Briggs and NC

VS + TR > NC =TRUE therefore everything is ok.

27 + 26 = 53.

53 in fact greater than 46.

If the TR and VS would attack the NC more than each other and the NC split their forces evenly against both fronts things would be pretty "even'.

It would be preferable that you get an even 33/33/33 split. Then we can use that magic 'balance' word. The reason there are 3 faction is to 'artificially balance' the fights in cases like the above.

When a single faction gets above 50% then having the other 2 factions fight them exclusively won't balance out the fight. At that point I would be complaining that things aren't 'fine'. given the average quality of the NC troops 55-60% is ok. They have numbers but a lot of them are pretty new to the game, have a limited idea on how to play, follow the zerg and die relatively easily.

Alerts are about territory control. A single big zerg is a waste of manpower !! The NC may try and stack their forces against only TR and force us back to the warp gate but that means the VS can break out and steal territory back. the NC the turns on the VS and we steal territory back.

Simplified version of above

2kg and 3kg on one side of a scale is equal to 5 kg on the other end.

Are all the parts equal? No.
Are they scales balanced ? Yes!

At the start of that alert, VS had both the World population advantage by 6% over NC and Esamir population advantage by about 10% over NC. As time went on, either TR and VS logged out and NC decided to log in for some game time or TR and VS switched to NC.

I'd be annoyed too if I was always fighting overwhelming numbers. If there was a switch freeze for as long if not longer than an alert, I believe quite a few of those imbalances would suddenly disappear.

Hmm, sorry to hear that man. Definitely wasn't myself or any of the JUGA boys. As much as I was trying to get back-up (one semi-organised squad of four or five people would almost certainly have won the alert for us), I certainly don't hold any ill will towards anyone who didn't take part at that time of the night.

Populations were imbalanced before the alerts (ever since the warpgate rotation as you said), but the alerts have definitely made it worse.

Personally, I don't want them to get rid of alerts. They highlight the problem that we currently have, but rather than get rid of them I'd prefer them put something in place to solve the underlying problem. If they do that, then the alerts should become fantastic events on Briggs.

Again it seems that we just have different opinions. In my opinion the goal should be 33/33/33 balance and developers should be working towards it. Since the numbers I have been posting are quite off from that "magic" number I feel that things are not fine and the problem should be fixed. Based on the discussion on these forums it seems that quite many people are unhappy with balance even though faction on their server hasn't exceeded the 50% pop limit.

That is exactly how I feel. Once the underlying problem is solved I'm happy to have them but unfortunately right now alerts just make the balance problem worse.

This game is designed with three mutually opposed factions. The fact that you're even able to compare the numbers as though there were only two sides and call it 'balanced' suggests it's so far from balance that the players would have to wilfully ignore game mechanics and treat it as though it did have two sides in order for it to remain viable. It's both a bad state for the game to be in, and an unrealistic expectation to have of the players.

Cold War Alert - Approximately 7 pm AEST, 18/04/2013

Starting World Population: 33/31/34 VS/TR/NC
Starting Esamir Population (few minutes in): 34/13/52

Ending World Population: 25/27/47
Ending Esamir Poulation (few minutes before cap): 19/5/75

easy certs ftw!!

it's a good thing you made another thread about this, don't think we had enough yet

Yes.
As I said previously, there needs to be DRASTIC bonuses and penalties to XP for outnumbered and zerging factions respectively.

Also, put a time limit on swapping faction characters. (Even switch off character changes once an Alert starts.)
That will solve the 4th faction issue at least.

I'm curious, do ANY of the TR/VS outfits get super organised for an alert?

Today during that last Esamir aler before it started, there wasn't a single outfit run platoon available to join. Now i dunno if these simply weren't public at the time, but as soon as the alert came on, Team Tower and TOG's outfits opened up their platoons, got into Galaxys and were immediately pushing back Vanu in force in a somewhat organised fashion.

Now i can't create any more characters, so i can't simply make a Briggs Vanu and have a look, but is the same dedication to the goal of winning an alert the same as it is on NC?

Myke has just provided you with conclusive evidence of the existence of the '4th faction'.

Running the World Population numbers, it looks like:
8% of the server pop, being VS, 'logged out'.
4% of the server pop, being TR, 'logged out'.
Total = 12% of the server (TR and VS) 'logged out'.
which is pretty close to the increase seen in the NC population (34% to 47%)

Solution:
Prevent character swaps once an Alert starts.
(No more 4th faction...)

I've seen this occur on several occasions now. Blame the mechanic of being able to swap factions, not NC. Perhaps people are jumping on to NC because they know NC actually participate in numbers, maximising their cert gain. Turn off the mechanic for at least the length of the alert.

My guess is that people will hop to NC simply because it is the most populated faction thus providing the best chance to win. The alerts didn't change that, NC had largest population before the alerts were introduced. Unfortunately alerts have made the balance worse.

I completely understand TR & VS for not participating alerts since after a while you get frustrated by being rolled by superior numbers almost every alert. Think about it, how often would you go to alert if you get almost always outnumbered 4 to 1?

It would be interesting to see what happens if faction switching would be somehow limited. My guess is that most of the 4th faction would permanently join to largest faction.

As a side note I don't think that people blame NC, at least I don't. I blame the people who knowingly join to largest faction and SOE for allowing them do so and even rewarding for it.

I'm not sure if you're reading what's being posted. VS have been the most populated faction at the start of an alert over the last few nights during prime time and beyond but I haven't been taking specific notice. As time goes on, both VS and TR populations dwindle and (seemingly) join NC. Perhaps that's because NC tend to populate an alert continent more than than VS and TR over the long run. Perhaps most people aren't aware that you don't have to be on the alert continent to receive XP. Who knows. Given the NC zerg I've found myself among from time to time during an alert, I'm sure a good portion of them have a flashing breathe sign above their monitor as a reminder. Lights are on, nobody home.

I don't think that 4th faction pays that close attention to numbers. I'm just saying that in general, but not always, NC has highest numbers. Having more people helps you to win alerts since in Briggs continent population cap typically doesn't kick in. 4th faction notices that NC wins most the alerts so they jump there during the alerts. They repeat the pattern over and over again resulting majority of TR & VS eventually losing the interest to alerts.

Of course having TR & VS to skip alerts doesn't help the problem but I can't blame them for not participating since fighting uphill battle every couple of hours gets boring quite fast. If something would cause VS to start constantly winning the alerts I'm sure that 4th faction would jump there and we would end up having exactly the same problem that we have now.

... and later that day you would see dozen of new thread about conspiracies against NC

The funny thing is as a Vanu player I'm beginning to almost feel sorry for the committed hardcore of NC because of the massive swelling of their ranks diluting any serious measure of competition on Briggs. It makes the serious time investment of previously committed players a joke.
Without opponents there is no contests, only a wacky races capfest of ludicrous proportions on alert continents.
I'm sure the nightly 500+certs for a little time input is adequate compensation mind ...

SoE are you listening? I do like the principal of this game but you need to sort out the FuP you've made in Briggs.

TR and VS coop? Are you for real? Just takes 1 player to seriously mess up the whole shooting match

Given they've generally started with a population advantage or on equal terms with NC's population, sticking around and fighting on the alert may help them actually win one. Swapping to NC certainly won't do it.

i actually created a TR alt just because i was getting fed up with being NC and overpop (i joined NC at realease, when there was a slight pop disadvantage) i just prefer being outnumbered (and in the last week it seems that TR aren't last anymore, VS are. just my luck). certainly whenever i play TR on alerts i rarely see the VS. NC will usually have cut us off from each other, and we have no choice but to fight the NC.

i think a hard cap of 50% of the server (NOT continent) is a good idea (although briggs NC are a bit derpy). if any faction is greater than the other 2, you get a queue to log into the server, and a message saying as much. maybe a bonus XP change for the lower population factions (or bonus resources or both). DEFINITELY NOT a penalty of any kind for overpop factions. its not their fault. but bigger bonuses for underpop would be good

obvious troll is obvious

what server you on?


you actually tried to play as Vanu or TR during an alert on Briggs? No? well stop the nonsense please...
many KNTR tr guys are leaving..many vfd vs are switching to tr alts
AS VS between Trol, N7 and Taw there isn't enough of us to field an opposition that stands a chance.
So many thanks for the pointless suggestion.