oh i believe it was nice being able to root and smack around mobs. see they need to remeber that we can not take dmg at all if a mob gets to me i am not going to be doing to well! the root was nice cause we could get them down a bit b4 they got to us and have half a chance to win the match! but now it is luck if my root hits sticks and does not break i can win if it does not then i am not in a good way! but oh well that is the way it goes you win some you lose some he he.. well gl on lvl and gratz when you do!
Any damage has a chance to break either root. If you have Icy Wind or Piercing Icicles active, they can cause that.
I prefer the current root system. If you are careful, the snare affect should allow you to re-root your target before it gets to you. This is of course if it does not resist the root. Is this as risk-free as the unbreakable ROC? Hell no - but it is more fun. So there is more risk and it takes better tactics to win (heroic mobs not normal mobs). Is this a bad thing? I was getting thoroughly bored with EQ2 before these changes went in. The fun is either the changes, DOF, or both - I will know in a few months.
I have no doubt that the game, and my class, will continue to be enjoyable to play; but I do miss RoC in it's previous incarnation. I was not mowing down green heroics, much less orange ones; so I don't see how in the hell y'all were doing it (unless "IC is THE key"). They didn't totally screw it... at least it has a long duration, short recast, and snare on termination. All of those combined do make it "possible" to keep multi-mob encounters off of you, if you don't screw up.
don't get me wrong i love my class and the changes! i just noticed the Roc does break where it did not b4 which makes it in some cases harder. i do Roc a mob hit it a few and then Roc it again and as long as everything goes good i am fine. like i said b4 i have taken down a group of four truth gaurds when everything goes good, but i have all so died by them too if they resist my Roc then game over. but you are right i guess it does make it interesting for sure you never know how it is going to turn out he he. i have fun playin my too and all ways will
Putergod Wrote I have no doubt that the game, and my class, will continue to be enjoyable to play; but I do miss RoC in it's previous incarnation. I was not mowing down green heroics, much less orange ones; so I don't see how in the hell y'all were doing it (unless "IC is THE key"). They didn't totally screw it... at least it has a long duration, short recast, and snare on termination. All of those combined do make it "possible" to keep multi-mob encounters off of you, if you don't screw up. >>With out Ice Comet or Paralyze it is much tougher to take down a Heroic in my opinion. >> Paralyze with its 4 sec stun saves me most of the time. The Snare from RoC is nice to have but it seems the bigger Mobs have a nice long reach on them =( Thanks Robsco the Humble Gnome Steamfont
A number of posters here are whiney twits, who've had to face the fact they can't just cast a couple of Ice Comets and be "uber", that they actually have to play to put effort into their game! Plus they don't like ther fact other classes have been fixed, like sorcerors had to be a few months ago, and are thus no longer so broken. So to these twerps: NEENER NEENER! :smileytongue: To the majority of wizard players who know how to play their class: [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] glad to have you with us! Blow up a few mobs for me today, sirs and ladies!
I agree it takes much more thought now to kill bigger Mobs. The Solo Mobs I basically Tank. Sometimes I even tank the Blue^ Mobs which is not right in my opinion. Now for the Heroics you just need some paitience like GoBoy stated. Dont expect to mow down a mob in a few seconds. And Dont expect to not die everyonce in a while. Hell I die a few times a night right now becuase I am wiggling my wand in the nose of Mobs I have no bussiness to do with. But unless you try then you will never know. Thanks Robsco the Humble Gnome Steamfont
Oh by the way I am still interested in getting a response from the guy that is telling me that I am exploiting the game. If using the spells as they are intended to be used bye how soe deisgned them.... Then I guess I am exploiting the game. Robsco the Humble Gnome Steamfont.
Leucippus Wrote: As for why this is an exploit. We have a whole book of spells. This technique relies on what Ice Comet, Paralyze, Truss, the harvest spell? Throw in the 2nd root and protoflame for good measure if needed. As for fixing this exploit without ruining everything else, I would suggest having Ice Comet, and perhaps Paralyze, automatically break any root spells. Ice Comet already knocks down the mob. Having Ring of Cold and Truss share the same spell timer is another possibility. Perhaps the power regenerated by the power regen spells should equal the power lost when casting Truss or Ring of Cold, thus removing the possiblity of having an infinite power pool; no other class has an infinite power pool, why should a Wizard. As a somewhat related note, when soloing "solo" mobs, try protoflame (for dps and keeping mob away) [root if not protoflame, or root anyway to keep the mob away until protoflame gets aggro], (wait a few seconds for protoflame to get aggro), DoT with debuf, heat stroke, heat DoT, nuke, nuke. You can throw in a root spell if needed. The stun spell helps too when the root breaks. Also, keep the HO wheel going. You can skip the nukes (and HOs) and just let the DoTs and protoflame kill the mob, use your nuke when the protoflame dies. Keep all your buffs up, the ice armor one does some decent damage. With the combat changes, the spells have changed a LOT. There does not seem to be any truly useless spells any more, assuming your are not using root - nuke - nuke - root - harvest - root - nuke - nuke - root - harvest - ... until the mob is dead. (And no, mastering that last techique does not make you an awe inspiring wizard, no matter how much you gloat.) -Leucippus Do you even play your class? Ice Comet breaks my root almost everytime. Thats why you follow it up with Paralyze which get resisted some of the time. Then you Run or try to get a Enfeeblement in or another truss while the Mob is Sneared. Infinite Power pool wizards... Yeah right. are Mana regen has been cut way down. Its called converting HP to Mana and pray you dont hit once. Risk versus reward I tell ya =) Where is the Exploit your talking about. You dug yourself into a hole saying I exploited the game but you cant tell me how I did it. Please go into more detail. Thanks Robsco the Humble Gnome
I found this on a random board while looking up a definition of exploit. I was trying to find what Soe would consider a exploit. So I do not take credit for this not do I know who the author is. >>When you use the word exploit on these boards it implies the Sony version of exploit which means an action worthy of warning or ban. It also >>implies that a Mage was doing something incorrect by using a game mechanic of thir class. >>It does not imply the Webster's Dictionary Version of the term exploit and I would submit to you that you are well aware of that fact. I sure hope soe doesnt one day Ban all the Wizards Thanks Robsco the Humble Gnome Steamfont.
Manipulating spell casting in such a way to give you infinite power (you are using Vitalic Harvest(exchange power for stun) not Vital Flow (exchange power for health)). The only way you loose health in this casting sequence is if (1) you get a double resist (both roots resisted) and the mob hits you or (2) the mob has a ranged attack with a range greater than the range of the root spells. It has been stated time and time again that "soloing" heroic mobs should be either (1) impossible or (2) extremely difficult, requiring all end-game gear. This casting sequence is neither difficult nor requires end game gear. Also note the level is somewhat irrelevant, so long as it does not resist the root spells too often; the casting sequence can be kept up indefinitely, with practice at least. It is inconceivable that the devs would have given the wizard so many spells, only to expect the wizard to use, what, about 6 of them. I almost soloed one of the named heroics on the road in The Sinking Sands using this sequence. A double resist at the end killed me (I did not remember to cast Aurora). Also, it seems the mob had a ranged attack... I was loosing health for some reason the whole time. It does not help that your orginal post was gloating in response to the OPs complaint. The casting sequence you use, although not at all new, is not obvious. Also, as usual with such gloating posts, the technique was not described in the gloating post. I was somewhat surprised when the technique was reveiled. Wizards can only hope the "fix" (or nerf, or balance change, etc.) does not break the class for those that do not play a Wizard using this extremely tedious, boring method.
Also note, that by your definition, there exist no exploits in the game. There are hacks and there are exploits. Hacks provide an unfair advantage using a mechinism outside that mechinism provided by the game designers. Exploits provide an unfair advantage using a mechinism within that mechinism provided by the game designers.
If you read the original Post you will see it was not gloating. I also stated I thought wizards where to powerful. But accusing me of exploiting the game is uncalled for. You are calling all Wizards that have soloed a heroic Mob exploiters. I am using the spells per SOE definition. I am not doing anything differently than any other wizard. What do you suggest. I only kill solo Mobs till soe changes the spell definition to your likeing ? Oh by the way which heroic named mob are you talking about on the road to Sinking sands. Are you talking about Prod, stomp or the 3d guy which the name escapes me. Those are level 48^^. Im curious what level you are and why where you even attempting it if you consider killing heroics solo a exploit. By the away if those are the mobs your talking about they are the easiest names in the game for that level. Thanks Robsco the Humble Gnome Steamfont
First, it's one or the other, either it's impossible or extremely difficult, it really can't be both, since one cancles out the other. Second, no one ever said it required all end-game gear. They type of gear required has always been described as, the right kind of gear. You're just reading your own point of view into that kind of open statement, and trying to get others to see things the same way based on how you took comments about soloing Heroic mobs. Message Edited by Stavenham on 09-22-2005 07:00 AM
I really want to cuss right now and show my true feelings, but I will breathe in deeply instead. THIS IS NOT AN EXPLOIT. This is called tactics. I have explained the whole sequence of how to do this to the developers so they can look into it. Why? Because while it is not an exploit, it is overpowered. And yes, it can be overpowered while not being risk free. They have already fixed this (to a point) vs orange mobs. The resist rate on all spells has been increased enough in the last patch to make this not worth it at all. I will test some more - but my initial runs in POF were a dead wizard with the increased resists. Vs white/blue mobs - this is still viable. But, imho, it should be viable. How else would a wizard kill a heroic mob (white/blue) without some way of parking the mob and regenning mana? If you took root out of the game, I could still solo solo mobs but heroic mobs would be impossible. I do know they are looking into our roots - specifically our AE root. Hopefully they don't screw up our ability to solo solo grouped mobs.
Ok, Now that I have calmed down some. Let me splain why this is not an exploit: We are using the spells as follows: Roots - rooting Nukes - nuking Mana Harvesting - mana harvesting [/QUOTE] Where is the exploit? All spells are being used for their designed function. We are not using a spell counter to its intended purpose. All they have to do is change the resist rate on roots and you die. Simple. Here is are a real exploit (that I bugged on test and this has been fixed prior to the combat revamp). A few weeks ago, I noticied Ice Flame would cause a mob to stop moving if you were outside of melee range. Basically, you could kill any target as long as you hit it with ice flame before it hit you. Somehow the target was getting locked into a non-aggro/pathing condition. I tested this (with dev support) vs all white and higher ^^ mobs I could find. Every non-aggro mob I could kill with impunity. Any aggro mob I could kill as long as I got them *locked* outside of melee range. That is a spell working counter to its intended purpose and would have been an exploit. [/QUOTE]
Where is the exploit? All spells are being used for their designed function. We are not using a spell counter to its intended purpose. All they have to do is change the resist rate on roots and you die. Simple. Here is are a real exploit (that I bugged on test and this has been fixed prior to the combat revamp). A few weeks ago, I noticied Ice Flame would cause a mob to stop moving if you were outside of melee range. Basically, you could kill any target as long as you hit it with ice flame before it hit you. Somehow the target was getting locked into a non-aggro/pathing condition. I tested this (with dev support) vs all white and higher ^^ mobs I could find. Every non-aggro mob I could kill with impunity. Any aggro mob I could kill as long as I got them *locked* outside of melee range. That is a spell working counter to its intended purpose and would have been an exploit. [/QUOTE] [/QUOTE] Hmm, having heroic mobs resist all roots would be a nice, clean solution. Have this constraint apply to all classes. I have gone over why I feel this strategy is an exploit in my previous responses; neither you nor Robsco will never accept that reasoning. After looking at the description of the spells, I further see why others have trouble figuring this strategy out on their own... the regenerate power in exchange for stun spell does NOT explicitly show how much power is regenerated; instead it states regenerates 14 power and 14 power every second; it does not explicitly state how long that secondary regeneration lasts. Now lets look at this thread's progression that is leading to this diversion. (1) OP makes a complaint. (2) Robsco's gloating with out giving tactics _at that time_. (3) Goboy's snide comment with out giving tactics _at that time_. (4) _after_ requests, GoBoy is nice enough to reveil the "tactics" showing that, well, effectively the combat change changed _nothing_. Actually, the "tactic" is easier now, the roots last longer. By the way, this tactic is the same as the one needed to defeat the Splitpaw solo arena champion, before the combat update at least. (5) The thread starts to degrade and probably should be locked soon. This game provides very few outlets for grievers. This message board's allowing gloating, bragging, etc. is one of those few outlets. Anyone who goes off trashing the entire community that we all suck and you are the greatest, without giving an complete explaination why _at the time_ and without being requested to, is nothing more than a griever, one of the brats that do not make people enjoy this game. Wether Robsco or Goboy accept it or not, that [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] nuke - nuke - root - regen - nuke - nuke - root - etc. tactic is not the sole, defining characteristic of a wizard; and in my opinion is even more booring that crafting can be ( 50 Wizard / 51 Jeweler and 50 Provisioner). Also, if you feel this tactic is not some sort of exploit (amittedly not as bad as some type of item duplication scheme), then please, for _every_ class, provide a set of tactics that will allow them to solo the same heroic mobs. Soloing "solo" mobs is proving challenging for many players with many different classes now.
I guess the problem I am having is you have not described and exploit. You have described how the spells work. Figuring out which spells to use together is not an exploit - they are tactics. People who just use any old spell in their book are not trying. If the spells did something outside of their intended function - I would agree, exploit all the way. So which spell is not performing its intended function? Which spell is being used in a way that the developers did not intend? I doubt that they care if we use vitalic harvest while a mob is rooted. If they did, why give us the spell in the first place. If you are so concerned about this I will write a post (in another forum) asking moorguard to comment.
