Im already growing tired by people saying ZOE is too powerful. Sad that im not someone having the time and will to test out who will win, the TR-lockdown Max or VS-Zoe Max, if they start shooting at each without moving after having activated their abilitys. But I think ZOE was indeed a little misinterpreted and its ability should not be "half TR" and increasing its damageoutput. After all the TR-Max got increased damageoutput for less mobility. The NC-Max got increased Defense for less mobility. So why should the ZOE not focus on mobility and agility only? As it is now ZOE increases: - Damage - Walkingspeed (much) - Runningspeed (a bit) and turns your defensive capability into a risky game of hopefully not getting hit directly by moving in deceiving patterns. I dont like unnecessary risks so why not having it like this? Increased: - Walkingspeed and Runningspeed (much - since its both under movement anyway) - Reloadingspeed of weapons (cause this too is a form of moving faster) Now you are probably thinking "WHAT THE HELL"- you want them to have even faster movements by having their runningspeed strongly increased as is their walkingspeed, their damageoutput is still greater since they can reload faster and now they dont even take higher damage anymore? Well yes and no. Players are in fact not complain about ZOE being too powerful. They complain about how ZOE isnt giving them enough time to react when they suddenly face a ZOE-Max. And I agree! The "Nebula"s im using are so much more powerful or at least feel so and allow me to kill Infantry in such a short timeframe (dualwielding tough), that I can see why people say its overpowered. And I dont like it as well. They cant properly react on it and I too cannot properly react on most rockets shot on me. " Huuuuh - why - ZOE makes you so fast. " Yes it does but im the guy who is somehow always getting hit anyway by a good player and I thought ZOE was about mobility in itself and not overpowering or be suddenly overpowered. Effortlessly you notice faster reload doesnt mean faster damageoutput, it means being able to fire with less delay. With my Weapons not getting more powerful in itself, the enemy players may have still time to react and can jump or run into safety. Before my weapondamage got boosted by ZOE, most players actually managed to run away if they have REALLY looked in front of them and spotted me suddenly arround a corner. Or I would say it had been around 60%. Now its only 20% and thats only if they know my exact position with a difference of at best 2 meters. Of course I can chase them too with ZOE even tough im a Max. But its still not impossible for an Infantrist to successfully run into hiding, at least in bigger buildings. Let the ugly Energy remain. I think a white glowing Siolette would have been cooler. They will see me as usual! Whats most important is that the damage-risk was avoidable anyway! You could turn ZOE on and off as you wished. If you have failed to "ambush" your target with ZOE, all you needed to do is turn it out and camp, when the environment was too risky. A few times you would have done a mistake and learned to activate ZOE only when shooting or using it to make a few, fast sidesteps into cover. The risk is annoying for both the enemy and ZOE-users. Remove it, remove the "sudden-kill"-risk for the enemy, let ZOE focus on agility and movement all alone and everyone will be happy. Or so I guess...
ZOE is a bad ability, unfitting for a max. Unfortunately we'll stuck with it, so after the series of nerfs on it, we'll just operate as it isn't there. Not the first time or the first weapon or ability that has happened. The only surprise is that it started as a bit too good and they'll nerf it to the ground, instead of utter crap so it eventually gets on par with the rest.
............? You know that the Empires are using different technology and there is no "right Max" and wrong Max? I suggested it in a way that follows the empires favoured style of weaponry. The TR was the longrange and fast firerate faction. The NC was the shortrange and strong hitting faction. The VS was the middlerange and accuracy faction. When it came to defensive capabilitys, TR simply had none and tried to make up for it with firepower, NC could eat hits and throw packback, the VS was all about positioning and trying to evade enemy fire. The Magrider shows this the best I think, the Scythe not really. And the new Max-abilitys are similar to their empires Tankabilitys! So why should ZOE not focus harder on agility, moving and doing faster and nothing in itself becomes stronger? The Magrider is not getting stronger as well. All he can do is getting 'faster' in short timeframes.
VS was ALWAYS about mobility and better technology, so the speed increase is a fitting and plausible addition to the maxes.
As a fun note on the TR lockdown max vs ZOE max in a head to head fight scenario... The TR max kills the ZOE while having lost something like 45-50% health. Someone on the TR side I know tested this with me. So yeah... use that mobility and never go head to head with a lockdown max.
I think the lockdown is not always a strenght. After one death and the Max not moving, next time you can ambush the scene. Even if he stands in a corner, suddenly shot a bazooka on him and return in cover - he will panic as he has no real means to kill you. He got no charge left to escape fast into the unknown. He must cease the lockdown, what takes some time too. Maybe you are nearly death after the first bazooka but allys are always nearby and there is no way he will go out of this alive if not surrounded by allys. ( Well but this goes for all Maxes.) Im still not satisfied about the current situation with Zelotoverdrive. Why must there be decreased defense? The glowing is a weakness in itself. A nighttimes everyone can see you glowing like a Cyborg-Fairy-Hybrid, you are even visible in a smokescreen (!!) for everyone and its main role is still not perfect. The difference in increased walking- and runningspeed is still too high. The runningspeedbonus is a joke compared to the bonus for walking. And I dont want the weapon-damagebuff. I dont want to be able to kill players so that they cant react and therefore think its overpowered. I want to be able to activate it, be easier to spot but can run like hell with it and do NOT take more damage in a flash. This roulett-stuff is annoying. Everything ingame that is taking the feeling off rewarding skill from the player, is bad in the end. Unlike with lattice its not focussed on population, but on luck with Zelotoverdrive. Also I tested Lockdown for myself. I dont care if the Zelotoverdrive is maybe looking to similar to it when the reloading-time is decreased by the Max moving faster (thanks to Zelotoverdrive, that is focussed on allowing faster movements). The TR Max is still shooting faster ( ! ) and not as visible in the dark and in general. Cause things that dont move a harder to spot for a human and the TR-Max dont have to fear to expose itself suddenly. In a smokescreen when both Maxes activate their ability, the TR-Max is undeniable in advantage. Also I guess the Aegis-shield would be visible too and the fact that its still unbeatable. I tested it out as well but you are not absorbing damage in the Traininggrounds... so I just cant find out how powerful it really is. But the Overdrive really needs to have his runningspeed increased. Currently its silly and the only reason I can think off why its so silly, is that "charge" would maybe look silly if the Overdrive runningspeed becomes faster. The charge should do damage on Infantry then and the ability to throw people from their feet. Also there needs to be an animation and function in the game when people are falling down and must stand up again. So that grenades become more frightening again. Ah more and more offtopic. ^^ But the normal grenades are not worth the ressources anymore. I have the impression 92% of all people run around with Flak-Armor.
I think ZOE's damage buff should be changed to an accuracy buff. Tighter CoF, basically. Of course such an accuracy buff wouldn't be something like the blueshift going from 1.15 to .5, but if it's something like .9 or 1 that'd still be a pretty wide CoF. Not to mention that it'd widen further when moving. Wouldn't increase damage much, if at all in close quarters, but gives an edge at range. Vehicles shouldn't notice much of a difference either as our AV and AA weapons aren't affected too much by CoF unless you're jumping. Increasing the mobility is only going to result in tears, and it'll just get nerfed, but then without the damage buff.
Remove ZOE and give us jump jets, everyone else got their PS1 ability but us. Either that or give us the NC shield, after trying that out I say to hell with ZOE, I want to tank tank shells and rocket pods too. If ZOE is nerfed in a significant way, I certainly hope they get at least rid of the radioactive lobster glow. For me that's the biggest drawback of ZOE, not the damage debuff.
as a TR I'd like to point out I rarely get to use lockdown, against vehicles/tanks it's basically suicide since you can't kill them in the timespan it takes them to turn around (with fractals), find you and put 2 tank shells in you; not to mention all the infantry/heavies just waiting for you to stop moving. Only time I get to use it effectively is against aircraft and when I see them coming so I can position myself in such a way that lockdown's 180 field of view doesn't hinder me. So unless I have 2 or 3 engies behind me, it's near impossible against tanks. Why do I say this? because the little test you did where lockdown goes against a standing still zoe is a scenario that will never happen on the battlefield. yes lockdown damage beats zoe damage. lockdown also means 0 mobility wile zoe means increased mobility. and all of this wile there's infantry all over the place giving zoe an advantage and lockdown a death sentence. as far as my experience goes, lockdown is an anti air skill. using it anywhere else without 2 to 3 dedicated engineers is a death sentence. and yes, suggestion sounds good if you take away the increased damage given and taken and keep the mobility since VS isn't about damage or defensive power as it is about mobility and accuracy
Oh a ZoE thread? I briefly VR'd that and the one thing I notice about it....no duration at all? Really? It lasts forever? That can be the first step towards making it more balanced. 10seconds duration, 60 second cool down. RIght now being able to run around like superman until you die...noone sees that as a bit OP? People see the HA Shields as slightly OP, but ZoE..... Lol, now the VS win soley on the fact that 8/10 guys is a ZoE MAX suit. MAX practically out number every other type of VS infantry right now. Everywhere I go against the VS, its nothing but ZOE Max suits..... What does it matter that it makes it more vulnerable to return fire, when the thing just goes into glow mode and mows down platoons of guys. I have Shriked a few ZOE, but still.....put a duration limit on the ZoE and it would be one step towards balance.
The NC shield also has no duration, perhaps we should make it into 10 second duration with 60 second cooldown as well? ZOE sucks in big engagements because you'll draw fire like there's no tomorrow from the radioactive lobster glow alone. ZOE does have it's advantages in smaller engagements where you don't have to dodge a wall of bullets and rockets though.
Well, yeah, but the shield doesnt make the thing a all around super killing machine like ZoE. I do not agree with any ability being unlimited though. So, yeah, give the Shield like 10/60 as well. I dont see NC Shield MAX running around eternally glowing like Ido ZOE max though. They pop it, run in and turn it off and shoot like mad. ZOE just run around glowing and killing everyone. Shield isnt near as good or OP as ZoE. BTW, how much more vulnerable does ZoE make the Max anyway? It already has an 80% resistance to fire by default doesnt it?
I'll direct you at the thread below where a discussion about MAX durability and repairing, one of the newer posts suggests the following: https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2...on-due-to-zoe-hint-its-bigger-than-20.131043/
All maxes have 2000 base hps. The default resistances are 80% against small arms and 25% against explosives. I still haven't seen anybody making any conclusive test on whether the 20% armor debuff affects the resistances (which would be a huge debuff, meaning practically zero explosives resistance and dropping the effective hps from 10000 to 8000 vs small arms. Or the armor debuff is a straight 20% value increase on all damage taken after all resistances are taken into account. One thing is certain, glowing in the night is a serious hindrance, though one can use it in his advantage and sort of "disappear" from people looking for the glowing faerie.
Actually there is a very easy way to test how the armour debuff works, which anyone can do. As the most conclusive test is one you've done yourself I will detail how below: Go to the VR with a VS char and throw an AP mine on the ground. Switch to an AI MAX, making sure it doesn't have flak armour equipped. Now point your crosshair as far down as possible and stand over the AP mine so that the dot of the crosshair is in the centre of the AP mine. Shoot the AP mine until it explodes and count the bars of health lost. If done correctly you should have lost 12.5 bars of health. Heal yourself or just log out and in, then repeat the above procedure but this time with ZOE switched on. You should have lost 16 bars of health. Which is an increase of 22%. After getting your health back to full, equip flak armour and repeat the procedure without ZOE. You should have lost 6.5 bars of health. After getting your health back to full, repeat the procedure one last time, this time with ZOE switched on. You should have lost 9.5 bars of health. Which is an increase of 32%. If the test is done correctly you should be able to observe that the percentage increase varies with amour level which, due to the way percentages work, is only possible if the armour debuff is reducing your resistance level. *Disclaimer: All numbers have been rounded for the sake of simplicity.
I'm sorry but the max has a role, that role is the same for all factions. We have a class system for a reason and all the ZOE has done is **** up the dynamic of the classes. Just because our faction trait is mobility doesn't really make a difference in what the maxes job is. What has ZOE done for the allies of the user? The big guy whose supposed to be taking the hits for the team is now dodging back and forth obstructing all his allies line of fire constantly and letting his engineer support take all the hits. ZOE is like the opposite of the design philosophy the max uses.The max, a team class, should get team focused abilities-something that gets stronger in groups and scales well. We have more faction traits then mobility and its about time we get to use them.
I forgot to say in my previous post; MAX's don't have a straight 25% explosive resistance. A MAX's explosive resistance actually varies depending on the type of explosive. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...UZseFIzNlY3Y2ktQ2c&f=true&noheader=true&gid=3 I don't know if the table is 100% accurate but with the test I previously talked about we can see that the straight 25% is very clearly wrong and that the table is right for explosive slash damage at least: MAX's have 2000 health which is represented in game by 40 bars, which means each bar is worth 50 health. AP mines do 1250 damage and at 1m take off 12.5 bars of health from a MAX without flak armour. 12.5*50=625 So our MAX has lost 625 health. 625 is 50% of 1250 therefore MAX's have 50% resistance to explosive splash damage.
Although I agree that Jumpjets should replace ZOE as it was a perfectly viable PS1 ability, I do feel that (warning Personal opinion forthcoming) with the mix of so many people using Light assault and C4 which is for me ruining the game a little, this would add to the problem of poorly designed bases for defense and allow VS to literally rickroll every base more than they already do. This being said I would still maybe rather see jumpjets instead of ZOE as I personally do feel ZOE is too strong compared to the other abilities, especially as the NC max shield doesn't always block frontal damage as it should (tested). The other point to make is although TR got lockdown it is nowhere near as viable to use as it was in PS1, in PS1 the lockdown could be used in corridoors with cyclers as an extreme dps turret as the bases where built for this form of defense (good base design in PS1). NC had a slightly op shield in PS1 but at least it worked properly unlike here so I personally feel ZOE has no place. To those that say glowing is a perfectly good disadvantage, your basically saying that you think you should only have a slight disadvantage (a glow is just that, slight disadvantage) that only matters for approx 50% of the day/night cycle. From my own experience it takes a similar amount of time at CQC range to die from a scatmax as it does to a ZOE AI max, albeit maybe a quarter of a second slower. If it was MORE risk reward I would be more content, for instance, if the ZOE made it so that a chest shot from a vanguard would instakill the max (a direct hit not splash) but in got their current bonus in return I wouldn't mind so much. It is unfortunately in the name of balance all about comparison, the lock down has ALOT less use than ZOE and saying otherwise is ignorant (how many lock downs do you see compared to ZOE's?), and the NC shield removes ALL your DPS for a FRONTAL increase in defense which sometimes doesn't work and doesn't help against splash. I feel a good change to balance it as it is would be as follows: Please remember this again is personal opinion and of mature mind, please feel free to be constructive but try not to flame war, IF you really think about my changes and try all 3 for a significant amount of time as I have you will understand where I am coming from. I also bias more towards the PS1 power of maxes as I liked them and found them to be more balanced than in PS2. TR lock down: an increase in the accuracy when locked down (think cycler max locked down in PS1, at close to medium range it was a filthy beast and in corridor defense it was a great deterrent with an repair buddy or two. Faster speed in locking down and mobilizing, or just a large decrease in the time it takes to unlock the max. Possibly capacitor ability back? if only a slight increase? NC shield: fix the bug where a non-splash weapon still does damage to the front while the shield is active, for anyone that doesn't know sometimes even small arms fire will somehow bypass the shields ability to protect from ALL frontal damage and still do damage to the max even if fired at the shield. but then again if the shield was designed to act more like a riot shield and you can still hit the max in protruding parts from the front then I guess it sucks abit more than I thought. I have wondered why if that IS the case and the max is only protected by the parts the shield literally aesthetically covers then why can I not fire my other arm that isn't holding the shield? Add an ability to overdrive the shield and cause it to fail for 'x' amount of time before it recharges but does a medium amount of damage in a small area around the max. This fits in with its short range CQC specialty. VS max The other reason Jumpjets should not be added is as I said C4 and LA already being too prevalent and taking on tanks like they are toys as even if you die you gain an amount of exp more than worth the quick respawn wait when knowing the enemy may have to wait up to 15 minutes to get another but you wait mere seconds, the VS maxes will start hovering on the arses of MBT's and turn them into a joke, aswell as making base defense against VS alot harder than the other 2 factions thus giving VS a huge advantage when every base is built ABOVE ground, especially as tanks here are alot weaker than in PS1 so the tank actually stood a chance to move and kill the max in PS1 but go above something like 50degrees and you can't hit it while it floats above you making you look like a joke. Solo this isn't such a problem but you WILL find squads of flying armoured AV purple spaghetti monsters ripping every mbt apart that gets within 30 feet of a base. ZOE- As ZOE is basically TR's PS1 capacitor skill on crack lined with heroin, it should be just that, a capacitor skill. I'm going to be alot more generous than the previous person and say it should be more like when you fire weapons it decreases the capacitor and will only recharge when ZOE is turned off, with increased ranks giving a fair increase in the recharge time, although for clever players this will make little difference to the current system it would make you actually think of what you are firing at so as not to use up all your capacitor firing at a random wall to deter entry then realise you have no capacitor when that TR/NC zerg is pushing up the stairwell behind you. This 'thought' process is what is kind of missing from VS ability over NC/TR both TR/NC have to THINK and be strategic about when to use their abilities especially when it replaces their only speed bonus, whereas VS can just think I'll get ZOE and still move fast, not lose that much survivability overall but gain these extra bonuses. To clarify: ZOE becomes a capacitor skill but only decreases upon firing the weapon, this could be an entire clip (which seems fairly realistic) or another variable number to be discussed by powers above myself. This adds more strategy to the skill itself, I personally think ZOE needs this AND a larger decrease in armour when activated, this turns it into a risk reward skill instead of just a constant overdrive mode. Alot of people say ''oh but I already glow and am easier to kill'' but there are several ways to tank (in every game) either outtank the damage, mitigate the damage, heal the damage or out damage what is damaging you. VS can outmaneuver the damage which effectively mitigates it and can outdamage the attacker thus infact increasing their survivability. Think scatmax at extremely close ranges, it is insta-kill, which is fair as it is an automatic armoured shotgun minitank (don't get close in first place) they can seem tanky because you barely get a shot off at close range therefore increasing their survivability in CQC situations. I have plenty more to write but have realised I have already made a superwall of text so will stop here in the hope SOME people might read and have some mature and decent feedback.
Perhaps adding jump jets to the VS MAX would finally force SOE to re-think base design. I don't think you'll see many hovering AV MAXes though if the jump jets are properly implemented, like a level 1 LA jump jet for example. Slow recharge and you could barely get to the first floor of a tower from the ground. A bigger problem would probably be to have them sit in unusual places, but if there's an AV MAX sitting on top of a tower for example he can be picked off by air quite easily with little to no option to fight back. We already have drop pods that constantly get you something like an engineer sitting on top of an enemy tower, farming people on the air pads with an UBGL. I doubt a MAX could be any more annoying than that. Over all, I'd really like to get rid of ZOE or have it changed. I've used ZOE 5 for a while now and the novelty has worn off, for me personally the glow is the biggest drawback in almost all situations because I either try to stay hidden until I strike or I'm trying to breach a room where the armor debuff hurts me too much. The only use left for ZOE for me is to get past the 3 seconds it takes to get to full sprint speed and the extra damage for AV / AA. I only use it in smaller infantry fights otherwise because that's where it is kind of OP, but once you get into big fights it's rather worthless.
True, as long as level 5 was balanced ( not that I expect alot of people to get it fast but is something to be considered.) infact jumpjets may work better, I do remember alot of VS maxes using all their jump ability then falling speedily to their doom, a fair input would be that flak and AA launchers would do damage to them when they are in the air, just like in ps1. Personally I feel ZOE has no place here and thats considering I have played a with all 3 a fair amount.
