more than one firing at you, a good pilot will just laugh it off.

LOL on Wolfenstein ET, the game i played earlier a lot, they had this crazy mortars, which shot Santa claus bullets ^^ Might be something for DBG to think about for next christmas

- Even if most fights are not "fair", the results of the fair fights show that the Reaver is the worst A2A ESF.
- DF=DogFight(s)
- AH was changed. It is impossible to use for A2A these days.
- Vortek is very strong... - against bad pilots. A good pilot (that you can't surprise/jump) won't have problems fighting a Rotary Reaver.
- I fly all 3 ESFs. I know that the Reaver has the strongest afterburners.

My point was and still is: A Mosquito easily wins a race against a Reaver.
So: How can people call the Reaver the fastest ESF?
STAHP dat please, there are people around that do believe in this misinformation. Even worse: they spread that schmock as if it was true.

Dual burster can occasionally drive a few pilots off, but not if you're exposed outside of the shields. Also, lock ons are categorically ineffective as air killers- it takes 3 to kill one and with stealth that makes the time to kill in excess of 30 seconds. Further, if they have flares, it's approaching 40 seconds under the most ideal circumstances.

I am a mediocre to novice ESF pilot: I honestly don't fear anything except dalton gunners with high ping- they seem able to fire shells 50-200m behind my ESF and one shot me. Which they just need to nerf Dalton (An AT cannon), down to Vanguard fire rate (Since it has similar damage per shot and resistance values), and it's MV needs to be more like the Bulldog on the Sunderer, then it might be balanced.

... and rightfully so. It was ridicolous that a AI weapon was that effective against other ESF`s too. If you run in a Light-PPA scythe you will still comfortably win though. Don`t know how the Banshee fairs in A2A battle, maybe somebody is able to enlighten me there.

Are you proposing we nerf the Reaver in some areas and buff it in others? Maybe nerf it by reducing the TTK on the Vortek and also reduce the Afterburner Top Speed, and buff it by making the front profile smaller?

Or maybe we just add a new "A2A Duel" Certline/Loadout for each ESF, that nerfs their performance for things like A2G and A2A vs. non-ESFs, but makes them all equivalent (and the best builds at) 1-on-1 A2A duels?

Cool, thx.

I tried it out in VR and in-game. It felt much worse... but I can still kill weaker pilots with it. And I was still killed by a better pilot with it. This is one of the major flaws with ESFs: skill > appropriateness of Loadout (except for maybe LPPA) in 1-on-1 ESF duels.

I hear top pilots complain about the power level of the new Coyote. But when I run Coyote, I have yet to lose to a weaker pilot running Coyote in even 1-on-1, and I have yet to beat a better pilot when they run Coyote in even 1-on-1. Skill still prevails for me every time.

But I can appreciate that AH is not as effective as it was vs. comparably skilled pilots. (though I can still kill better with it than I can with the LPPA)

Cool. Do you notice a great ability to get away from CQC ESF fights against comparably skilled Reavers in your Mosquito?

What kind of race are you talking about?

If you're talking about getting to a mid-Map Cap Point from Warpgate at the start of a Server Smash. Sure, Mossie wins.

But if you're talking about what ESF is best at outrunning a G2A Lock attack (with ESF Loadout for speed): Reaver. If you're talking about which ESF can rushdown an ESF fleeing from CQC: Reaver. Yes, these are all just sprints, but it's in these types of situations where it's the sprint speed that determines the outcome.

If I'm in a Racer Mossie and I lose a Scythe in the Southeast Indar canyons, I can pick a direction and use that break to get some distance they can't catch even if they spot me fairly soon after. But if it's a Reaver, they have the sprint speed to get right back on me and force me to engage them or get picked apart as I try to run.

The Reaver's sprint speed is a game changer in terms of being able to control the ranges of an engagement. It's why the Reaver can use the Vortek or AH as A2A. Put an AH on a Scythe and I'll just outrun it.

If you don't believe the Reaver is the fastest sprint ESF, I can't help you (because we disagree on that). BUT, if you are volunteering to nerf the Reaver After Burner Speed in favor or a high non-After Burner Top Speed, I can get behind that. ~+20 on the non-After Burner speed, and ~-16 on the After Burner Speed (make it same as Mossie). You think that's a Reaver buff. I don't, but I kinda like it for balance purposes. So, let's both of us advocate that change: nerf Reaver After Burner Top Speed, and buff Reaver non-After Burner Top Speed. This is a win-win change for you and me. Are you on board?

Each ESF has its pros and cons. I agree that some of those pros and cons only apply to some players (some pros might be good for low skill pilots but meaningless for high skill pilots; some cons might be bad for high skill pilots but meaningless for low skill pilots). But I am down for reducing the "ES" factors that frustrate pilots, the ones that make the ESFs not comparable performance-wise on key areas.