Why I think PS2 failed...

This game has a point. Every base in this game has a point and some have three.

Watch interviews with Tayradactyl. Pretty much her whole schitck is how horrible she is and how aggressively she wishes to not to learn how to play. Really listen to what she is saying though, and the fact of the matter is, she can hardly get through half a dozen words without saying something snide about the community, how rude they are, how unrealistic and crass it is of them to question the game making money. You also have that one bespectacled guy that they have been pulling out recently who pretty much said during his introduction that he didn't like communities, he liked games.

I recall hearing that at one point during OMFG too. Really looking for these sentiments in old stuff, you start to see the tone in it turn about, february this year from casual "Haha, we hate you guys too" to something that in my opinion was a tad bit more pointed.

Look to be 100% honest, this is my opinion after reviewing so much stuff on the game's development over the last 2 years. It could be something I am imagining, but it bothers me how much after it first dawned on me, that I started to notice it.

lol "point". If you can't find a point in this game then you should probably give up on gaming, because you'll never find a point in any game.

The game stopped being entertaining.

Massively buggy patches, promised content that's been pushed back or perhaps cancelled, now the game crashes more then it ever did previously. And possibly the worst aspect- its become a console game.

The promise of PS 2 was that it was a PC game- PC games often have more depth then console titles. Now PS2 is a bit schizophrenic, in that its not sure what it wants to be, some last minute hybrid COD/BF4/PS2/PS4.

It has some entertainment value, but not enough unique qualities to develop a large loyal base. I might dabble in PS2 when a decent update arrives, but for now im off looking for another title where to put my money.

To anyone looking for another F2P game that is squad based, I recommend trying Ghost Recon Phantoms. Its pretty decent, and a PC only title.

Never find a point in any game? This statment only works if you are talking about a pure sandbox game, and even then it's a shaky statment to make.

The epitome of "Pointless game" is minecraft. And even minecraft: You build up a base so you can get the resources to advance to different realms to get different kinds of resources and better defeat your enemies in the world, until you fight the ultimate evil monsters at the end. The point is the advancement of your situation and the evolution of those goods you use to protect yourself and expand your base.

Lets look at MMORPGs, the point is to grind up your character, but in RPGs you have a bigger world around you that you can fit into. Good RPGs will be designed in a way to encourage people to push their own structure onto the game, develop worlds or on a smaller scale trades and networks that allow them to accomplish their goals through multiple different ways. Really good ones will allow people through pacifism or militarism to get what they want, and nothing is held back. Bad ones focus only on combat, but either way you still have that progression of enemies, growing greater in difficulty that provide bigger and better rewards that push you to advance that character.

Most single player games have a point, because you have a storyline to get through.

Co-op games fall into the same category as single player games, because it's a storyline or difficult missions.

Most of the time in multi-player shooters, you are getting better so you can unlock better gear, so you can accomplish your goals easier, or get yourself higher scores, or improve the standing of your clan...

NONE of this is in PS2. It's the most pointless game out, bar something like Farmville. The only thing pushing you is XP, but the accumulation of XP has no end goal. You can only get equally mediocre things, that are never objectively better than what a new player has, in order to draw new players in. There is no advancement of your group outside of stats, no benefit to doing so in the game. There is no overarching guide to how you are doing because things are so easy to do that it's effectively meaningless to capture territory.

It's a team game that is based around personal achievement, and no personal reward for working better together, beyond again, those flighty momentary achievements that are undone by 2 minutes of inattention, likely caused by them being railroaded to another site to fight.

Numbers rule everything, and anything that could blunt the effect of numbers is removed because working together too effectively is poison. Nothing can be allowed to persist in this game. So it's a TDM game, that has no real boundary between the maps.

Nailed it.

You've got to wonder why we're still lacking continent warping.
The 2000 player count is a myth, it never worked, the servers couldn't handle it, nor the players, and was ultimately reduced without ever being mentionned in the patchnotes.

Indar could have been cut in three continents, the limit could've been set to a confortable 600 players per continent and things just getting scaled up from there. PS2 is (was ?) an ambitious project, but that's also a prime example of biting more than one can chew.

Priorities went wrong when sheer size primed on game-defining mechanics.
Maintaining the illusion that Planetside was all about numbers and size when in fact it flat out destroyed other games in term of innovation and depth in its time and for the 10 years after.

Now all you've got to do is stand around a particular area to capture a base. Screw NTU, screw hacking, screw combat engineeering, to hell with linked benefits, screw the inventory, Cert system was boring, let everyone spawn every vehicule as they please regardless of the consequences.


PS2, you've been entertaining for a while, you're very lucky that Battlefield has took a nosedive to the abysmal depths of the FPS genre. but it's been a year and a half now and your **** still hasn't gotten together.
Meanwhile, my friendlist is empty, everyone moved on, and your main focus on the roadmap is either:
-To bring in more new players
-To generate gratification with new medals and badges
-To enlarge the subscribe button

What you're talking about with T-Ray is not imagining things. I've talked with T-Ray before, and he didn't like his logic being questioned. When I brought up one of my Ultimate threads which suggested the other developers should try to post on the official forums like Luperza. After he read it he suggested that that was a statement of ignorance since that was her job... I didn't say anything at the time, but I should've been like "Well that doesn't stop you or the other developers from posting on reddit and twitter on a regular basis now does it?"

I also got a lame excuse about how the Prowler model would have to be totally redesigned if they tried to center the turret, or some nonsense like that. Also that the Prowler's turret was once centered, but they felt that was too much like a standard military tank so they changed it. Gotta love the logic on that one, "Hey we want to make this tank look cool, unique, and futuristic military what should we do? Oh I know, lets leave the crappy box design a child could draw in and instead of making it look cool and futuristic lets just slap the turret on the side . I mean no one has a tank like that, and now it looks totally from the future right!?!" *face palms*

He even made a joke about the Prowler being like a card board box a few weeks ago after he put a new wood camo on it. Biggest mistake was having the lead creative art developer have a bias for one faction, for which the longest time T-Ray had a Vanu icon in his developer profile. TR couldn't have their black color from PS1 because it provided a "tactical" advantage. Then Vanu get an overhaul that basically makes them Black and get given the best camo coverage by a mile. Meanwhile infiltrators get a bra, and TR infiltraitor gold trim camo isn't even a new set of armor but just composite painted gold. Still can't believe the atrocities NC/TR infiltrators have gone through.

Anyhow I agree with you. When the developers get on here I see people get thrilled and try to give feedback. However since the developers seem to be releasing crap patches and crap updates (See the Liberator and ESF "Update") I doubt they want to face the community and face some well deserved questions and criticism.

I wouldn't say the game failed, but would say failing. Most of this is due to bugs, game performance, knee jerk balance fixes(Over nerfing the Harasser), changing things that didn't need changed (Nanoweave change, Flak armor Buffed again, increased volume on the LA Jump Pack, Saron HRB), suggestion changes that don't need to be changed (Heavy Shield Warm up time, MCG on PTS). All of this stacks up and angers the user base.

The biggest one has been lack of content, and this game going into a state of Development hell during the Optimization they did between August 2013 to December 2013, which should have seen some of this could have been touched on back December 2012 to August 2013 instead of stop all development just to focus on one thing. Now I am not saying I am not grateful for the map improvements done to Indar, Esamir, and Amerish, its just that these changes do no keep players, they will only bring people back for a week or so. Once Hossin is put in I really hope they focus on intercontinental lattice with Empire Sanctuaries like Planetside 1 and remove the Warp Gate Base so capturing a contentinent would actually mean something and bring in the meta game.

As for what is going on with Development in PS2 I feel their lacking direction and being pulled in to many directions. I see alot Battlefield influences as well as some CoD influence which was to bring in people from those smaller match games, however these players are not the type to stick with the game for long. You want the people who is more willing to stick it out, and game for the longer term as their more likely to spend the money. These people are those that came from an experience that Battlefield and CoD can't provide large, epic, continues fights; now who are these people? They are the Larger outfit types 666 Devil Dogs, SG, BWC, AT, GOTR, people in these outfits forge friendships and will keep playing because its more fun to play together then it is alone.

Planetside 1 had many great concepts that can easily be applied here that would provide something no other game has: Hack/Jacking enemy vehicles(something rumored to be on the way) Imagine a infiltrator sneaking up on a Lockdown Prowler at the rear of their armor column hacking the vehicle causing the Driver/Gunner to be kicked of his own vehicle, then to be killed by said infil who now is using the jacked tank on the unaware armors rear armor. Looting equipment from enemies: A Terrain Heavy running around with a VS Lasher, or a VS Heavy running around with an MCG or Jackhammer. Bunker/Pill Box: Something the facilities has in PS1 that guarded the gates in, these could be added into the tunnels system used from the tech plants to provide better facility defense with out complete overhauling the base design. Crewed Vehicles: We all seen how powerful the Harasser was on its launch, it wasn't due to its firepower but its ability to move and shot something that is far easier in an independent driver/gunner config then the Driver is also the gunner that the Medium tanks are now. If the Medium tanks were like the Harasser is it likely wouldn't have been as powerful as it was.

The game hasn't failed. Its about to get a serious shot in the arm once the PS4 version goes live. I think there have been missteps along the way. Firstly, they should have never used the Planetside IP. There's too much baggage with it. Planetside 1 was a nitch game with a rabid player base. Planetside 2 was never allowed to become the game it should because loud mouth Planetside 1 bitter vets with their "I told you so's" and back-seat game designing. We could have had Hossin and continent locking by now if Higby hadn't capitulated to the latticers. The lattice was an unnecessary sideways game play element that forced SOE to divert resources away from valuable metagame content. And now we are a year behind development schedule because SOE had to stop everything to latticify everything.

Sure, the engine needed optimization, but that probably could have been held off until after continent locking was implemented. Indar lattice forced the issue because once we started cramming everyone into Vanu Archives it became very clear that the engine couldn't support the lattice.

I'm a big fan of SOE and PS2. I was an EQ player for 13 years and enjoyed every minute of it. Yet, I do agree with the OP to a degree. I already have 1 BR100 toon (NC) and almost another as VS, with a BR 70 TR as well. I play because it's a fun game, but it's lacking a lot in the emotional investment and character development department. There's just really nothing to get 'into' once you've bought everything you need, cert wise.

There's also nothing to differentiate my character from another except what cosmetics I've purchased. There no sense of developing yourself in areas of expertise as you would a traditional MMO. If you have the time & the certs you can potentially be everything, all the time, just the same as everyone else, it's just a terminal visit away.

I believe SOE is aware of this and it's part of the idea behind implants, to present us with an interesting choice with a very obvious opportunity cost associated with it. They need to further expound upon that concept and make it apply to other various aspects of gameplay.

Another thing that has bothered me since release, is continent caps. The net effect/benefit of a continent cap is negligible. So, it's really more of just a sense of pride for your team that motivates individuals to care, but pride alone is not a very powerful motivator. Continent caps and large scale team goals in general need to be far more compelling in order to provide a meaningful overall context for perpetual battles.

Aside from all this, remember...the main point is to have fun.

I mean, everything in the game was focused on personal achievement, but it's just so shallow that it's impossible for it to hold people... AND they marketed the whole thing as a Team Game. Team game, focused on personal experience.

I have probably 5 games my community now plays, that provide a million times more engagment than PS2, with teams that at least know what they want their game to be.

I have made hundreds of suggestions, I played diplomat, I tried to be polite to the devs for So long... To be frank, I have turned to other gaming communities and gotten a much more polite and considered response from devs, mods, and even community group leaders...

When the zombie game thing was announced, I said that it was totally useless to pay attention to this game anymore. Tonight they announced Clegg was leaving PS2 to join H1Z1's team... Clegg designed most of the bases I like, with Hossin going live soon... and it takeing a year + to make a continent, I may as well go play something halfway entertaining, and maybe when Searhus is introduced, log back in to see if this game has found itself some kind of focus.

The biggest problems with the game are:

1. Stability issues
2. As hostile an environment for new players as the surface of the sun. There isn't even a tutorial for any of the vehicles.
3. Essential equipment is locked behind a level progression that's glacial slow.
4. Crappy level design for a game based entirely around domination game mode.

The last one is the kicker. Why have so much open space around facilities? No one is going to go there because there's no reason to. Hell, flanking is impossible in many cases because the capture points are usually inside of buildings that have only two doors. SoE created a massive world that's impressive to look at and take a walk around, but all the actual gameplay takes place in corridors.

The point of this game is to give those of us with an otherwise mundane real life existence something fun to do...

The excitement PS2 used to have for me is waning fast recently. The developers seems to make a big deal about listening to feedback from the community but the biggest things players have asked for since release are still not a part of the game 18 months later.

The game is stalling, the development cycle is wrong and the QA is terrible. I have never known a game to have so many patches that introduce so many bugs and instability into the game.

SOE "Where sorry comes before anything else"

I have not played in a week and have no desire to play again for the foreseeable future because frankly I no longer trust the developers to know what is best for the game and I would rather invest time into other games.

You may think my single opinion is unimportant but I am a long time member, I have spent £200+ on this game and have heavily supported it in the past and I like many other paying players am losing faith and attraction to the game and many players have left for reasons similar to things mentioned in this thread so my opinion isn't singular. If SOE can't keep long time financial supporters they are doing something wrong, unfortunately they seem to only care about new players, which whilst don't get me wrong are important but long time players are just as critical to the games success

It is sad that the only thing that might save PS2 in the long run is success on the PS4, in the short term however they need to very quickly re evaluate their content production, their relationship with the community, bias developers need removing from head positions (T-Ray example) and their QA team need a massive kick up the ****

Every single FPS game has a point, shooting people. You're all misled by fancy tacticool stuff.
However, what this game fails at is the stability and perfomance to a certain degree.

double post just coz it also belongs here

fail... so far compared to ps1 - epic fail!

I do believe the problem with the game and decline is because of stuff not there that should be. Like better play mechanics and meta, but they're coming. Another problem I think is just the playerbase. I just think how it was hyped and stuff that it attracted those type of COD kids who have the attention span of a peanut and commitment to boot.

jesus, more people are being taken off the team??? It already seems like an ambitious feat to get the game to where should have been a year ago with the pace they are going at. And with all tangents they tend to go off on with redundant balance passes and needless new weaponry.... yeeesh.

With many of the resent "revamps/balances" and the attitude that you are describing the devs has having reminds me of a situation I had at work bartending at this bar that specialized in craft and mircobrews. A guy walked in and ask for a beer, he said he wanted something good (one of those people) so I gave him my favorite on tap which was a dark bourbon barrel stout (it was a good beer, got a rating of 92). He took a sip and immediately started saying the beer sucked and that I should learn what a good beer is. Being professional about it I asked "OK, what other beer you would like?" He told me Bud Light.... At that point the internal face palm I was trying to suppress was too big to hold in so I said "Coming right up!" poured the stout in a pitcher, filled the rest with water, and handed it to him.

With the ease of insulting people on the internet, there are thousands of 'these guys' rudely demanding stupid stuff, so much that many of the good constructive criticisms get drowned out leaving only the most toxic settling on top. Hell I can't blame the devs for not liking the community at all, especially recently. Granted they should still be professional about it, but man, it's hard for me to be outraged by there remarks. Heck there was an article about some devs of another game quitting because of the feedback their community gave them, even death threats!

This is something that I imagine is lost on most people, but should probably be mentioned: MasonSTL, NinjaTurtle, EliteEskimo, and I... we're not people who have traditionally been against this game.

This should probably be one of those things SOE actually recognizes as a problem, when it's hardcore supporters are saying it's off track. It isn't just us either. I know 2 BR 100 players that QUIT and refuse to play this game. I know 1 recent BR 100 player who lead up a group of really highly coordinated people who recently quit and put his whole group on Hiatus

These points are ultimately lost on the devs, who genuinely do not seem to understand what we want. These people left, and other people are leaving because they Just Seriously Do Not Have Faith The Dev Team Cares About Their Opinion, Or Will Take The Game Someplace Good.

Also I'm going to say this as well, in the past week SOE has lost somewhere in the area of at least $1,200 from my community, from people quitting the game. I myself have spent upwards of $400 since this game came out supporting mine and my wife's account, that is all SOE will see out of me unless it really changes.

It should also be mentioned that the only way I suspect we will get a response on this, some actual consideration of what we are saying, is by calling attention to it, and a response would be some kind of blithe acknowledgment of what we are saying, as if just chiming in that the devs are reading will suffice. Higby, T-ray, etc. just why ARE you so bloody terrified of your own community?