So, went to PP last night, Im a little low for there. You will see that as my hit% is pretty low, but through some math, extrapolated the dmg we would all be doing at 100% hit, no misses. I know they are speculative, but its food for thought though. The group here consisted of a 58 SK, 58 Warlock, 57 Wizard, 56 Ranger, respectively in the chart here. http://www.hostunlim.com/caelumatra/eq2.htm I went through over 500 arrows, Adestes only procced 44 times. So, less that 10%, and my poison and quick shot combined only accounted for 20% of my damage when it used to be around 55% (from roost parses pre20). I didnt know this either, I learned the from this last night, Warlocks have a spell, Nihilistic, that accounted for 12.4% of the MT's dmg which increased hate gain for the tank cause he was doing more damage. That seems to me like a hate control spell, but hey what do i know my hate control spell only helps me lol. Wizards have a similar spell, frost spike, that accounted for 10.3% of the MT's damage which AGAIN, increased hate gain for the tank. They also have Flametongue and Venemous runes, but they both accounted for less than 1% of the MT's dmg. I subtracted the numbers added to the MT back to the wizards who cast them since they added to group utility with it. So those total up top are done after that. And cause I was there and my amazing utility....YES we got there 14% faster thanks to pathfinding. Man our utility is so great. I love being able to run faster. Yes, we were over the top, but my gosh....i dont take to nuetering well. My solution, since they changed the procs entirely and I dont see them going back. They need to increase every one of our CA's by almost 175%. If you look at my chart, cam is a lvl 57 and does 180% of my dmg. So, take into the lvl increase % and we should be increased by somewhere around 175%. Our ca's I mean. I dont mean our proc % or any of that, our CA's, thats it, plain and simple. Its been noted by more than a few rangers that tanks consistantly out dmg us, and thats wrong. According to the "list" of BG's, tanks are t3, and we are out done by t3 consistantly....thats not good...not good at all [rant] On another note, I dont think people who complained about our insane dmg realized the shear amount of plat we would spend on poisons. I know no one in this group above knew that. I spent about a plat every 3 days on poisons. Now granted, im saving that money now, but Im losing it still in mendor bills lol. Yes other scouts have to pay for the dmg, but the wizards dont, they get that dmg for free. They dont have to stop and say OMG, i forgot to my spell book, I need to go buy some cause if not, you wont even notice im here. This isnt just us, but all scouts are at the mercy of the broker. Well...we were. We were a little out of balance IMO before. We should, IMO be above wizards/warlocks. They bring so many buffs to the table, i mean, when "Buff up" is called, you know what you see the ranger doing....standing there. He doesnt do anything cause all he brings is death and destruction. He doesnt power transfer, he doesnt increase wis, int, str, sta, none of that crap. He deals death. That is all. AND he has to pay a 2 or 3 plat a week just to do it. And yet wizards complain. He has 1 root. 3 min recast timer, break on damage. How many roots do wizards have? They dont break on dmg either. "Well you have chain armor" TAKE IT. TAKE IT FROM ME NOW. I will gladly give up the 500 mit in exchange for leather if i could get some good roots. And at least you can cast when the mob gets close to you. Rangers....nope, not us. We have to snare and run in circles to do any damage, and then it take several minutes for one mob and we cant even cast our ca's like that. Bottom line is, we needed all the damage we did, cause we were as dead as wizards when the mob got to us. BTW, i wore VLA through all of my 30s and leather through my 40s. YAY for 4 melee skills (PS dont give me any more, i dont want them) [/rant] Solution number 2 for soloers if no roots. Let us cast our CA's at point blank range. I know its feasable, Stream did it. And now that we dont proc like mad, the spell isnt rediuculous now. [edit]I had this idea the other day, it would be another stance. and now i cant remember the way i thought the stance would work well lol[/edit] Ya know....i started this thread for a damage showing, and now have turned it into a rant..........the rant stands, but if you dont like it, you can ignore it :smileyvery-happy: theres no convincing you anyway lol. Message Edited by Caelum on 02-24-200610:57 AM
...and when furies get nerfed, I'm sure you'll grin and beg for more. Enjoy! Thanks for stopping by, have a great day.
<hands 3Tan a cookie and pats him on the head> Now run along and play nice with the forest creatures for tomorrow you may be their lunch.
i love parses and data but your stretching it alot with your stuff.. you cant get one set of data and extraplolate it into something its not,.. pathfinding is 16% too.
Easy for someone that plays a healer class that has the potential to outdps a "T1" dps class to say. If our damage is where it should be then fury dps will soon be in the 50-75 range once the bat rolls around.
why would I complain.... im a healer class not a damage class but any class able to take down a yellow^^^ is to much dps and is not balanced and these are forums i can make my statements as my opinion Message Edited by 3TAN on 02-24-200602:49 PM Message Edited by 3TAN on 02-24-200602:52 PM
These people complain about rangers whining, and their biggest argument is that "rangers solo yellow ^^^". So lets talk about that. I solo'd yellow ^^^ all the time, so I'd consider myself an expert on the subject. Lets talk about what it takes to pull it off. (This was pre LU20 btw). Stun poison, cost - 6g, duration, 3 ^^^ fights for non named, or 1 named and then 1 residual mob, so 2g per kill Arrows - 2g per stack, use 1/2 stack per yellow ^^^ id say, so 1g per yellow ^^^ (can be supplemented with summoned but those run out quickly) Damage Poison - 10g per vial, 1 charge lasts about 10 yellow ^^^ so thats about 15s per fight Repairs - thats right, even a very good ranger will only have a 90-95% success rate against yellow ^^^, with chain armor and some legendary/fabled, thats 16,5g full repair, so be conservative and call that 83s per fight Total cost - 3g98s per yellow ^^^ and what do you get?? 0.6% experience. 1 level worth of soloing yellow ^^^ = 6p 63g Now would you pay 6.6p per level? doesnt sound so unreasonable that we "can" solo those anymore does it. Of course it's always nice when you just assume we smile at the mob, threaten with our bow and they fall over....but it just doesnt work like that. So quit trying to use the "they solo yellow ^^^" argument because we paid out the *** for it if we did. And you have to be good on top of that to pull it off or you can add to that repairs charge.
Ranger DPS changes aside Being able to take down a yellow ^^^ isn't about DPS. Wizards can take down some ^^^ yellows if they have the power and the mob isn't overly resistant and isn't a caster. It takes time though and the wizards only uses a fraction if his/her DPS. I have also seen Wardens take on Heroic group encounters and win in Maj'Dul. Obviously, DPS doesn't enter into that situation. The DPS issue with rangers wasn't what they could solo even if the change that. It was that they were out DPSing every Tier 1 class by significant margin, and if left unchecked would be providing 8 to 10 times the DPS of other Teir 1 DPS classes (according to the devs) by the time 70 rolled around.
Those maths are pretty much wrong ... Seem comments. As for the post above, there was some issue about us being able to take yellow heroics down, the issue was that we could burn it down in roughly 45 seconds ( we had to anyway because if the mob wasn't dead when SToA finished we were pretty much dead meat..). That was the dps part of the issue, I don't think SOE had in mind any class being able to burn down a yellow heroic that fast ( and stun poison made it so we could without taking damage..) Message Edited by Ail on 02-24-200601:51 PM
vault of dust/scorn/ etc arent killing all yellow ^^^ so has no bearing on the plat intake during that time. takes longer than 90 mins to kill 166 yellow ^^^ also so i guess both of our math is wrong. Also, this data is only good for the time between LU19 and LU20 when poisons lasted after death. Before that it was much more expensive as a death would end a legendary poison charge, which is the bulk of the expense. However you want to add it up, its not cheap to solo yellow ^^^, but these other classes seem to think its all fun and games and free. As a note with the math, I was being conservative with 166 kills to level, would actually be more with 1 death every 10 kills as there is debt to clear. Can really get into the semantics of this if you like, but the point is still the same.
Why not, the numbers extrapolated were on the chance that every char hit 100% of the time. If my attacks hit 100% of the time, the dmg from poison/quickshot would still be 20%. That 20% came from my 56% hit ratio, it only procs on successful hits, not misses, so...I dont see how thats THAT far off, maybe here and there...but...it should be rather close. Anyway, Ill be doing some more parsing this weekend...but I doubt it will even be necassary to post results. There are so many numbers in our board of tanks out dpsing us. Pets out dpsing us, and even summoners without their pets out dpsing us.
It doesn't but with our abilities to kill heroics , even the occasionnal yellow heroics we had way to improves our income that most others classes did not have, that is why I made the Roost/Hidden Cache comment. Those way more than nullified the slightly higher cost we had to kill higher level mobs and we had in fact access to some content that was not accessible to others classes if they did not go there grouped ( I soloed 1/3rd of Ring of Fate quest as well as the whole of Silent City access for example and there are very few heroics quests which I was not able to fully solo...) If you want to be exact to, up until LU 19 rangers did not have to use drinks or food because PGT kept our power full all the time and we rarely were hit soloing, others classes did have to buy those...
Wanna worry about costs? Before this is wasn't any real issue, wizards were willing to pay for the amount of DPS we had, because we were insane. But that time is over, lets look at NOW. Lets assume that a wizard and a ranger are both going all out, both are using everything they can damage wise to maintain their dps. Now lets say that both of them are doing the same exact amount of damage, give or take 500dps. How of that DPS are the wizards actually paying cold hard cash for? None. Their dps remains. Remove the poisons fromt he ranger and guess what, not only do we have less utility, we have less damage. If we are even to remotely remain up to the wizards scale of DPS now, we are FORCED to rely on poisons. We have to PAY to even compare. Now tell me how THAT is fair to us. Should our damage be higher, YES. Why? BECAUSE WE HAVE TO PAY FOR IT. Why is this such a hard issue with you cloth types? oh sure, were down to par, guess we were still paying for poison to even come close now. oh and its not working. Even with this cost were putting out, we get out dpsed on multiple occasions. Nice, thanks. Move along and go back to your own forums. People who can't think annoy the hell outta me.
This is why we're complaining. Because now healer classes are outdpsing a sup'd T1 dps class. It's kinda like if the healer classes could no longer heal and they should just stop whining about it. It's ok to have opionions but at least try to educate yourself to what you have opinions about before you throw them out there.
