[Suggestion] Heavy Assault Rebalancing

Unless your opponent is missing many shots, then no the Self-Heal isn't viable in combat, it's rates are too slow to even withstand 1 extra bullet under direct fire. And saying the Heavy shield is not an "I win" button is entirely wrong... when two players face each other and one pops the shield, it is an incredible advantage to have despite being unaware of the enemy presence, in these situations it typically takes place in close quarters combat, where the movement reduction of the shield isn't as important of a downside. Remove all notions of lag, and the shield is an incredible advantage... even with lag a player being shot before they notice can still survive with the shield in time. It's happened to me many times before.

This... is actually a rather good comparison. ZOE is an actively self-nerfing ability, it wouldn't be quite to that degree... but applying ramp-up time to the HA shield would make it similarly useless in most scenarios. Your average CQB encounter lasts approximately 1-3 seconds (in my experience, at least) - There simply wouldn't be much of a point. Now... add in an entirely new type of shield with 3x-5x the capacity and a ramp up time, I wouldn't mind that being added as an alternative to the standard lineup of shields currently ingame, but to make it the only choice would be devastating to the game.

Random fun fact: In the last 30 days, there have been an average of 21,515 unique LMG users. Overall, in the last 30 days (all servers) there have been an average of approximately 50,000 unique players on planetside 2. (Sources on both are ps2oracle) - Nerfing something that affects nearly half of all players to this degree would be absolutely devastating to the game as a whole. We only just started seeing population numbers go up post-construction update. In my opinion, such a nerf would irritate people enough to tank the game entirely.

I notice you took that delay i mentioned as lag, actually its an intentional feature for....reasons its basically to prevent camping and encourage people to get on point by giving the attackers and advantage of (if i remember from wrels video) .238 seconds, now while it may not seem like much that is a huge advantage for anyone who starts the battle, and you once again say heavy has an advantage in direct combat, well guess what HE IS SUPPOSE TO, not even taking into consideration of the movement speed loss you also got to look at the heavies weapons, innacurate bullets hoses for TR, and for VS...disco....light...things, and NC get slow firing hard hitters, none of these weapons would stand out in a direct 1v1 against a 143 845 rpm gun and the only faction with a comparable heavy gun is TR with the MCG, to nerf the shield would require buffing the LMG's then there will be people crying about that, shield is fine i forget to use it 90% of the time anyway and people still cry that HA is ez mode when i kill them.

http://ps2.fisu.pw/activity/?world=17

Look at the KDR by class and tell me heavies need to be re-balanced with a straight face. Connery is the only server where heavies are doing what heavies are supposed to be doing. Based on the real stats engineers are what need to be "re-balanced". But that's silly too.

And you know what? Even with this change the Heavy will still have the advantage, if they use forethought to activate the shield before combat starts. As well, Wrel's video on that matter was about Clientside lag, yes it is intentional for more smooth gameplay but it is lag nonetheless. Instead of missing a target that is clearly in your line of sight, you shoot them where you see them, even if they are not there on their side. This can be used to one's advantage, and is also not in question with the thread.

What annoys me here are people that still look at this as a nerf... yes it has a delay but it also has a higher capacity which allows for more survivability. There are many ways to fix this suggestion, but everyone exclaiming "No it's fine don't nerf heavy" is what breaks this community. All people focus on is ways to disprove, no one thinks of ways to improve. For instance, what if this change also increases the recharge rate and decreases the passive energy drain? That way it becomes more viable to keep the shield on for longer periods of time. There are so many ways to make the idea better but all people see is an idea they don't like because it affects a class they use.

Back on release, SOE said they want Planetside 2 to have a lifespan of roughly 15 years... to do that they will have to make a lot of changes along the way, some a lot of players will disagree with. Just because something was implemented day 1 doesn't mean it shouldn't change later.

how nice it must be for you to magically control the beginning of every engagement, for the enemy to never turn the corner on you, you always get the drop on them.

however we aren't all wizards, for the other 99.9% of us that will regularly have an enemy come around the corner towards us,
you're proposing to make the shield utterly useless by giving it a 2-3 second activation time.

Because it is fine, don't nerf heavy.

And if this isn't a nerf or buff then it's nothing and not worthwhile. But any and all reading this easily see you're attempting to feed us with the nerf-spoon. There's a lot of imbalanced things in this game and a good 20 of them rank higher than "me no likey heavy"

A LA can jetpack over a wall flank the enemy killed 3 or 4 before the game even registers hes there and then probably get the 5th depending on how good both players are, you think that is balanced but a shield that lets you block 2 bullets isnt? They tried a delay on heavies shield already and some of the top players straight up said the class was terribly disadvantaged with it, that was a .5 second delay, you are proposing 6x that delay, this game has 2 big problems, 1 is people never pushing the point and to partly coincide with that people also refuse to leave their vehicle, now they are adding vehicle hacking which is gonna make less people leave their vehicle and if theirs a delay on a shield heavies arent going to be rushing points they are going to be hiding behind spawn shields (more than they already do).

Now you're assuming that all fights are "fair".
I don't care what class you bring to the table, a wizard is going to be pummeled by a fighter, a rogue, same thing, bard, same, cleric, same, because fighting is what a fighter does.
So let's say, common scenario, light assault on roof, gets first shot on heavy, heavy either runs or dies, there is no instantly turning around putting up shield and expecting to win if the light assault has good aim; infil, throws emp and kills a half health derp, no emps? Then use the sniper rifle while his shield is down since there is no concievable way that he would know that there is an infil in the field right about to shoot him, no snipers? ok, then SMG him down from surprise, again, if a heavy can run or not get dropped on then he has the upper hand.

So where is heavy good? When there are a good mix of other classes or when the heavy is good and there are very few players at the base. Straight up combat is the worst way to fight a heavy, but that's why we have infils, light assaults, engies with turrets for defense, max suits (but a group of heavies can deal with that) which leaves medics, which are not a combat oriented class but can make sure a heavy killing one guy isn't a big issue.

Now if that change goes through, the only thing heavies would do with that shield is defense, timing a run to cover pop out to shoot, 2 seconds is way too long, people would simply walk up and kill his injured booty and after the shield what else does the heavy have? Rocket launchers that take 3 people to quickly take down a vehicle? When people aren't motivated to play heavy, people will just C4, when people need to kill vehicles at range from a safe distance then people will pull heavy, but nothing is worth it in between.

How about rebalance the:
Ground PPA
ZoE Max
Spiker
Saron
Spiker
Cerberus

This is an awful change, the current shield is balanced and it serves it's role.

If let's say, we made those changes, then :

1. Everyone would pick Resist shield, since all of them would be activated before combat, but res would provide no delay, aprox. same health without nanoweave and you can slap another suit slot instead of nanoweave, and some other minor advantages like slightly faster move speed while active, that your effectiveness doesn't diminish while it's active and solely depends on your health and that it works very well with medkits.

2. There would be no variety between those shields, since they would all be activated before combat and Resist is the best in that area and it's primary role. Making them have a delay would make them discount resist shields that are worse in everything except for in scenarios where your opponent can't aim.

3. They would be useless. What would even be the point of using them if Resist is plain better in every single area?

4. Connection issues and lag would completely ruin them. Sometimes it happens that your connection quality drops and that you experience a bit of lag, but with this delay, it would be terrible.

5. The player would get wrecked a few times over until the over-shield kicks in, and counting in connection issues and lag, it'd be useless a lot of times as someone pointed out above.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it again. You'll just end up making it OP or nerfing it into uselessness.

i want old spiker back D: 6 shots of pure pain to bring to the head of an NC near you.
Oh just saw cerberus, yeeaa.....no that doesnt need a buff, nor does saron, PPA is fine imo i use it feels fine works decent, ZoE oh yeahhh they need to remove the damage drop off at range.

It would be better to make other combat classes on par(few aspects of them at least). Delays don't mix well in fast paced combat

And this is the problem right here. Just so everyone can understand : YOU SHOULD NOT WIN AN EQUAL ENGAGEMENT VS A HEAVY. They are the main infantry soldier. Not made for healing, repairing, flanking, or recon. They are made to be the frontline troops and as such should be able to kill any non heavy in an even 1v1 fight.

The stupidity is high.

What year is it guys???????????


I don't know anymore, all we need is a ZOE is OP thread.

ZOE OP plz nurf it kilt me lots and it hurts muh eyes!

Kinda like that?

Are you being unintentionally ironic?

nerfing the HA will have a terrible effect on other infantry, it already has.

people keep thinking each class as if it existed in vacuum. nerfing HA means nerfing medics. it means lowering the offensive abilities of an infantry push, reduces AV and AA on the field, increases the reliance on Infiltrators and medics to push.

in the end it makes infiltrators do cqc AI, and LAs do AV... which is many times more frustrating than Heavies. and just as effective, except morons keep thinking that the "i win" button is anything but a meme.

and stop being dense, a delay on a shield is the most moronic thing you could suggest. if heavies had a delay on the shield medics would immediately become better than heavies, how fun would it be if a push was compromised of only medics and engineers?

please, see the big picture and understand that lowering the effectiveness of a class will buff all others.

Ok, I'm going to do my best to sum up where you are wrong, and also why you are wrong.

This right here is so downright wrong it hurts and almost makes me think this is a troll thread its that bad. No skill counter? You have to be joking. Have you even heard of advantageous positioning and flanking? Being able to do that is a skill.
What's more, you seem to have a problem with two players on equal footing fighting it out, and the Heavy winning 100% of the time. You know what? The Heavy should win 100% of the time in these circumstances. They were very literally created for this exact purpose, being able to beat others in a straight up 1v1 fight. Sure, they can blow up MAXes and vehicles, but the fact remains that they are the front line soldier with the 1 on 1 advantages.

As a matter of fact, at longer ranges, the Medic's healing ability, combined with their superior weapons, often make them better choices for ranged combat than a Heavy Assault. They don't lose any movement speed, which, at longer ranges, is a HUGE advantage, because the difference between being able to hit something slow or fast increases exponentially. The heal will also give them about one more bullet. It doesn't sound like much, but seeing as you have a problem with HA overshield, which blocks 3-4 bullets, it should matter. As for Infils cloak being bad, the fact that they can't attack isn't entirely relevant, because they can get into advantageous positions without being seen easily. In a FPS, that's big. It gives them the best survivability.

This is the heart of the problem, and what your entire thread is based around.
This presents the problem that being the least mobile class (short of MAX), the Heavy Assault can't dictate when a fight will start, which means they cannot apply any reliable forethought to turning their overshield on before a fight starts. And do you know how you beat a Heavy at the moment? You flank him. You know what this idea reinforces? Flanking the HA. It will not change anything in how to beat a Heavy Assault. If you manage to flank your opposing HA player and they still win the fight, then the fault is not in the overshield, but in your skill.
Now, asking for a delay of 2-3 seconds is straight up, 100%, plain and downright stupid. The average TTK of a gun is 0.5 seconds. This means that with most guns, you could kill that Heavy six times before his overshield activates. This isn't calculating headshots, raising the theoretical maximum amount of times you could kill them before overshield activated to twelve.
So, you think, "Ok then, we just make the delay 0.4ish seconds". Well, that doesn't work either. The reason why is because everyone has their own built in pseudo-delay. It's called reaction time. The average human has a reaction time of around 0.25 seconds. For the sake of caffeine hyped gamers, I'll put it at a generous 0.2 seconds. Then there's lag and stuff, but that's difficult, so I'll leave it out. So if someone was landing perfect chest shots, they'd be breaking the opponents shield by the time they started reacting.
For HAs running NMG and adrenaline, this means that they can turn around and start fighting on even ground. Of course, if the person was smart enough to attack from an angle, then the HA will lose even more precious time looking for the opponent. For someone using Resist Shield, the fight is kind of over right there, short of them being an insanely good shot, or the enemy is bad at shooting.
The other problem with this idea is that it will be MUCH harder to hold and defend a room or point. Heavies that are attacking a room will be able to activate their overshield before the fight starts, but the defenders will lose way too many people before their own overshields activate.