What do you all think of the Tank Mine changes?

The OP is pretty spot-on from my experience. I think i was killed by tank mines as infantry more times yesterday than I've ever been killed, total, by them before. To the people saying that engineers won't throw them into groups of people for easy kills, i can assure you: they will. It happened all day yesterday, across many different battles and continents.
I personally see no reason why tank mines should have infantry-lethal splash damage in the first place. They should destroy the thing that activated them, like a real AT mine.
As if the explosive spam wasn't bad enough in this game already. My god.

Aaaand that's different how? What's the difference between this and suicide rushing a bunch of people with AI mines in hand, with a knife out, with a sticky grenade stuck to your back, etc, etc? The damage type kills MAXes faster, but that's about it.

From the MAX perspective, I've had a case where an engineer bumrushed me with this and my double AI guns couldn't kill them in time, but that's much more likely a problem with my positioning, hit detection / latency issues and/or TR MAX AI being crappy at their job. Sure, the mine detonated (from my point of view, at least) before it hit the ground, but it doesn't make it any different from any other case of instant death in this game.

In my opinion tank mines should not be tossed in the first place, but installed just like anti-infantry mines. That would prevent such kind of BS and cheesy solo Sunderer kills.

If I find myself in a situation where I'm in a room full of (friendly) MAXes and I'm rubbing shoulders with a group of people, I redeploy and find a new fight.

Adding yet another method of abusing PS2's inherent inability to handle large quantities of players within its bases is going to make me mash that redeploy button faster.

Which, in other words, mean that Tank Mines are now more useful than they were, more versatile. I say they should receive a slight increase in Resource cost. They are too big and visible to receive a straight nerf.

The idea of just rushing a group of maxes and others and blowing them all up does not work, for one if so many maxes are in such a tight spot they could shot you up in fractions of a second.

Explosive spamming is fun, a real tatic for farming kills and directives is to get a engi with grenade bandola and throwing grenades into a crouds of people, often get at least a kill if not more with each nade 4- nades awesome.

Though to do it, I throw and run, poping in and out of cover or behind a corner minimizing the amount of time they can respond if I don't I am shot dead before I can throw one let alone 4.

I didn't ask for a nerf, I asked for a buff to proxy mines and a return to the old tank mines, that are designed for, you know, tanks. Tank mines shouldn't be used as CQC bombs, they are made as vehicle traps. I've seen more bunny hopping, tank mine throwing, suicide dudes in the past week then ever before and I'm just not all that jazzed about that new introduction.

I've been farming grenade kills for years my friend, I'm not talking about that. This thread is pointing out that you can run into a room full of people, drop tank mines and rack up kills. You may not believe it's possible, but the deploy time is so fast on tank mines that it's actually a lot easier to do than people have given it credit for in this thread. I've rack up ~200 kills in the last few days with tank mines, where over the past 2 years I had about 600. I just see it as another spammy explosive cheese weapon, that should have never been changed when you consider their name and the abundance of other cheesy explosive weapons we already have. These simply do not have a place indoors.

it's crazy how many people have shot down my thread. I've seen it none stop, I've done it myself a fair number of times, and a lot of people in my outfit have been talking about it as well.

I think it comes down to the overall anger that most people have towards maxes. People are so antimax that any change made to weaken them or make them easier to kill is embraced regardless of the collateral damage(in this case CqC nukes that kill much more than maxes)

I say we just make the mines behave like they behave for all other valid targets - they need 4s to arm before they go off automatically due to the presence of enemies (Infantry for anti-personnel, Vehicles for anti-Tank).

Please explain how you're comparing two very different mechanics and thinking they are the same to validate what is a really bad ... bad post.

Tank Mines now GREATLY trump C4 via the following:

• No "Throw and detonate delay"
• Can carry up to 5 of them
• Instant detonation on MAX proximity
• Cost Less than C4

• FLAK Currently does not mitigate damage correctly (should have ... but currently seems pointless/ineffective)

...so now that engineer knows where they are and where they are looking ... so just "tosses" them over a fence/sidewall/in a door ... all of which EoD hud would do nothing for .... thats a broken .. fallacy of an argument.

Troll posting aside (anyone posting just pictures or generally being annoying) ... its currently broken in regards to balance.... unfortunately in the favour of the noisy forum/reddit posters.
As such the devs are in a hard place .. and I'm sure they will fix up the known issues.

This would be both sensible and level headed ... it would also put C4 back in the position of "active" explosive role ... rather than just tossing tank mines.

Overall .. not a huge fan of the mechanics behind Tank Mines (preventing or at best making less appealing) pushing and instead inspiring more "farmer" play.

But with some fixes and tweaks it'll work.

OP has a point. Unlike C4 which can be countered by killing the guy who dropped it before he sets it off -- once the AT mine is out boom.

C4 and AT mines vs maxes are not at all equivalent.

More to the point in large battles you aint killing that suicide engy before he drops it anyway. It's called lag.

I am cool with AT mines killing maxes. I think the radius needs to be changed to slightly larger than the mine itself so that only the unit that stepped on it takes the damage.

This isn't a balance suggestion. It is an oversight notation.

It looks like the majority of the posters here have completely missed the point.

Tank mines are fine against MAXes. However, they are now being used as extra cheesy infantry farm tools, something they were incapable of prior to this patch.

It's odd to see the same people defend the anti-infantry efficiency of the tank mine when they have been very quick to advocate nerfs for:

- OHK Rocket Primaries
- ESF A2G farming
- HE Tank farming
- Proxy/Betty cheese
- Sticky Grenades

Show some integrity in your arguments. If it applies to the above items, it should apply to tank mines as well.

Simple solution - dial down the splash damage of tank mines against infantry and/or increase the resistance provided by infantry flak armour. Their ability to gib MAXes will be maintained while removing the ability (and more importantly the incentive) to farm infantry.

Now time for some education:

- The empire specific rocket launchers were designed to do very poorly against infantry. The Phoenix Launcher, as a OHK infantry killer outlier, was promptly nerfed in record time to emphasize the fact that they are AV weapons and being used as AI tools is outside their intended usage role.

- A large deal of hate towards Raven MAXes comes from their proficiency at AI work, not only because it gives NC MAXes an AI option at range, but because it is also outside the bounds of their intended role as AV weapons. Complaints about Pounders in CQC against infantry come from similar reasoning.

- The Heavy Assault AV grenade does much less damage against infantry than their AI frag counterparts, especially when wearing flak armour, but does devastating damage to MAXes and respectable damage to lightly armoured vehicles. People accept this as AV grenades have a clearly defined role, much like the tank mine.

Both the game and the community have made it clear that AV weapons should primarily serve in an AV role with only limited infantry farming applications. There is no reason for tank mines to deviate from these expectations.

Shotgun and sniper rifle are two very different mechanic. Tanks mines and C4 in this context are pretty much the same thing, the only difference is detonation, which isn't superior or inferior, just different.

My point is - his problem is with Tank Mines used in cheesy suicide tactics, when it's been possible to use C4 the same way all this time.

I find them good. Tank mines always seemed a bit too useless to me compared to person mines and c4.

OP did you know that you can use EOD HUD implant on your MAX unit?
I'm using it (EOD HUD II, its range is enough for infantry) right from the momen when implants were added on all MAX loadouts on all chars. Combined with FLAK armor it makes 98% of C4 fairies tries pretty useles. Now, with tank mines hit MAXes, it's absolutely a must for AI MAX in biolab etc.

Oh f**k it's so simple.

MAX problem:
- Explosives
Solution:
- EOD HUD
- FLAK armor

HE tank problem:
- Upset farmed bads coming to punish you with C4
Solution:
- Proximity Radar
- EOD HUD (a must for a tank driver anyway)

Yep, I know that some people just don't use their brains and don't want to L2P, they prefer whining. Nothing new here.

P.S. In before I'm suggesting unbrave/noobish/unskill loadouts

In practice Im not that good and most maxes I come across are not that easy to kill at least not in PS4. In PS4 they are often pampered by Engys. I know I know there is that Max who gets no love, who will share his sad story in this thread. QQ. Mostly Maxes get A LOT of love from what I see. In short tough to run up and kill that mofo in a jihadi suicide run holding a mine.

Far easier using mines as intended to feast off of Sundys and Lightenings; the return on investment from that is amazing.

That is not entirely true, take for example the Swedish tankmines (FFV 028) wich is pretty much just 5,5 kg of high explosives designed to take out tanks with just pure explosive power... (by killing occupants by shockwaves) So let VS have Swedish-type-roomclearing-tankmines... (and whatever faction you belong to can have the small wimpy directed kind...) (we launched a WW beetle about 200 feet into the air with one of those suckers for fun when i was in the army, the engine however was never found!)

seems like it was well deserved.

I'll admit that I'm not familiar with the FFV 028, but a quick search on wikipedia suggests that it too relies on the same principle as other AT mines do to penetrate tank armor. Sure it might have a good amount of explosive force, but explosive force alone doesn't usually affect people in a tank so much. You really have to penetrate armor to do damage (the other option would be to do what HESH does, but that involves plastering the tank with explosives).

Well, to some degree yes but also "generates substantial secondary blast and fragmentation effects." it is also used for other demolition-jobs as it contains almost 6kg of high explosives and VERY effectivly clears out a a room i.e if used as a booby trap device...