Can we get a tank buff without sacrificing anything please?

The Tanks were not OP & also Infantry dying to things happens.

Splash has a purpose & Important role.

Crowd control(group killing) & supression.

Without it doing well are you really surprised Infantryside grew seemly stronger?

AI weapons are designed to kill infantry, if they are no longer good at killing/countering infantry, infantry become stronger against the counter.

Having been killed by infantry while tanking and vice versa plenty, I feel that the interactions between Infantry and Armor are fine for the most part. The main use for tanks are shelling (which is what they'll always do no matter what, because it's what's safest. Add a buff to their health and they're going to be nigh-invincible to infantry at a distance. C4 kills tankers, yes, however tankers like to pretend that there's no effort in doing so.

It's very situational (except in Hossin, where there's so much cover that it's pretty much a no-go zone for tanks) and requires the tank to be adequately distracted. After all, they're faster than LAs, they're stronger (the LA will be shot down by the tank's infantry buddies), and they're able to kill the LA at any distance. The LA can try over and over again, ruining their K/D in the process and eventually destroy the tank by tossing the brick and detonating (which takes a few seconds before you can press the button) before being shot down by any number of threats.

What I'm saying is that, like a MAX, tanks are there for support and taking out enemy armor, spawns, and infantry that is in the open. I hardly use my prowler, yet it's incredibly easy on Indar or Esamir to just kill non-stop. By the time you die you can just pull another thanks to having almost (if not all) your nanites back.

But what really needs to be discussed for balance is AA vs air. ESF armor is apparently as resistant to flak as a MBT is. If you're hit by a rocket you lose maybe a fifth of your health. I mean seriously, it's just absurd. Have mobility be their safety, not tank armor.

EDIT: Oh, I do think HE needs to be buffed. Have it at the very least a larger radius with the same damage or more damage with the same radius. Though I say that cautiously, I've seen too many tanks just shelling spawn rooms with HE rounds.

I think you're making too many assumptions, the same flawed assumptions the devs made: IF people did this OR people SHOULD do that.

There is no IF or SHOULD. What you or I may think as logical doesn't always apply to the masses, otherwise how would I be in a position to farm infantry so easily, one-handed like? It was effortless to say the least.

IF THERE WAS A PERFECT WORLD, IF PEOPLE DID WHAT THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO DO, IF PEOPLE ALWAYS RAN SQUADS, IF PEOPLE SPAWNED ELSEWHERE ANS RETURNED WITH VEHICLES.

Yeah, that's all nice and such, but the reality of the matter is and never will be that case.

The masses just want to jump into the world and shoot their guns. Too bad most of those players were probably scared off early on.

I play solo sniper/LA lately. I am rarely killed by tanks even when my sniping perch is able to be hit. Most of the tanking I see is anti sunderer, I see more sunderers farming infantry then straight up tanks doing it.

Additionally if you are in a tower and it is surrounded by tanks now the new placement of the forcefield protects a good deal of the infantry whereas before tanks could send rounds down that lane killing pushes. Or if the fight is camped, just redeploy and get mines and whatnot ready for the coming enemy forces.

But as for the OP I ask this...If tanks are being pulled to kill other tanks and vehicles then most of the time they are up against similarly powerful entities right? So why buff them if they are relatively in-line with each other?

A whole lot of, infantry side deserves better here. Jesus, if I can use my tank with out running like a chicken away from 1 LA with C4.

Or even just more radius and stretch the dmg degredation so that the additional targets barely take any damage but are at least properly suppressed and continue taking damage...

I personally care more about bumping up HE and HEAT damage a little (nothing drastic: I'd be happy with 10% to start) over receiving an armor buff.

But do you remember when C4 was bugged and wouldn't destroy tanks with two sticks?

Tanks got a lot closer to the action those short two weeks before all the C4 fairies. . . voiced their concerns on the forums.

I know people love their vehicles, but if we ever went back to the ridiculous days there will always be people like me who will min/max any game mechanic to utter stupidity, and farm like there's no tomorrow, raining misery on anyone and everyone simply because I can and/or got fed up.

Then other people do the same and it's back to square one.

The only solution I can think of is nerf infantry AV. Heck nerf it to the ground, but get rid of HE completely. Vehicles can kill vehicles.

The way things are now, with so many easy ways to reload ammo mid fight without moving, having the ability to carry loads of ammo and repair so easily anywhere, any buff will be exacerbated beyond any level seen during the ridiculous days of beta or release.

Yes, I believe 100%. Not a troll post. Tanks have been the biggest whiners PS2 has had since launch. Bar none, not even ESF pilots whine like tankers do. They have the most powerful weapons in the game, but they always want more.

At some point, I would call that "rules of the game." These were not written down or spoken, that is true, but they were a structure. Rules are a structure that should be designed to impose sense and order. If you don't allow enough freedom, the game becomes boring; but, if you don't enforce what should be coherent rules enough you approach Calvinball. If you change the rules a lot, and the structure breaks down into something else, eventually you're no longer playing the same game, even if you have the same deck of cards.

The important thing is that the people who complained are still not happy, the people who "were doing it right" from a certain point of view of how the game would work are not happy either, and the changes also annoyed what should have been an unrelated third group of players who are also unhappy now. That's not a success for anyone.

So the people that are stat padding as heavy assault and MAX suits are acceptable? Please take your bias else where.

I believe the only response to this statement of an obvious fact is:



Course the treatment of vehicles in this game is exactly why you're bleeding player base.

coaxial kobalts for MBTs/lightnings would give them extra close range lethality and defense for themselves and allied vehicles against exposed infantry (i.e infantry attacking vehicles or trying to mine Sunderers) would work well against C4 attackers (LA or not) would provide defense and suppression against peekaboo heavy assaults -without- affecting longer ranged AV attackers such as maxes or heavy assaults.

C4 attacks would still be able to kill tanks the difference being the attacker has to play smart instead of just copying aircraft tactics of attacking from an angle the driver can't see. They'd still kill tankers that weren't careful but alert and active tankers could spot them and reverse or advance to fire on the LA above them.

It would give tanks more direct defenses against short range attackers while providing AP tanks an additional options in the role of supporting other vehicles against infantry at close range.

this.

its not about damage, its about splash. i honestly would love it if my HE gun would have its old splash back but dealing only 80 damage.

HE was always about infantry dispersal, and breaking up room camps. as it is now, its completely useless. even if you predict lots of infantry over vehicles, you still go for AP. because in the end only a direct hit will give you a kill. why would you use HE, when the projectile travels slower, reloads slower and does negligible damage against enemy vehicles?

still, i have to be honest, i don't like shelling infantry. i hope we don't go back to that.

i like tanks being predators of tanks, and other vehicles. i think what we really need is either some artillery vehicle, or some anti infantry turret for the flash (and no, HE flash, even when is TIMES better than MBT HE, its still bad... my vote is for a minigun turret, or an alternate fire mode for the Skyguard.). having some other vehicle fill the role of infantry dispersal, will reinforce the role of the MBTs as tank killers by giving them more targets, and increase the demand for having them in the front line. and we can finally refund people their investment on HE turrets.

My point is that we have to separate infantry play from MBT play even more. does infantry need answers to other vehicles? sure, and they have those. MBTs should concern themselves with other vehicles sneaking up on them, outmaneuvering them or other MBTs on vantage points.

currently i have logged a good 350 hours into a Vanguard, 99% of that with an AP gun. at the end of a run i kill probably 75% infantry, not because i go after them, but because as an MBT, at any given time there's going to be at least 4 - 5 ppl with their sights fixed on you. because they know, all they have to do is get close.

in the end, the real reason tankers want C4 gone from the game is because all C4 does is tempt people into running at you, jumping at you, pulling an ESF to drift over you, or suicide crash a flash onto you... and to begin with, you weren't looking to kill them at all!. the reason they got killed trying to C4 you was pure and simply because they had the tool and wanted to make use of it, even if it works 1% of the time against a real tank driver.

Oh okay.

So I guess then because the "let's nerf all lethality" campaign is being abandoned, tanks will be getting their HE/HEAT cannons reverted back to their pre-August 4 levels?

I mean only seems fair, doesn't it? If you enter into a contract based on giving up some valuable consideration, give up that valuable consideration, and then have the contract rescinded... doesn't it seem right to return that valuable consideration?

When are we going to have HE/HEAT reverted back then? I don't think it would be too difficult. Say by the next content patch? That sounds good.








Seriously though.

Look Radar, if whatever people over there thought that nerfing tank HE/HEAT would make PS2 more popular, they were wrong. The August 4 patch did nothing to improve population numbers... in fact those numbers would drop until November or so (I might be remembering the specific month wrong). There never was a problem of tanks spamming explosives at infantry as evidenced by the population numbers. If anything nerfing those things chased away even more people.

PS2 needs to have an identity distinct from the other CoD/BF franchises where vehicles are jokes. PS2 should be a combined arms game where war is fought in all its complexity and awesomeness. And we can't have that if SOE/DBG keeps lying to and mistreating tankers.

Because the alternative of catering to infantry players in an attempt to out-CoD CoD is a losing strategy. It's what's been tried, and has become a proven failure. You just can't keep those sorts of players, because the next shiny new FPS game will take them and their wallets.

But what is PS2 good at? What is PS2's natural advantage, what PS2 offers that no other game really does? That is combined arms on a massive scale. And believe it or not, there is a demographic of players out there who enjoy these sorts of games. These players are naturally drawn to PS2 because unlike infantry players who simply care about a FPS experience, PS2 offers something complex and beautiful that no other game does.



Combined arms players stay with PS2, because they're addicted to the thing that PS2 uniquely offers (well apart from the upcoming WH40K game, but that's looking worse day after day). We keep playing... as infantry, as tanks, and even lately I've been taking to the air. We stay when all those people who just needed an FPS fix have left PS2 long behind.

That's the player base that PS2 really needs.

Oh, I hate the HA I win button... people think it's skill but it isn't. Max... meh, a block of C4 will do them good. Oh, and as for a bias... same to you bub.

You're not very good at lying.

Infantry are meant to be squishy, THEYRE REGULAR HUMAN BEINGS. The fact that someone can pull a rocket launcher all sodding day is stretching it as it is. We are tanks, we SHOULD be in a armored vehicle with high powered weapons to kill anything, vehicles or infantry, in our way. But we trade mobility for power and fall to determined groups of infantry or other tanks.
But that's not the case. We are afraid of single guys with two sticks of c4. We can't even get close to a base because of the c4 and loads of lock ons, and yet you DARE ACCUSE US OF SHELLING YOUR SPAWNS when infantry sit around it tossing in grenades and rockets. Our weapons struggle to kill Sunderers. THEY ARE TROOP TRANSPORTS, AND YET THEY ARE STRONGER THAN MBTS.
As I write this, I thought "Imagine if infantry was as nerfed tanks have been." They would wield laser pointers and cardboard armor.
So think about your nonstop complaining has done to us and then think about how much infantryside is ruining the game, not tanks.