vanu max: end of the stick in every category

Im not here to whine i just want to know in what category thé vanu max should shine.

1:cometes aren t that good because of the Low ammo pool ans the small clip size.
2:for ai vanu max is ok but terran mercy is more effective.
3:for max vs max fight vanu max is bad, even if y ou land all shots in head, you will be melt by fracture and falcons maxes.
4ur ability ils bad also pleaze remove it from the game et make new players waste their certs.

In my opinion, Vanu max should be at least good at one task
If im wrong pleaze enlight me.

You are wrong.
1. try a 6 clip shotgun
2. by a small margin but again, try a shotgun at any range except point blank
3. can´t compare an ai MAX vs av MAXes in MAX v MAX
4. your ability is situational, same as the NC and TR ones, many just prefere to use the default charge

Vanu max is at least good at more then one task, stop complaining at things that aren´t broken. If anything, vanu MAXes are too good as some stuff(prouved by the amount of them pulled lately<at least on the server where i play>) and no, not compared to the others but compared to how much of a crouch MAXes should be

I have also an NC character i know how work NC maxes and what i can say is too many players cry about their shotguns. They are so effective lol you just need to AIM for head shot like every faction maxes that all.

i tried everything with this zoe crap its not situational its useless there is no point to use it. There is no synergies for team play, that make you weak for no upgrade and make you glowing like a christmas tree. In what circumstance it can be usefull really? Im bored how some people that want grieff others try to give false informations.new players pleaze my god dont cert that crap.

I was writing about this all the time, and so I will also post it here. I play NC/Vanu and I am main MAX player (still certing them, but I play as one as much as I can, even bought membership for it). Vanu MAX is lacking compare to other two in some areas.

1. Comets need to be buffed to be on pair with Falcons/Punders in term of MAX vs MAX vs Vehicle fight. Magazine size should be increased to 3, ROF should be as fast as you can click, velocity should be much much faster and direct dmg buffed, so it is good against MAX and vehicles, not Infantry. When Comet Vanu MAX fight vs Pounder/Falcons MAX- it should be matter of aim, movement nad reflex that will show who win. Comets need to be buffed.
2. Vortex recoil must be lowered and either Charge dmg buffed or magazine size increased. Also charge should be able to be hold and realese when player want.
3. Blueshifts are Mercy, Cosmos are Mutilitators, Quasars are Onslaught. More dmg lower ROF = lower dmg, faster ROF. I run tests and if both TR Max and Vanu MAX stand and hit all hits in head with dual Cosmos/dual Mutilitators they are 99,5% equal in killing time. Diffrence is only first few bullets so reflex is most important when both MAXes meet. In the end AI for TR and Vanu are the same. While it is "balanced", TR has more magazine sized and spare ammo, while accuracy is really the same. So Vanu should be buffed in accuracy my big margin, because TR has their faction trait in MAX weapons, while compare to them, Vanu does not. Accuracy need to be increased to balance smaller magazines and slower ROF (enemies have better chance to escape from Vanu than TR, accuracy will equal that).
4. ZOE deserved nerf, thats true. But over-nerf was highly over the line. Now ZOE is useless, bugged and totally broken. IMO ZOE should:
a) Last 10 seconds
b) Cooldown 15-20 seconds
c) can be turn off and on when you need, like all abilities
d) Dmg buff should be PROPER (now it is bugged, because it is more like 6% buff...2 bullets difference) 20% on ALL RANGES and all weapons (so it is 10 sec 20% buff dmg for everything on any range), not up to 10 meters, because Vanu MAXes are long range MAXes so you 10 meter buff in totally worthless for Vanu.Who even though of this stupid CQC range buff?? For Vanu??
e) Current movement speed buff should be add to sprint speed. Without it it is useless bonus.
f) Damage you take should be Rank 1- 35%, Rank 2-32,5%, Rank 3- 30%, Rank 4- 27,5%, Rank 5- 25%

This is my opinion. I play NC and Vanu MAXes. My friend is TR MAX (thanks for tests man!). While I think NC and TR are good and they should not be nerfed, Vanu need to be buffed in those things I wrote above to be on equal foot with them.

Also, Lockdown on other hand should decrease dmg taken by 25% from All sources (direct explosives also). This and above will make lockdown and ZOE usefull again. One in defense, second in offense. Aegis is little bugged but 4x time more usefull then other two options. Aegis should be little bigger, but ONLY if above changes will meet TR and Vanu. Right now NC ability is light years ahead compare to rest MAX.

Do you now? Guess you know nothing about NC MAXes then.

Try it again and stick with other MAXes, see if it becomes a force multiplier or not. Then try again with the aegis shield, see how useful it is when 50% or more of the time it fails to work properly.

I do and while it's not quite as easy as the person claims they really do shine in CQB. They have the fastest TTK of all MAX by a huge margin and yes, that includes the long reload times too. Our TTK is 0 for the first shot and .29 after that whereas the TR/VS are .49/.56 respectively.

If you want to see the math for 12 kills worth (2 full stock NC MAX clips) it is a total of 6.87 seconds to kill 12 people... that includes the 4 second reload. It would take the TR/VS 5.88/6.72 respectively and they don't have to reload.

So as you can see the reloads do effect the NC's TTK, but not a whole lot. The TRUE problem with the NC AI MAX is the lack of range and having to reload so often which really frustrates people. The above TTK for the NC is only for fights that are within 8m which is pretty small. The above TTK for theTR/VS is good up to 10m which isn't a whole lot, but it is a difference.

I would much rather have the NC MAX's damage halved and their clip size doubled than feel like I am constantly having to reload. This would result in a TTK of .57 (removing the instagib that people hate so much) so the rate of fire would need to be brought up just a bit to be more in line with the others.

The VS max is better than the NC max in a non CQC environment (everywhere other than a biolab)

It has the best hitbox, i cant hit a VS max as easily as i can hit a TR max.
It is the most accurate.
Its funny that you are comparing the VS max to an AV max, which is kind of wrong since a NC max would probably choose a AI loadout (or a mix) if he wanted to face another max. As for the pounders, meh i cant say.

You are complaining small that comets have a small ammo pool. Its about 43 if i'm not wrong. meaning that you can reload 21 times.
NC maxes have a much larger reason to complain about the ammo pool of their shotties, which is only 54. Keep in mind that shotgun is an AI weapon and it should be having a much larger pool compared to an AV weapon.

I encourage you to reread my post. Nowhere did I say that a NC MAX can kill 12 in a single clip.

"If you want to see the math for 12 kills worth (2 full stock NC MAX clips) it is a total of 6.87 seconds to kill 12 people... that includes the 4 second reload. It would take the TR/VS 5.88/6.72 respectively and they don't have to reload."

I included the "12 kill" thing to show how the 4 second reload effects our speed to kill to show that it doesn't really hurt us.

MAXs have 2000 HP with an innate damage resistance to bullets of 80%. With this in mind we can figure out how much/fast AI MAXs can kill each other.

NC with dual Hacksaws - 7 shots needed
TTK - 5.45 seconds

TR with dual M6 - 40 shots needed
TTK - 19.6 seconds

VS with dual Nebula - 35 shots needed
TTK - 19.6 seconds

Each "shot" is actually 2 shots (1 from each gun) The math simply doesn't reflect that NC AI MAX kills MAXs slower than the other 2, but there are a lot of factors to take into consideration. A shot from the NC gun is 6 individual pellets that have bloom/spread... Each missed pellet is 125 damage less to infantry and 25 less damage to a MAX. If we assume you miss 1 pellet from each gun on every shot (25x14 = 350 damage) you'd have to take 1 more shot which would raise your TTK to 5.73

Sorry, I don't know how, but my math was wrong for the TR and VS TTK on MAXs it should be 4.87/4.92 respectively.

With MAX's innate small arms resistance of 80% their effective health is 10000.

So in short, the TTK are:-

NC max: 5.45
TR max:- 4.87
VS max:- 4.92

Where does the NC CQC advantage kick in? NC seems to be the worst according to this.

It is the reload that throws it out of balance. If there were no reload NC would be 1.71... Extended mags would solve this issue OR you could just run dual Grinders and have a TTK of 1.66 against MAXs.

Keep in mind that these numbers are for MAXs WITHOUT Kinetic Armor certifications... It's a different story when you dealing with those. Just to give you an idea, at max rank a MAX's effective health against infantry is 16000

Are you sure grinders have 1.66 TTK? I use them and it feels much longer.

Its sad to see NC maxes need Ex-mags to actually excel in CQC, without them they suck in all situations.

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/max-balance-part-4-everything-ai.139234/
Vanu's have the best AI options. They win at any ranges above 20m.
Below 20m they still beat any NC max who is not using dual grinders. As for the TR max, yes the VS max has about 0.X slower TTK. (below 20m)

I am not aware about AV weapons of all maxes so i'm gonna leave that out.

ZOE is more balanced than it was before, that is all i can say. Charge is still the best and most used option for all maxes of all factions.

I

That's the thing, the spread/COF of the weapons are so bad that some of the pellets from your shots can miss and likely do.

Funny how ppl tend to forget a lot of information about weapons when doing their maths. Yes, in theory grinders can kill 12 ppl and the rest of the shotguns 10 ppl. However, factoring misses, overshoot(which is quite common, nobody really shoot only once but twice to be sure the target is dead) and even the imba hit detection that planetside is using the usual number of kills someone gets before ahving to reload is more or less 3. Also, because the insane bloom the MAX shotguns have, shooting at maximum ROF is rarely the optimal thing to do if you really want to be able to score those three kills. TR and VS MAXes don´t have the same problem, they can continue shooting way after they kill the same 3 ppl.
What ppl don´t think about is that a MAX is rarely alone, it has support. Yes, in perfect conditions(again, no miss, 100% hit registering) NC MAX can kill an enemy MAX somehow faster in extreme CQC but if he manages that he will still be out of ammo and almost dead. More often then not the enemy engi or medic or w/e will finish the job. If a TR/VS MAX kills the NC MAX is still has bullets to spare to kill all the NC support. If(which happens even more often) the MAXes go for the support first instead of the other MAX again the VS/TR don´t have to reload while the NC one does, which is another loss for the NC.
More to that, one of the things that nobody factors in when considering MAX balancing is the thing that pulls VS/TR MAXes even more ahead of NC one. Shotguns have a 1.5x headshot multi, the other weapons have a 2x. That is also why, in a post before i said to someone that went smth like "you just have to aim for the head" that he doesn´t have a clue what he is talking about. The 1.5x headshot multi = to give the same dmg as body shooting you need to at least hit twice as many headshots then missed pellets which even in CQC is impossible cause of the high COF. More headshots then missed bullets on a TR/VS weapon in CQC is way easier to pull out.
Now, another very important difference is that the NC MAX has to be reactive while the TR/VS MAXes can be proactive. Even in a biolab fight where ppl complain most about NC MAXes, NC are still at a disadvantage unless the battle is really small. When the MAXes start to pile up, the ammount of suppresion a TR/VS MAX zerg can put on chokepoints means nothing passes through that door. The NC MAXes have to wait for the person to actually enter through the chokepoint. Factor in latency and human reaction time that probably negates and some the whole advantage of ttk the NC MAXes have. Also to that, the TR/VS MAXes can do that suppresion from way inside the room while the NC MAXes have to stay closer to the doors exposing themselves(especially when factoring the things i mentioned a a few lines ago) to c4 and rockets more. That was defence, how about biolab offence? Well, if they attack from the landing pad, the NC MAXes are screwed, if they attack from a teleporter there are enough places to stay out of their optimal so they can´t retaliate and damage them. Again win for the TR/VS.
I donno how is on your servers but on Miller big VS/TR pushes are usually with 1/3 of infantry being MAXes. The NC mostly pull theirs with falcons which even with the OHK still take 3 sec between shots and in way smaller numbers. Also, they prefere pulling MAXes in small engagements only where they actually stand a chance of closing the gap.

Formatting your message will help prevent bleeding eyes and headaches.

Anyways, at the same time the NC struggle with bullet spread that is unavoidable, TR/VS suffer similar issues like all automatic weapons do. You're correct in saying that no one factors in misses and stuff, but that's because you can't. That is why you do testing BEYOND what you see on paper, but right now what is shown on paper is quite accurate with how it really is in practice.

Imo
best longrange max: falcon max
Best av max falcon
Best antimaxounder and falcon
Best at ai:scattermax
Best aa max: aegis max with aa
Best at killing afk medics and infiltrators uncloacked....dual blueshift and dual cycler

And for people who think its nc only:every faction equip extend clip on their max on all weapon if possible.

For NC, it's not "if possible", it's : "I'm buying Mattock, so I must keep 1000 cert to get extended mag"

And serioulsy : best AA MAX is Aegis MAX ? seriously ?

Troll post or you just don´t get down from your airplane often?

Aegis aa max i the one who survive a dalton shot so yes its the best