all mines are lame and should be taken out of the game

I just got so much grief in private in-game chat from a person that happened to step on one of my mines

makes me wonder... with all the hate for cloakers, A2G, land mines and what have you, would on earth do you want this game to look like?

Those people are dumb.

Mine sweeper and avoidance severely nerfed tank mines and anti-infantry mines. If anything they should be buffed.

I would only want to see mines removed from Infiltrators, as that's the last class that needs more ways for sneaky kills

Fortunately, there is a difference between being dumb and thinking you are right, if you are, by chance, not. What is the real problem with this community is the lack of proper conversation and the very idea in the heads of the people: "I played the game longer than you, therefore I am wiser and more competent and automatically correct." THAT is the main issue in my humble opinion.

And you think I as an infiltrator unit could not sneak, into for example, crossroads watchtower, kill no one at first, hack the infantry terminal unseen, switch over to engineer, place some proxys, switch to tank mines, lay them as well and switch back to infiltrator? Sure, you can't pull that stuff on Crown, which is almost constantly guarded like a jewel, but on low guard to no guard? With no suspicious audible activity like a tank or vehicle driving out? Possible. Unlikely, but with some luck possible. If the people there want to fly rather than drive and pay no attention to the quiet lower levels? Absolutely possible.

And of course, this begs the question of compensation. You get some, you give some. You can't get something for nothing, right? What would infiltrators get in return for giving away their proximity mines?

The problem with mines is that they are a cheap way to OHK. You might say "ah but I avoid them like all the time!" But if most players had that ability then mines wouldn't be used at all.

Mines are too cheap and easy, plop one down on a good spot and you have a high chance of a kill. I would suggest making mines cheaper, preventing deployment too close to one another (let them detonate if they are too close) and reducing the damage so it doesn't OHK anymore. A mine should require overwatch so you can either finish them with your weapon, kill them as they run into it during a fight or warn you someone is coming while delaying them.

Mines are quite easy to see (at least on high/ultra settings), and you also have Sweeper HUD to help you with spotting them some distance away, and with anti-infantry mines you usually have half a second to run away so you don't get one shot.

The only issue I have, is that NSO F.U.S.E mines fit too well indoors and don't glow. Giving mines the exact same color palette as literally every room in the game makes them very hard to spot.

Or, conversely, pay attention. The reason most people don't want to play to avoid mines is because they'd rather run and get into the combat than play a passive mine avoidance and defusal game. So instead of checking for them or running mine sweeper, they just run through and die. So all players have the ability to think carefully and rationally - they just don't use it. So no, do not change mines. If they OHK someone, ok. So?

just a bunch of medics, engineers and heavies aiming for the head.

Perhaps this can apply to people who ghostcap or use the cover of invisibility to actively scout the terrain. But most often you take dmg, jump behind cover while popping medkit and - BLAM - outskilled by a mine.

Ofc this would usually happen just with players who aggressively play the game. Imo ai mines are ok I guess, maybe I'd increase resistance with flak but whatever.

Tank mines are what need a rework cuz minesweeper and the game's physics.

Mines are currently a bit of a noob trap in that any vehicle driver with any time in game has sweeper HUD. Maybe sweeper HUD should be given out as starting kit and the low levels of it buffed? To be clear, I'm only saying buff the low levels of sweeper HUD, leave the final stats alone. One of PS2's advantages for new players is that the starting gear is supposed to be competitive, with implants this really isn't the case.

What did Infiltrators ever lose? Except the shotgun years back. What everyone else lost were counters to them like IF sights and working flashlights


The thing with the class switch can be fixed easily - mines only stay active if the player is an engineer / heavy (for AT mines)

Oh my gosh tank mines. I die to them so often. The problem is, sunderers can't defend themselves against tanks without having like, 5 people there (3 engineers and 2 people in top guns or as Heavy Assaults) so you need the mines to stop unsuspecting players in vehicles. A 3/12 sunderer can't outdamage a 2/2 MBT, so baiting them into running into mines is especially useful. Just the sheer amount of players you need to keep the sunderer alive AND deal with the tank... I guess thats why tank mines are the way they are. Plus, the sundy just has to sit there and eat damage while the tank keeps moving around the shots.

No. Just no. Don't for the love of everything holy open this can of worms. It is enough that the spitfire already disappears once you switch from engineer to anyone else, but mines should disappear or deactivate as well? They are place and forget. No one wants to wait until they blow something up or get blown up before one can switch classes other than engineer or HA. What would be the point of mines then?

Spitfire absolutely shouldn't stay, and you're moronic for even thinking it, which is about on par for all your posts i've read so far.

Advocating for braindead place and forget mechanics is just the icing on the top. All deployables should be despawned on class change, which exists for every other class specific deployable, and even C4, and that even despawns on a respawn of the same class; if you don't want to waste resources, use them effectively.

As usual you have such a way with insults, don't you?

To be fair, the spitfires did stay once they were introduced and we all were happy to see that they only stayed with the engineer and became an engineer only thing. You misunderstood me there. Some might remember the spitfireside we had once that thing was introduced for everyone and the capture point was littered with these things. The biolab fights became a nightmare for LAs as engineers could place two spitties side by side and plucked them out of the skies. Nowadays only the engineer has a single spitfire and that is good. As far as that goes, I am with you. Some deployables like the spitfire should vanish upon class change. That is correct, that is OK.

But should that also be the case for explosives like tank mines or proximity mines? No. I don't even think C4 should despawn on death. Any block of C4 that got placed is a potential weakpoint that, would it be hit by a bullet, should detonate, but giving the kill to the one detonating it, even the enemy. Just like proxy mines detonated by bullet fire and killing the one placing it.

I didn't misunderstand, you're backtracking:

I can forgive you if English isn't your first language, or if you're just **** at it in general, but this reads no other way. If you didn't want to imply a negative, don't compare it as such.

Further, spitfires (ENG) didn't stay during class changes, even when the were introduced.

Aux spitifres were introduced to the game way later, weren't class specific, and were unanimously agreed to be broken in every way, shape, and form.

All class deployables disappear, not 'some'. Even things that cost nanites, like longer lasting nades (heal, decoy), and c4. Why you think mines should be special, when they are, or at least compete for, the most braindead **** in the game, is astonishing.

First of all, c4 lasts until the player respawns, meaning a revive doesn't remove it, and staying dead leaves it there as well.
Second, being able to respawn and trigger your c4 would be a terrible mechanic, and again, it isn't surprising this is a suggestion by you.

With no word did I suggest anything like that. I said the block of C4 should stay spawned so everyone could detonate it, I never said it should remain under your control so you could detonate it post-respawn. You're putting words in my mouth here. Stop it already!

Or, or, in a game with tons and tons of choices they dont want to be restricted to one or two loadouts? Besides that "just defusing mines" is not exactly that easy if the opposition has half a brain. Placement around corners and cover where they become visible when the enemy moves around is childsplay. And for the slightly smarter players you place it a little back so the luckless attacker will not have the luxury to step back and save itself if he sees it in time.

Forcing everyone to wear one implant or be called lazy and unskilled is a giant F you sign to any good gameplay. And that is assuming the implant works, because the times that the mine icon showed up as I was practically on top of it are about as high as the amount of times it showed it on time. Fortunately I know regular mine placements so most of the time the mines show up late isnt a problem for me, but that does not make it OK.

Mines remain a cheap and badly designed part of the game. You can say "ah but it only kills newbs and people who dont want to defend against it!" But that is no excuse. You need to make the mechanic of finding and not getting killed by mines fun, not a process of "check every single corner all the time in an ultra slow process of movement that also harms your ability to spot other threats and never run at your enemy ever during a fight since there might be mines".

I could now state that no one is actually forcing anyone to do stuff ingame or state that mines were never designed as a way to fight honorably. It is a tool of area of denial or a tool of obstruction and once the first casualty happens, the enemy is slowed down due to caution. But what do I know? The tone here gets more aggressive and hateful with each passing post. Instead of coming to a solution as with the C-bomb topic in the other thread, people here seem to rather fight on a personal level. Finding a solution that is agreeable to both sides is far more pleasant. To me at least.

You want a fun mechanic to find proxy mines? How about a handheld explosive tracker? Or attached to the primary weapon rail attachment for that matter? A small monitor able to screen the next few meters around you? Just like the motion tracker from Aliens, but for explosives? I personally believe this game could use more attachments with actual tool use. However, with such an easy way to find explosives, the number of proxy mines should receive a buff as well. Since one can now find then by activating such tracker, mines would not be a tool for the kill, but for obstruction to win some time.

But as far as tank mines go, I'm pointing at either the utility slot to implement a tracker monitor there with longer range than the infantry version or I will have to point at the minesweeper implant, which you say you don't want to be forced with. And look at that! Every vehicle has a utility slot. It would then be up to you if you want your vehicle to be more offensive with a gate shield diffuser or defensive with a mine tracker.