[Suggestion] VS Lancer Balancing & Changes

Hi all,

In comparison with the ESRLs, the Lancer stand out being the weakest (in my opinion) launcher of them all. Taking out infantry and vehicles with the Lancer is a real pain, here's what I mean:

It takes a WHOLE magazine fully charged to kill an infantry, the charging is too long and gives the enemy too much time to flee. It takes a LOT of magazines to destroy a vehicle, even more than an S1!

So here is how I'm going to try to "fix it"

Max Damage charge level 1 = Increased to 200 from 150 and retains this damage until it hits the 400m mark
Max Damage charge level 2 = Increased to 500 from 375 and retains this damage until it hits the 500m mark
Max Damage charge level 3 = Increased to 1000 from 750 and retains this damage until it hits the 500m mark

Projectile Velocity charge level 1 = Decreased to 400 m/s from 600 m/s
Projectile Velocity charge level 2 = Decreased to 467 m/s from 700 m/s
Projectile Velocity charge level 3 = Decreased to 533 m/s from 800 m/s


I personally think this will balance the weapon; what do you all think? Is there anything here I should change? Please discuss below.

Uhh I need some feedback >.<

stuff that just sounds solid never gets alot of feedback, after all your suggestion already sounds pretty good on paper, so there is not much to add

Oh I see.

Well lets hope that the devs will see this and rectify it into the game! ^_^

I think in general long-range AT weapons are getting a bit of a nerf. The NC's Ravens, for example, are getting a range reduction. They're doing something with the Vortex which isn't very clear (upping damage but also I'd assume upping vehicle resistance to the Vortex), so likely whatever happens to the Vortex might happen to the Lancer.

Right now the Lancer is the premier extreme-range AT option, while the NC and TR ESRL options really don't have that long-range capability. The NC's Phoenix is limited to a 300m range (often more around 250m or so), while the TR's Striker works best at closer range where the CoF won't penalize DPS (sort of like the current Magrider Saron).

So really I would say... you might actually expect nerfs instead of buffs at this point. Last we heard either tanks were getting an across-the-board buff to survivability (which would be an indirect nerf to AT weapons) or they were going to tone down the AT weapons themselves.

Of course, this is to make up for the plethora of vehicle nerfs since the August 5 patch, so there you go.

Well I kind of hoping that the Lancer does not get nerfed as in its current state it is weak. Whilst yes it can hit vehicles at an insane distance the charging up time gives enemies too much fleeing time. The sole reason to why I present this buff/ nerf is to make the weapon more effective at close quarters whilst sacrificing its extreme range; but to keep its unique trait the weapon is still capable of hitting targets at long range, but not in extreme range.

As you stated, it seems like the devs are reducing Launcher range in exchange for damage. I do hope that the devs will pick this suggestion up though as I don't want them to buff/nerf/balance the Lancer in the wrong direction.

I personally think Lancer is ok. Yes charge time is quite long, and its damage (even charged) is quite low, but it is very good at scaling and you should note that it is situational weapon. It probably could use a small buff, like mag size, but in any case its performance is good enough.

No

The lancer is fine as is until the devs mess around with MBT survivability. It seems your main problem with it is that it overall feels like a weak weapon to you.
The stats you suggest literally turn it into an anti-everything (AE) sniper cannon, with the fastest AV projectile speed. The striker is a waste of time for anyone trying to use it as an AI weapon, and the phoenix does not one-shot infantry either. RLs in general are not meant to be used as AI weapons, so they are much less efficient at AI work compared to conventional light arms.
The only thing your suggestions will accomplish is turning half the VS population into heavy snipers for outside fights and practically kill the game for NC and TR players.

The lancer's selling point is precision and range, in exchange for alpha damage. But with that alone, the lancer already fills a very unique niche with its ability to engage almost any target. Can you take out a moving MBT at 200m+ with your default RL, let alone hit the target?
Imagine using an annihilator. If the target deploys flares or a smoke screen, moves out of range, etc. then you've wasted your shot/opportunity and your dps is 0. Likewise if you miss with a dumbfire at that range, if you can aim it. But with the lancer, the potential and rewards are comparatively much higher in that there are far more opportunities to engage/damage the target.

With any rocket launcher, it's going to be rare to kill a mobile heavy-armored vehicle as a solo heavy anyway, unless the driver/pilot overextends or is too greedy, inexperienced, etc.

Or it retains those values to 300m and then make it suffer a huge dmg drop off .. To bring it's effective range inline with other AV weapons and their changes ...

Why you want to make lancer less lancery? Lancer is good. II can agree with raising infantrt damage.

Very well said and constructed comment there.

Actually you kind of changed my opinion on the proposed balancing that I made, one of the reasons to why I made this post is to make the weapon more effective in close quarters. This allows me to achieve directive the Launcher directives easily as my current goal is the Kraken.

I am having a difficult time getting kills with this weapon and as you said I might not be actually using this weapon in a situation where the Lancer actually shines at, i.e long range anti tank sniping.

Maybe a good "buff" for this weapon is to reduce the charge up time? And as I mentioned before the charge up time is too long and gives the enemy more than enough time to flee.

As long as it is hitting things beyond render distance it doesn't deserve a single buff, sorry.

You can do what you want with it when you can't exploit invulnerability/invisibility while using the weapon to snipe vehicles.

Um, as a VS main player, the Lancer is the best ESRL.

• Sure it sucks against infantry, but so do the others.
• You are confusing DPS on a stationary target with actual DPS. Because a dumbfire launcher or lock on launcher will miss more often, the Lancer will actually have a very competitive DPS beyond short range (where you shouldn't be using it)
• It is an amazing anti MAX sniper rifle, one 3 charge hit does nearly 50% damage. Very therapeutic against Raven MAXes.
• Hover podders don't know what hit them. if an ESF loses nearly half its HP in one go, it can make it much harder for it to escape.
• On the subject of air, with practice you can hit aircraft, especially larger ones, at surprising distances.
• With the upcoming Raven nerf (to follow the AV turret nerfs), it is now the undisputed king of long range AV. With just half a squad of players coordinating dropped from a Valk up on a high spot you can clear out Vehicles.
• The Lancer, with 2 full charges per magazine can have huge damage for your ammo pool, especially if you use munitions pouch, I usually use Flak armour when doing AV work, but munitions pouch works really well with the Lancer.

Look, apart from aiming practice, there are a three big things that a lot of players fail to do with the Lancer which really help.

• Charging while not ADS; unlike lock-ons, you can charge the lancer while not ADSing, this lets you strafe faster to avoid snipers/tank shots, strafe while behind cover to block 100% of shots, and gives you a bigger FoV, which leads to the next point...
• Pre-charging and charge cancelling; you should be charging the lancer before you choose, or even see the target. Either based on sound, the minimap, or simple prediction. If your target comes into line of sight, you are ready to hit it with a 3 charge, if it doesn't you can cancel the charge in 3 ways. You can; knife, pistol/medkit swap, or if you have shot one charge, reload.
• Use Ctrl-I to remove icons to aim better at long range. One of the big issues with long range shooting is the huge icons which cover the target, this can make it hard to hit the pixel sitting out of cover. Use Ctrl-I to toggle the icons off so you can clearly see that corner of a tank thinking he's in cover 600m away.

Basically OP, please keep quiet, because if anything, the Lancer is going to get nerfed (though if it does get a range nerf, it could do with a damage buff).

Looks like you've justified it for me. When I trialed it I was using it against infantry most of the time; no wonder I thought it sucked.

Looking at the last 3 points you made, I will follow those and hopefully the tips will work for me

And finally, I should use it against MAXes ESFs, tanks and Flashes more. But then again, even though this weapon seems deadly to vehicles and MAXes it still could use a charge up buff. I find the 3 second charging way too long for me.

The Lancer is fortunate in that you can pre-charge the weapon, and cancel if the charge is un-needed, which almost completely avoids the down side of the weapon. If you get in the habit of pre-charging, your effectiveness will increase massively.

A three second charge is far superior to the lock on mechanic.

The Annihilator takes 3 seconds to lock on at long range, or 4 seconds against a target with maxed Stealth (2.5-3.5 for most other lock ons). Add in the fact that a lock on requires staying in LoS & ADS (making you tank gun / sniper bait), lock ons give the enemy warning prior to firing (letting them start evading, Lancer has 0 warning), and lock ons can be countered by Flares & IR smoke (as well as the aforementioned Stealth).

If everyone using the Lancer used it to 100% effectiveness, it would already be nerfed, that's a fact.

I'm sold.

Time to save up for the Lancer I guess! 648 certs away. After all, a long range RL that deals great damage at extreme ranges is always welcome in my arsenal ^_^ I just need to remind myself to never to use this weapon in close range, which was the mistake I made.

Thanks for clearing things up Mongy

Well, I wouldn't necessarily prioritise the Lancer as a beginner. It is 1000 certs and relatively situational. Assuming I'm looking at the right character on the players site, you only have ~6100 certs so far. There are a lot more "fun" things to cert than the Lancer.

For example, you could cert out some other classes more (the light assault might be fun with the upcoming drifter jets change), I would recommend some infantry guns such as getting the Terminus for the medic (use forward grip, SPA, and a 1x sight) or perhaps starting to get certs into vehicles (AP lightning can be good fun).

While getting a good long range AV weapon is a "useful" thing to have on your character, it is only "fun" when you have a group of friends who also have one on voice comms.

No, the Lancer is fine as is.

It's an excellent multi-strike weapon, even uncharged.

To give it anything more would be far too much.

looking trough your stats and unlocks i'd suggest you to focus more on your primary HA weapons and medkits. your infil seems to be specced out decent, tough getting the Phaseshift probably was a mistake. focus on the Vandal and the Ghost.
also focus on one suitslot and one ability type. you probably want to get the resistshield for the heavy, as it is the easiest to use and grenade bandolier. for Infil i prefer Hunter cloak which you already have certed pretty good and then i'd get EITHER Adrenaline pump, nanoweave or ammunition. Avanced shield capacitor is a great suitslot, but not on the infil, as your shield doesn't recharge while cloaked, but the timer before it recharges does,, so you'll rarely be able to use it to your advantage. also upgrade your recon darts, those things get amazing on higher levels, giving you more ammo, a 45second duration and a higher ping rate, so they update almost in realtime, for almost a minute while also giving you 5 of them, instead of the starter darts giving you 2 which ping about 3 times in 15 seconds.

A possible change Higby was considering before he left was to make it so that raw assist exp factored in to help with a weapon auraxium. While I'm not sure if it was going to count for directives, it would have made it much easier to go for an auraxium.

Very few players currently have the kraken. The rocket launcher directive is still a very grindy one (but at least not as bad as the exceptional directive).