We are expanding to include cross server PVP zones. While working on these we wanted to make sure that any changes we made lined up with what would also be on the PVP servers. Here are some of the changes we are working towards. Control Spells Control spells will have their maximum durations decreased globally. Being able to control another character as long as you currently can on PVP is too powerful. The spells will adhere to the following: 8 seconds: Fear, Mesmerize, Root, Snare 6 seconds: Stifle, Daze, Disarm 4 seconds: Stun Charm: We have reworked the Charm, Hypnosis, and Bria's Entrancing Sonnet lines to mesmerize for 8 seconds rather than charm. We are trying to find a good balance with this new scheme and how it applies to previously set values for PVP control spells. This means that some PVP control spells may actually see their maximum duration increase if it was decreased too far. Resistances Currently spells are resisted too easily in PVP. We have changed it so the new resist chance is calculated from the spell tier modifier, target wisdom modifier, and casting skill modifier with a cap of 70%. Elemental, Noxious, and Arcane stats only mitigate damage and have no bearing on being able to completely resist the spell. Overall, spells should land more often. The need to decrease the maximum duration of control spells becomes more necessary because they will also be resisted less. Toughness We are introducing new items that you can earn on PVP servers and in cross server PVP. These items are crafted around the stats that are needed in PVP. These items have a new stat called Toughness on them. Toughness is a rating that decreases all PVP damage done to you. The planned cap for damage mitigation gained from Toughness is 40%. Seasonal Play We are working to create periods of time for PVP servers and cross server PVP. At the end of a season you can expect certain players to be declared as winners of the season with possible rewards. In the coming season, we would also like to adjust the rule sets and further tune abilities around the previous season's play. Feedback We are always interested in hearing feedback on the items listed here, or other concerns you may have with the current PVP mechanics. Olihin and myself are keeping an eye on these forums and the different discussion threads. Thanks all!
Reading! Control spells area looks good. Will charm work as it does now in PvE situations? Or will it be a mesmerize there as well? I like that resists are being looked into, and hopefully they are done correctly so that the nerf to control effects does not hit myself and others as hard as it would with the current resist system. Toughness seems like it should be a good idea considering how much incoming damage there currently is in PvP. Seasonal Play seems like it was just copy pasted from WoW, at least from what I gathered from talking to a friend who plays it. Now, fix the Justice Cloak!
I believe many undergeared, solo, group only PvEers will find their complaints exponentially multiplying on the forums upon release, if some of these concerns aren't addressed (namely, the portion on smart, gear-based algorithms for match-making, relative to them). =o Hopefully things work out in all manners of swell... Seliri@Nagafen wrote: I also think the Cloak of the Tribunal needs its stun to be curable. Fame loss on death should be added again (from those ranked above, below, or on par with you). A 7 day reuse ability that takes 30 seconds to cast (to prevent abuse) should allow players to toggle participating in the PvP title system or not. When fame changes went live, all players resoundingly noted that fame loss while offline was a complete downer, and that it should be revoked due to the replay value lost in not being able to build PvP titles on multiple toons. Not having fame loss also makes titles generally meaningless when there's no risk and consequence in building them. Nearly all top tier, active PvPers I speak with support changing fame back to the way it was, just with fame decay while online. Titles should be reset once these features are added. I've heard players from all top-tier raiding guilds voice support for this to be fixed, for our consumer feedback to be heard and appreciated accordingly. Also, using writ posters in-combat should be allowed, and so too should they not engage you in combat. Players either let others die when running away/disengaging to get a new writ, so that kills aren't wasted. Allowing your faction to die means more people are going to be coming back, zerging, trying to get in on the huddle of action whenever groups or raids clash. As it is, writ posters with these limitations don't stem abuse, they promote it.
One thing that I thought about after my original post regaurding toughness, is how it will make healers much much more powerful than they currently are. As it stands now, healers are already quite powerful due to crit mit and the ability to still crit their heals. Combine this with all of the stupid proc items (Banshee Hoop, Shifting Buckler), and a well played healer can stand up to multiple people at once. Just today a warden in my guild was fighting 4 or 5 people, all fairly well geared, for enough time that I was able to change specs, go back to the guild hall, grab some totems, and port out and run ~1 minute to him to kill the people he was holding off. Considering the Banshee Hoop will still affect people at level 90, I see this continuing to be a problem. I suggest adjusting the Banshee Hoop, Shifting Band, and the current PvP ward/detarget proc items to only work against targets lower t han 85 or so. Balance heals in PvP around toughness please, otherwise all those people that rolled SKs with TSO will be rolling Wardens or Clerics
Will the Shadowknight specialty move, Death March, be changed to add Strength instead of Intelligence, due to the incoming changes? Will all classes have their CAs/spells examined accordingly for appropriate adjustment?
with the introduction to crit mit in pvp.. the incoming damge for pvp went down alot.. group fights lasted alot longer.. good 6 on 6 could go for an hour... now introduce toughness? with crit mit.. unless in t9 everyones dps is getting a really big jump i dont see how this is a good thing.. fights will last even longer if not indefinate. Way to many control effects in pvp as is.. its an aoe fest who can proc the most stuns ext.. i think control effects should be limited to class abilites.. and not from items in pvp. toughness is something that def isnt need.. Crit mit was plent enough to lower the damage in pvp and make fights last long.. esp group fights. If ur goal is for best group pvp.. toughness is not needed.. will make fights drag on forever.. and not end.. If ur goal is 1 on 1 pvp.. i am sure all the healers will love Toughness and be unkillable 1 on 1. along with pally/sk. considering these class's can crit heal but cant take crit damage.. now incomingg damge would be even lower..
I agree with Rotate on a couple points. We all know crowd control had to be nerfed, that was a definite. The only problem I see now is with crit mit and toughness + the lower duration crowd control effects I just don't see fights ending honestly. I don't mind a good 6 v 6 but I do mind getting into a 45 minute clickfest and I see these upcoming changes bringing more of those events into place. I just can't imagine how rediculous healers will be when these changes hit considering how OP some of them already are
Rotate@Nagafen wrote: I highly agree...equally geared groups will be guaranteed nothing but a stalemate unless you have 4 Wizards, a Paladin, and an Inquisitor. Pray for spell double attacks, tbh. Although, I think there's a certain class getting a bit of what Wizards have, just not sure if it'd ever be enough to a fully stacked group. lol. Try beating a Paladin with a Templar, Warden, Inquisitor, Mystic, and Illusionist or Coercer. Especially avatar geared, top-end raid guilds once they grind enough open world or battlegrounds PvP for loot with toughness. There better be a few, choice, uncurable crit mit/toughness debuffs or something... I'm kinda supportive of gear decay and just having critical mitigation because I'm also kinda doubting how well these features will be tested unless people are straight given all the best loot and masters to PvP with to see how things will really turn out. I also think the nerf to charm (and maybe all control effects?) was uncalled for, and having it in its current state may likely be integral to compete against groups fully decked out in toughness equipment. Bottom line...unless this is tested and you developers/designers are responsive to feedback, this could lead to uninspiringly drab PvP.
Yayyyy, Somebody is behind the wheel upstairs =) Thumbs up guys. I also share the possible concerns about healers being walking gods. But lets put it this way. If a healer cant keep him self up thru heavy dmg how are they supposed to keep a grp up when up to 6 ppl are doing dmg to one target in their grp. They have to be good at healing in grp pvp and that spils over into solo pvp. Not sure if healers heals should scale accordingley to how many they are grped with.Altho this could be some what exploite by having people grp with u but standing afk in immunity,thus making the "solo" healer god like . I seriously like the changes to control effects. Now we just need the tribunal cloak removed or its duration lowered and we may be onto something here.
Jabib@Nagafen wrote: Well it seems that it will follow the 4sec stun ruling.. at least that is how i read it.. all are universally timed
Ahlana wrote: Yup. But it is still too much when factoring in the procrate imo. it seems to proc alot on curtain classes.Especiall crusaders and rangers for some reason. Also as mentioned earlier it does not give stun immunity like every other cc effect does.And last but not least it cant be cured by healers or mages for that sake.
I am actually looking at the Cloak of Justice right now. The data on it seems to have some flaws that I am working through.
Frizznik wrote: you sir. are win. any comment on how toughness will work with healers? coz as many said here, they will indeed be walking gods.
Love the ideas so far. But changing out Regular vs PvP gear is going to be a pita... Why don't you go ahead and add a third equipment bank, somewhere between regular and appearance gear, with items which only affect PvP? Toughness is a great start, but there are a ton of new item modifiers you could make just for PvP gear. Things like mitigation for control effects, reactives which force the attacker to change targets, damage reflection, temporary magical or physical immunity, invisibility and see-invis items, effects for pushing targets away or pulling them closer, blinding effects, maybe even an effect that slowly intoxicates those around you. Some self-healing items with conditions like canceling when you get attacked, and limited charges which have to be recharged at a safe-point. And I would love to see some movement-enhancing items, like boots that jump really high or grant a quick burst of speed or teleport behind your target. And of course Finishing Moves always make PvP more fun. Make them consume something like 50% of the users mana, and require the target to be below 10% health to use, and have to be behind the target to activate; highly inefficient but showey and humiliating. Druids could make a tree grow up around the target, then squeeze them until blood oozes out of the bark. Crusaders could behead their target with one powerful 2-handed slice. Rogues could knock the target to their knees and slice the throat. Enchanters could use mind-control to force them to commit seppuku. Unique animations for each subclass, or even each class if there's time.
Why don't you go ahead and add a third equipment bank, somewhere between regular and appearance gear, with items which only affect PvP? We totally want to do this, hopefully soon after launch. I just changed the Cloak of Injustice to be dispelable. It has some weirdness on its trigger percentage that I am still playing with.
I'm also looking forward to these changes going live, gonna really invest into that toughness stats as a necro. ps - Foolsfolly wrote: lol. This isn't Age of Conan.
