Welcome to Rezside! Rez grenades are ruining this game!

oh god this was a fun watch ahaha

Yea i pissed myself when i saw that too

We've been doing that for as far as I can remember. If people start copying a succesful tactic, does it becomes OP ? I've never seen zerglings do it, and very little outfits. It requires the medics to stay far behind to survive, because the bandolier is actually very dangerous is tight spaces. That's basic teamplay, but outside the reach of most outfits and all zerglings.

Otherwise I still don't understand what prevents you from countering that with frags, concussions or sticky bandoliers.

And also : is it the most urgent thing to fix ?

Let's try to make this thread a bit more productive before I have to close it.

Oh the great and holy revive, how we love thee...or not?

What about the Medic's capability do you love? What do you detest? If you don't like something, give an example of why and how you could see this being resolved.

For example:

• I often think the time to revive should be slower than the time to kill whether this be from a revive grenade or a heal tool. This gives the attacker an advantage against a medic, but still supplies the medic with the ability to revive at a decent pace.

^ See. Helpful, yet opinionated!

Your turn!

Allow players to knife enemy corpses to remove them from the battlefield and prevent revives. When I clear a room of 6 guys, I don't want some medic droppodding in and tossing a res nade in through the door if I've had plenty of alone time to make sure they were DEAD.

One thing about the Medic which I don't know if it has been brought up on this thread already but:

Am i the Only one that noticed that Revive grenades are 45 Resources now?
And once were 100!

I've known this since long tbh but never really paid much attention to it, but man they sure are cheap now, If you think about it then I guess much more people have started using them, as with everything else the more the game goes on the more shotguns / rocketpods we see around, it's inevitable to have more of this stuff in the ordinary gameplay, along with the improved average medic with the highest level of the medigun.

You're not the first to think about this but can you imagine how unethical this would look? LET'S GO BUTCHER DEAD PEOPLE CORPSES!
scary lol, even using the medigun on dead bodies would look totally lame

Yes yes the enemy has a lot of people using rez nades we got that from the OP.

If you do not have the numbers to kill them when half are on the ground waiting then you got outlpayed. If they keep doing drops and throwing rez nades, take a infil run in and throw down mines. I can think of hundreds of ways to counter that, you would rather change the game so you don't have to think up a new strat.

I find this whole thread a whine thread, there is a mechanic that is available to EVERYONE in the game and your saying its broken because you can't counter it. How about if your outnumbered and they are using strats like this, you gather some friendly troops and fight back?

I just don't understand the, I can't counter it please nerf attitude.

Though I thoroughly don't agree that there's any kind of problem, with grenades or the revive itself, how about this as a solution:

Make revive time scale inverse-proportionately with the TTK. So if your comrade was killed instantly by a tank round to the face, it's gonna take them nanites a while to piece him back together. 5 second to rez here. If his health was wittled away over the course of 30 seconds, it was more a case of 'straw -> camels back' and there's hopefully less work to be done. 2 seconds, let's say.

This would mean that in the instances where people are whining (10 guys run into a room, get pwned by the defenders, then the medic dance begins), the rezs would take too long. On the other hand, in the instances people aren't complaining about (finding a random guy dead somewhere?? - I'll break here to say I totally don't understand what peoples problem is, like, when they think medics ought to be useful if not at the front lines... ) the rez would be quicker.

The same thing could be done with distance from killer (divided by type - so if a pump action shotgun user killed you - probably from within 2m as that's the only range they work at - and is now 200m away, fast rez... If a sniper killed you and is ONLY 200m away, slow rez).

The hilarious thing about both solutions though is that they help in the situations where rezs are helping at the front line, and not when the line is fighting over a long distance, and yet to me, the only time medics piss me off is when I'm 300m away and it's just a total stalemate... Ah well, they'll come for that next, eh?





Please Luperza do keep in mind, all of these threads are just nonsense distractions as there are no really gamebreaking imbalances except the ones we're now bored of speaking about: Strikers, bugged lock ons, the TR ESRL, that launcher that fires the 5 rounds, the TR's new experimental 5 shot railgun that can shoot through terrain and ignore flares (though we like that it makes it look like there's a rocket in flight so the enemy doesn't realise they're going to be hit by a railgun any second even if the rocket is heading in the other direction - +1), oh, and the mossy being supremely OP with its new nosegun and not having to fly against the Striker. And UBGL's being totally UP.

Here's an excellent thread that illustrates some of the major problems:

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/change-medic-revives.149516/

Simple ideas :
- Remove the bandolier from the medic class, stops the rez spam without the need for any fancy code
- Make healing faster than reviving, that's long overdue and incoherent imo

With the time to kill in this game so slow, and the emphasis on team play. Medics are fine. You should be moving in to prevent rezes.

This is just bads who's egos are hurt when the other side uses team work and their rambo kill streak is erased.

I'll take a shot.

Reviving a downed soldier should take longer than it takes to heal one.

In fact it should be an alternative choice to respawning- do I get back in action from the spawn tube, or from right here in the action?
There should be a 5-10 second waiting time after confirming the revive before the player getting back into action to enforce this rule, and the medic should be limited to reviving one person per those 5-10 seconds.

The purpose of this is to tie down the medic, to have him focus on helping one guy at a time, and as such not allowing for spamming revives left and right.
The side which does the reviving should be the side that owns the area (be it a room, corridor, area under a tree, whatever) after the shootout and not as an instant boost to staying power while the shootout is still taking place.

That way control of the battlefield and covering friendlies becomes much more important, and the medic has to use his assault rifle just as much as his revive tool to be an effective unit.

Revive grenades might need a slight radius reduction so they could only fix a squad and not a battalion, but they should otherwise remain unchanged and get everyone in range on their feet quickly.
They do cost resources, so they should be superior to the regular heal gun.

P.S. But hey, what do I know, I'm mostly a tanker...

You guys seem to be completely missing what's going on. I agree that medics, with their AR's, are designed to be the general infantry class. Hell, I would LOVE there to be more medics on the field in general, healing and reviving people in battle. From what it sounds like, there are servers that do not have a problem with how res grenades are being used, but those are the ones who can't really imagine how ****** it is to deal with what res grenades are capable of. The rest seem to think it is a legitimate tactic, but then again, marauder/lock-on spam is also a very effective tactic, but they are ruining the game for a significant amount of people, for little actual gain for anyone.

Imagine this: A platoon of mostly medics make there way into a building or other location through foot zerging/squad deploy/beacon/etc. Note that drop pods can be shot down, but is not something that can be done effectively in any circumstance. Now, you may be able to kill all the medics, you usually do, actually. Assuming you're in a gen room, or other location you're actually trying to clear them out of, you're standing amongst the dead, fighting to the last man. One living medics throws a res grenade into the confined location, bringing up at least half a dozen medics (remember there is a whole platoon in this room, and yes this is a commonplace tactic on my server), at least one of them throwing a res grenade, bringing up more medics, who throw res grenades, ad nauseum until one side is completely gone. With squad deploy/beacons this can go on basically forever, meaning you can have a full platoon of infantry (one of the most effective units in the game) in good cover whenever you want, often with little actual effort.

The only good counter to this is to come in with a similar amount of medics, so you can res at the same rate that they are, but imagine how boring and stupid it is to play dead body whack-a-mole for the ten minutes it takes for all medics to run out of res grenades. Valid tactic or no, it is not fun.

NOT FUN.

Yes, it is a very effective tactic, but it's bad. It's not thinking tactically, it's exploiting poor game mechanics. Sure, any faction can do it, so it's balanced, but do we really want a game where spamming res grenades is a thing? It's really, really sad that it has to be addressed, but it's on par with the striker and the marauder in how bad it can be for the game. As far as a solution, I suggest that a person can only be revived three times before resupplying/some time elapsed, or that dead bodies can be permanently gibbed somehow.

It's the "What I'm doing isn't working, so the enemy must be OP" mentality that afflicts a majority of gamers these days.
Once upon a time, gamers embraced the challenge of adapting their tactics to take on a difficult game mechanic. Now if their first instinct doesn't win them the game, it's the game that must change, not themselves.

Here's a great analysis of this type of gamer, though his subjects exist in the Bronze League of Starcraft II:
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=313577

As being the leader of all that silliness, I'm flattered that you used our video

Lol, if you find a solid counter to marauder/vulcan harassers and strikers, let me know. As far as there being a counter to res grenades (more res grenades, mine drops in these situations are suicidal/team killy). Sometimes, the tactic is just more powerful than its counters, or is just far more effective than similar tactics. There's no reason not to res grenade spam right now. It's great that you guys are 'coordinated' enough to spam res grenades, but you're abusing something that was never intended.

It's just not fun. MAX crashes? Fun tactic. Drop beaconing a platoon in? Okay, fun enough tactic. Spamming res grenades? No fun for anybody.

I am sorry this game was designed for large battles, kinda a big thing around here. So you think that a nade that is limited to the exact same limitations ( carried amount, resource cost, bandoleer cert line) If some one had everyone in the platoon chuck frags at a room with maxes that must be a abuse of the game mechanics no? I mean they were not designed for coordinated team play in mind right?


Ok so I get they are not the same thing, function and all. The question is if its fair and balanced for one person to use it, then how come its not fair and balanced when a lot of people use it?

Its akin to saying they have 20 guys and we only have 10 its not fair. Honestly abusing a game mechanic? really?

So when they designed rez grenades, what exactly do you think they were intended for? Because it seems pretty obvious that they were designed to rez a room full of people at low health.
The fact is, this game isn't designed for one person to clear a room full of enemies by himself. If someone gets lucky and does that, rez grenades are likely to get him killed and re-establish the superior force on the point. However, if that yolosolo guy has backup right behind him, it's easy enough to gun down the enemies as they take the rez.

In most cases you can gal-drop onto the point and hold without dealing with much marauder spam.
If you have distance or a height advantage you can use Annihilators just as effectively as Strikers, and they're very deadly against Harassers. Annhilator + Fury/Halberd Harassers isn't much different from what the TR usually uses.

No, the problem is that the level of skill to play an effective medic doesn't justify the impact it can have. Running around indiscriminately spamming rezes is not skill nor is it "teamwork." There is no "adapting their tactics" when it comes to revive spamming. I'm already killing everything I can, "attack the medic!" doesn't work when the medic is in the corner hiding and the heavy assault is in my face with his gun out.

Should we keep in the Vanguard seat-swapping shield ability? Should people just "adapt their tactics?" Are Liberators fine even though they're terrible at their intended role of bombing ground targets but overly effective at taking out ESF?

Yes, at some point the game needs to be changed, as it has dozens of times in the past and as it will dozens of times in the future.

Is it a 2v2 situation? If so, you're going to have to try to drop the heavy and then quickly rush the medic before the HA can be rez'd and back in the fight. I hear grenades are also pretty convenient for killing enemies stuck behind a corner. Put a Conc/Flash grenade on that Heavy and neither of them will be shooting at you for at least 5 seconds, plenty of time for you or your partner to run up and kill both of them. Or you could try using a MAX/engi team against their Heavy/Medic team. If you happen to be NC, you can combine the two tactics such that the NC MAX shield-walks toward the enemy, protecting you both while you toss a grenade (or a lot of grenades, if you certed for it).

If it's >2 vs >2, the number of potential tactics grows exponentially. Enemy is running a lot of medics? Try a Harasser/Liberator/ESF combined push while a small ground force drops in from above. Enemy is using a lot of Heavies? Go with a medic/engi/MAX Galaxy drop behind/flanking/on-point. Enemy is running -only- medics? Have an infiltrator toss an EMP to clear C4, then collect free certs with a MAX rush.

"I'm already killing everything I can" isn't a tactic. Heavy/Medic team is a tactic. MAX/Engi team is a tactic. Going yolosolo with no medics of your own, then wishing your enemy didn't have medics is -not- a tactic.