I'm at tough decision here between Secondaries for CQC & point-pushing support. I love my commissioner, I like how it looks, and especially how it handles at medium range. But in CQC I'm still finding the loud unsilenceable "HERE I AM" effect too much of a handicap versus multiple enemies nomatter what I try to do to handle more than 1 at a time once my presence is known. This has basically devolved to just spamming out betties & Bandoliered-grenades which is a total crap shoot. I tried the Renegade in VR and while not as accurate as the Comissioner, it still seemed to grant the same basic TTK while being Silenced. My OTHER option of course is the Crossbow which could have the bonus of Radar darts for my Medic & Engineer so I can actually be useful in Techplants and Biolabs too. So it's a tough choice b/c I'm actually pretty decent with Burst-fire semi autos. (better than I am with automatics anyway). I see how the Crossbow works and I've fought plenty of people by now who were using it, so I have a sense of where it is, but what about the Renegade? I don't think I've seen anyone I know using it. Anything I should know here??
It grants the same basic TTK as the Commisioner because the Commisioner is **** as a stand-alone weapon. You use it as a finisher, not as a pocket-smg. So no, don't get the Rebel, it's **** as well. Use the Underboss, GURANTEED to kill with 1 shot to the head and then 1 shot to the body (works out to 11,5m). If compared to the Commisioner, all it loses out on is the 1HKO to the head to Infiltrators. If you're going to argue that you can't 1shot+knife anymore like this, you still can; sniper rifle. Supressors aren't worth it, especially on an INF. If you're shooting, always have cover you can pop right behind, no matter what so you can avoid getting shot after you're done shooting.
For NC, Desperado if you want a suppressed sidearm. I love my Repeater. While I won't get into the "suppressor/no suppressor" argument for primaries, there really is NO drawback to having a suppressor on your faction pistol. Yes, you should be shooting from cover as an infiltrator, re cloaking as you go behind cover to remove your dot from the minimap etc. But, unless you are running Stalker cloak, your pistol is usually only coming out as a finisher, low on ammo on primary with no time to reload, 'oh ****' moments or creeping up on another sniper.
1. The supressor reduces the max damage range your pistol does by 5m. 2. Wanting a Supressor on your weapon means you can't use the Underboss/Commisioner, and both are pretty much upgrades over all the current ES pistols. Commisioner is good if your primary is an auto (aka you use it as a finisher). Underboss is better if you use it as a stand-alone weapon or have a bolt-action as a primary.
1. Which hardly matters as most ES pistols are being used well within that distance most of the time anyway. 2. That's your opinion only. Some people prefer higher ROF than what the revolvers offer.
I swear by the Rebel, but I've never been much of a revolver fan other than aesthetically. The Rebel is what I know. It's what I used before infill's got SMGs and pistols were simply 'the close range option,' and it's buffs since then really support how I like to shoot. Double-tap headshots are a kill up to 15m, and 10m with a suppressor. There's little recoil to muck that up, and a good rate of fire, which is the primary reason I use it over the revolvers, but has slightly better hip fire accuracy too. Combines excellently with EMP grenade to make all affected targets able to be dropped with a single hip fire headshot.
1. Having 3m of max damage range doesn't look like a huge deal to you? At that range you might as well BASR bodyshot+knife them. 2. That might be so, but that doesn't mean the revolvers aren't pretty much an upgrade over the ES pistols. The Repeater has a better TTK, yes, but it can't hit the broadside of a barn beyond a few meters.
The red part is pretty much what I'm getting at with the first point. I suppose it may depend more heavily on the weapon. Personally, I'd rather be quieter and sacrifice that little bit of damage, but I generally prefer suppressors on most of my weapons as an infiltrator in most cases. If I'm pulling out my pistol as an infiltrator (no stalker cloak) I am either using it to finish somebody off or using it to get the jump on somebody. I don't see either situation having that damage drop off make much of a difference. Especially since most of MY pistol encounters happen within 10m. If I am flat out dueling somebody, I'm probably going to lose anyway as my aim, reaction times and eye sight (hip fire cross hairs are damn hard for me to see in combat) aren't up to snuff. There are reasons to take the suppressor on a sidearm, especially for an infiltrator. Sometimes the downsides may outweigh the stealthiness, but rarely for me. Your statement on them not being worth it is your opinion based on your playstyle. Though I fail to see how they aren't worth it "especially for an infiltrator" as opposed to any other class. If anything, I'd argue the opposite.
Sorry, I meant DESPERADO. .... (don't blame me, they're the ones using too many synonyms for insurrectionist / outlaw)
Are you using SMGs or BASRs? I pretty much never use my secondary unless an enemy is within 11,5m, no matter what. The reason being beyond that it's pretty easy to just shoot and pop behind cover then finish them off with a 2nd BASR shot (or not, if you got a HS if it was possible) without (much) damage taken yourself. I don't use a Supressor on my BASR either, fyi. Finishing someone with 1 shot is better than finishing them with 3 bullets out of a fast RoF gun since the latter means more chance of taking damage to your health (Medkits are invaluable, especially as an INF). Even if most of your pistol encounters happen within 10m, that's still 1 bullet more needed to kill an enemy if >3m since I assume you're using the Repeater with a Supressor on it. Yes, there are reasons to use a Supressor, but they are niche/situational and the pros of not using one outweigh the cons by far. The reason I said it's "especially so" for an infiltrator is because you have cloak. Now I know they vary from playstyle to playstyle, but if you want to do well, there's a select few "plays(tyles)" that are superior to others. The Desperado is a worse Repeater in almost every aspect. The Repeater is only effective within a few meters because of the extremely high initial cone of fire and bloom per shot. However, it is easy to use since missing isn't as huge of a penalty, but if you wanted that trait, you should've gone with TR, not NC tbh. The thing with high damage guns is (especially the Underboss, higher RoF) you only need 1HS and a follow-up with 1BS, and that 1HS is pretty easy to get since you're an INF and mostly should have the element of suprise if playing well.
I've obviously got the element of surprise on the first kill. Everyone does. But if you'd read my original post, the issue was actually trying to HOLD a point. (not even necessarily solo against multiple players). The issue with the larger caliber pistols is that they're really only good in outdoor & flanking encounters. They give your position away in CQC which translates to instant death b/c you're trapped on several sides by a tight corridor. without a silenced pistol, It is literally impossible to maintain the element of surprise if there's more than 1 enemy in a 100m range . Meanwhile most of those enemies are also outfit vets on HA's & LA's using silenced full-autos /w Medics in tow. I don't have to kill them BTW, but killing their medic would be good enough ... but you can't kill a dodgy medic at mid-range with the Comissioner/Underboss. I play medic too... the instant I take damage, I put my triage on to self-heal what would have been the killing blow. Therefore the only tool that will work in this situation is something that can be silenced but puts out a 2-click TTK The Mag-shot is currently failing hard at this task b/c there's too many steps involved in closing distance & knifing.
With the element of suprise I meant that you always have it, if playing well. Don't stand in 1 spot, you can't defend a place like other classes can, your job is to defend the entrances and flank enemies trying to get to that entrance. The thing with giving away your position is why I said you always should have cover to go behind after you're done shooting, and if they're within 11,5m of you is the only time you should pull out your secondary, anyways, so at that point it doesn't even matter having your pistol silenced or not, they'll know their allies got killed and will be wary. There's a million ways to know that an enemy knows you're there before even looking at the mini-map alone. Giving away your exact position isn't a problem if you have cover to go behind, and I don't mean indoors by a point.
Tryhard-wise, take desperado, its better. Fun-wise, take rebel with silencer. I have it on all my classes simply because I freaking love silenced rebel sound, its the best silencer sound in the game.
oh, I would never suppress my RAMS. That is certainly a case where I would say it is not worth it. I also stick with compensator on my SOAS, since I use that where I have plenty of other TR around and hang back behind friendly lines. SMGs I suppress, where a suppressor (I believe) affect them slightly differently, along with soft point ammo to circumvent the change to max damage range. And where I am using an SMG, velocity isn't a concern. I have just run into so many situations where an un suppressed weapon got me killed, whereas I can stay on the move and continue to surprise enemies while suppressed. Another reason why I love the crossbow when Im using stalker. Many will say it's not that good, but I have caused plenty of havoc against groups of snipers that have NO clue what's going on. One quiet shot to the head is much easier to hide than several from an ES pistol, or a loud commy. But that's very niche.
I also want to say that I'm not advocating one pistol over the other. My different loadouts use different pistols depending on the primary, or the current situation I am in. The commy has saved my hide more than a few times to be sure.
I use the Rebel as an offensive pistol. I can use at range with the suppressor and laser and get good med range pickoffs. The Desperado I use as a sentry and defensive handgun. Its better for ambushing people coming into the base point rooms. I run suppressor and darklight on it. I dont use my commissioner as often with my stalker cloak unless Im hunting snipers. Laser sight, head shots, if I sneak up properly, it does the job the fastest on them. I have no use for the magshot, and the underboss is just redundant for my needs. Wish I had a scatter pistol.
Stopped reading right here. If you can't stay on the topic of what the various weapon's ideal-playstyle are, without insisting someone else is bad; (I don't even know what I said that set you off, but feel free to PM me it if it was just a misunderstanding ) then you're not actually a great gamer either and in no position to be insulting them. ..unless you've got VIDEO of yourself performing it Thank you! I found this much more helpful...
