I have seen the comparison to this 2 in many threads and today i decided to look at their stats. There are minor diferences in accuract and recoil, but nothing big. Other wise they r the same weapon which trades 0.75% ADS for SPA. While both SPA and 0.75 has its advatages (SPA boosting your optimal dmg range vs higher mobility for more dodging 0.75% ADS), consider this. MSWR has ALS as option, hipfire is 100% speed , 100%>75%. I`m creating this thread because every TR recently start to complain they lack of good LMG's but in same time they have copy paste of "the best LMG" in the game.
While I'll agree with the sentiment that the MSW-R is a good weapon, you can't seriously be comparing a hipfired MSW-R mobility, with an ADS Orion .75 modifier, even with the ALS, hipfiring an MSW-R much beyond melee range is all but suicidal. You hipfire with a LMG when you are desperate, otherwise ADS all the time.
The CARV, CARV-S, and TMG-50 are all great LMGs with good clip sizes, pretty good rates of fire, and the recoils aren't that harsh. Getting to the Butcher is far easier than the Battlegoose, because past the Orion and SVA-88, the options get pretty niche if not lackluster.
.75 ADS only matters on the Orion. The NS-15ms can be used by everybody, so their .75 ADS doesn't count. CURSE THOSE HANDSOME VS DEVILS!
Well I'm taking a break from face palming so I can reply to this ehm..... yeah idk what to call it even. Even with ALS your hip fire with any LMG is too inaccurate to be used effectively outside of spitting distance. If this thread was created before the big "hip fire nerf - patch" that they launched well over a year ago you might have had some sort of a point.
Well lets be fair here, the NS-15 is a nice gun but dps wise it's not going to compare to the Orion or even the SVA-88.
Laser Orion VS Adv. Laser MSWR comparison. The difference is tiny. IIRC at full resolution on this comparison at 1920x1080 it was a single pixel or two.
The MSR-W has actually a bit better accuracy in exchange for not having 0.75 ADS. 0.35 moving ADS COF vs 0.4 moving ADS COF. 0.35 vertical recoil vs 0.4 vertical recoil. 0.55 horizontal tolerance vs 0.9 horizontal tolerance in addition to having a direction bias. Also, the MSW-R has access to the best attachment in the game with SPA. Also, ROFL if anyone actually hip-fires with an LMG after they nerfed that into the ground.
SPA best attackement? It's highly situational and unoticed most of time. I higly prefer highly be able to "dodge" 1-2 bullet per opponents that be able to need 1 less bullet to kill between 10 and 15m. You also forget 0.225/0.225 horizontal recoil for MSW-R vs 0.2/0.225 To resume: MSW-R pros: -a bit better vertical recoil -a bit faster reload -a bit better ads moving COFs -better horizontal tolerance -SPA Orion pros: -a bit better horizotal recoil -no recoil bias -Lower FSM -Decent hipfiring COF without needing laser sight -0.75 ads move mult MSW-R edge: -barely better at hipfiring when equipped with ALS/LS thanks to a bit faster reload and highly situational SPA. -(bads) people that can't handle vertical recoil Orion: everything else witch is 95% of heavies.
Ok then lew screw hipfire, still mswr can compete with orion. TR must stip complain they dont have good LMGs
The main problem is that MSW-R have a very low skill ceiling. (like too much TR weapons that have or an Low TTK-low accuracy and long TTK-high accuracy with othing in the middle). Both Orion and Anchor have comparatively a much higher skill ceiling, by higher overall accuracy, Orion 0.75ads.m.m. and Anchor HeadShots TTK. Certainly the main reason that TR are the least selected faction in competitive infantry plays (serversmashes/Planetside battles ect...)
Ori and MSW are close ranged with mid range capabilities. If use it right (in rooms) means alway close range you always get SPA benefit. Also in close ranges is a lot harder to miss. Use your weps in their effective ranges!
Mobility is king. ADADADAD is king. The faster you can ADADADA the less damage you take, the higher your K/D. This is proven by the fact the two 0.75% ADS LMGs have the highest and lowest DPS respectively BUT have higher K/D. The NS-15M2 has the lowest DPS but second highest (after the Orion which has the highest equal somehow!) K/D. Source: dasanfall stats
Yes, SPA is the best attachment in the game which is why the Flare (that has SPA) that has worse accuracy stats is performing better than the TMG-50. Yeah I did, but the max is identical so w/e. The rest I'll just add my response in red.
hipfire don't mean that much on a light machine gun. It's not meant to be a CQC weapon. Would you rather hipfiring within 10m ? when LMG is about ADS.
I have Orion and MSW-R auraxiumed. Fun Facts: The KD on my mswr is 0,2 higher than on the orion. Not sure how much this is saying though because I auraxed the orion earlier and didnt really used it since then. Also: Now I know where this f shield comes from.
“To resume: MSW-R pros: -a bit better vertical recoil 12% advantage is pretty big, and it is noticeable Even if it would be 30%, verical recoil is easy to compensate -a bit faster reload Didn't include this either, but it has that advantage as well -a bit better ads moving COFs This is actually a pretty big difference in stats when it comes to ADS accuracy y Not that big, really, not even sure that VS noticed when it have been removed from Orion since i did't saw any QQ posts here. -better horizontal tolerance Again, this is actually a huge bonus when it comes to accuracy a decent at max -SPA Ask any MLG player in the game and they will tell you that SPA is the best attachment it's certainly the best ammo attachements, but all are such small and FG/AFG, LS/ALS, extended mags are just way more powerful that 1 BTK less between 10 and 15m. Orion pros: -a bit better horizotal recoil Better minimum horizontal recoil, equal max horizontal recoil which makes it harder to control You control horizotal recoil?? congrats if you can predict 12.5 times per second and adjust you aim to compensate it. -no recoil bias Again, this makes the weapon harder to control as the recoil moves rabidly from side to side instead of favoring one direction lol you still think that bias makes weapons more controllable and post in a balance thread?? Bias just makes it harder to compensate than just pulling mouse down. -Lower FSM 0.25 difference. First shot total recoil for the Orion is 0.9, 0.875 for the MSW-R, this is not a pro for the Orion What ?i thougt that high FSM made all VS weapons terrible but ot TR/NC ones?? -Decent hipfiring COF without needing laser sight Again, ROFL if you hipfire an LMG now then no problem to nerf Orion hipfire one? Personally, i have somethig like 10-15% of my LMG kills on hipfire. -0.75 ads move mult Yes, the defining characteristic of the Orion and why it has horrible accuracy recoil stats. not much worse than MSW-R MSW-R edge: -barely better at hipfiring when equipped with ALS/LS thanks to a bit faster reload and highly situational SPA. SPA is never situational, ever. No one should be hip firing with an LMG, ever. SPA is only an advantage between 10&10m. Orion+LS/MSW-R+ALS/Anchor+ALS are just as accurate than ARs stock hipfire. Not great to kill stups past 15m but still useful in Oh sh** moments. -(bads) people that can't handle vertical recoil And also it means it's easier to get the vertical recoil compensation memorized Vertical isn't hard to memorize and compensate for any weapons, the only weapons that have strong vertical recoil have comp wich makes it manageable. -(good players) people that know how to use horizontal bias recoil to their advantage Lol no, they can't that Forusmside myth, mexbe if they can 1)anticipate recoil at each butllet 2)compensate for it. Good luck with that considerin MSW-R shoots 12.5 bullet/sec -Faster reload speed small but OK -Directional horizontal bias which you can actually learn to correct instead of no bias which is impossible to correct third time you pull that false argument. Funy. -Better ADS movement COF, you move slower with the MSW-R but are much more accurate All MSW-R accuracy advantages are nullified by higher horizotal recoil Orion: everything else witch is 95% of heavies. LMG's are some of the most inaccurate weapons in the game which is why very accurate ones like the Anchor, NS-15, and MSW-R perform so well I never found LMGs that inaccurtae, and between all LMGs, MSW-R is far from bein the accurates one. ” Also from Dasanfall: http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/80 http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/7254 What?? Orion more accurate than MSW-R? Ah i forget that all VS players are MLG ready since BR1.
This. ADAD makes up for any of the Orion's cons. No point in comparing anything else. In competitive play, that 0.75 ADS M.M. is all that matters because of effect on hit detection.
