I have been running tests today. I have been using Sting of the Soulreaver. Low DD/High DoT dmg. Listed damg is. Inflict 150, decrease 150 every 6 secs and inflict 146. I also have had Rancorous Affliction on. A Very low DD/Very High DoT dmg poison. Listed dmg Inflict 133, decrease by 133 every 6 secs, inflict 50 dmg. So far, with just using Bow attcks as openers, since they have the highest proc rates. Then just auto melee attack on Field frights in RV. My Sting of the Soulreaver has been the only poison procing. It is also the first one I applied. Rancorous has yet to proc.
One reason is that MMOs constantly change. When I first bought SWG shortly after release, I also bought the "Official Prima Guide." Even a couple of weeks after release, the guide had information that had little to do with reality in the game. It contained information about things that had been planned or were actually in Beta, but had undergone major changes between the time the guide was written and game release. It is probably not worth the cost of trying to keep such information up to date. In the end, the majority of the gaming population just wants it to work, and only a minority of the population cares enough about that much detail. Add to that the fact that the more information you provide, the bigger the edge you give your competitors in designing competing systems and the easier you make it for people to find weaknesses and exploit them, and I would say that a cost to benefit analysis would probably show that it is just not worth doing.
If it was after the battle, then how come the next line -after- the 2 poison listings was the sabertooth neophyte being interrupted. You can't interrupt something that's dead. The 5 NPC purchasable poisons and their crafted counterparts have a very specific way they work: Direct damage hit (initial amount very small to very large, listed in the details at the bottom of the examine) Direct damage hit (the second direct damage amount also listed in the details at the bottom of the examine) 6 sec delay, then damage over time every 6 seconds. The difference between the NPC bought, common crafted, and rare crafted is in the initial direct damage amount. Some have noticed (and this would be in keeping with all other spells and overwrites) that if there is another proc before the dot runs out, the previous dot is negated, or rather is over written by the same spell being applied to the target. As for damage and debuffs stacking. You can stack one debuff and one damage and have both active and procing at the same time. Doing tests in T2 (my ranger-to-be is 16), I tried out the mez potion and had a damage potion applied at the same time. The mez potion (though with very few procs) works GREAT. The bear I shot just stood there, at range and moaned and groaned from the poison, which proc'ed at the exact same time (lucky me) while I just watched doing nothing at a distance. The poison procs did not break that mez. The bear was nearly dead when it reached me, the poison having had a chance to entirely run its course. I tried again. I got another bear to stand still at a distance. This time I was trying to see what would break the mez or if it stayed for full duration. I shot arrows. I hit with both arrows and poison (I was having a good day). I did see how a new application of poison overwrites the first. I also killed the bear before it ever reached me. I used the mez to split targets in group encounters that I was soloing. It worked like a charm (when it would proc *laugh* or I didn't forget to reapply after it had expended its procs *laughes more*). Hit one with the mez and poison (those real lucky shots), switch to the other running at me to melee it, and by the time I had the first dead, the other would be on me (about 1/2 though the fight the mez would wear off) but it would already be at least 1/4 down from the damage poison. It is harder to exactly "see" the other types of debuff poisons proc'ing, but with Shader's comparative damage tests in T4, the difference in damage between when the poison debuff was applied and when it wasn't truly shows how much it lends to the poisoning power.
One last thing.... one of the reasons it is so devasting to poisons users that the large direct damage with small damage over time and very large direct damage with very small damage over time being incorrect in details and actual damage to their damage types is that it lessens the ability of the poison user to maximise his damage if he is relying on the initial damage burst for the majority of the poison damage (as most would be). As an alchemist, I want this FIXED for you, the poison users.
Rijacki I meant that the screenshot was taken after the battle. I scrolled up on the message window afterwards. Sorry for the miscommunication. Haven't played since my previous post waiting for the launchpad.exe_delta file to finish (it is moving so slow on the scanning for updates window).
Well, I suppose it's possible that you could find a vulnerability in SOE's network: a network that is the lifeblood of a multimillion-dollar-per-month revenue stream; a network that is responsible for more than 1/3 of the Internet traffic in the city of San Diego; a network that only needs to expose a single application on a narrow range of ports that they can change at whim using a proprietary protocol. Yeah, your freeware programs might find a way in for you. And it's certainly possible that you could reverse-engineer the server executables. It would take some time, of course: machine code for several multithreaded networked applications, optimized by the complier, written in heavily-templated C++ using smart-pointers, where all of the strings have been internationallized, and relying on an insane volume of data from hundreds of files and database tables. It's... possible. And you could commit these federal felonies (arguably acts of terrorism in the current political climate), for the sole purpose of determining whether multiple poisons actually work together. Or, you could just type /log and figure it out from there. Either way is fine.
I appreciate your concern, and thank you. However, I am not quite sure what you are saying here, Rijacki. Could you explain the problem you are concerned about a little differently?
Yeah, that one left me pretty dizzy too. I stopped trying after the second attempt. But at this point, given the responses here, I'm going to continue using one damage poison at a time, per business as usual. If the only evidence that even two poisons are working at once is those two lines in StealthMode's log (which we routinely see from DD / first DoT), it's a shaky case. Just wanted to confirm that my assumptions are still correct here, thanks to all for the information.
@Bayler No actually I never said "I" would so please do not infer nor insinuate that I would. Secondly, felonies don't matter to hackers, most are never caught. Third, if it were hacked, I am sure they would be going for something other then stats/information. More probably credit card info, and the game engine itself preferably in a pre-compiled stage, more valuable to the individual as then they could solicit the engines "secrets" to other software developers. While a major crime, unless someone knew they were doing it from someone elses computers (very hard to track) all trails would not point to them (IP redirect/spoofing). Lastly, the trialware I specifically refer to is by no means freeware. It is a $1,000 licensed professional network vulnerability scanner with a 15 day fully functional free trial. The one we use at work to probe our customers networks is Retina by EEye Digital Security. This one program doesnt matter what port you switch to, will track any open ports and what programs are running on them. As well as spit a report out on any known vulnerabilities (HINT SONY HINT) on the network. It will mine the network for any unprotected user login accounts (which I hate to say it but I bet Sony uses microsoft and everyone knows about the holes in microsofts products)...saving a lot of time with the malformed packets. Then there is Iris also by EEye Digital Security and available in the same trial time period. That is a packet sniffer to the nth, the absolute best one on the market today, also very expensive to purchase. The scary part is, recently it was discovered someone found a way to crack both trial versions (EEye is working on the issue now). So expect these two awesome pieces of network security testing to go mainstream to most hacking groups soon (including ones which play eq2). The fallout could be catastrophic. Many companies are starting to report their credit card info databases are getting hacked. Wasn't it less then a month ago one company said 400+ of its customers credit card numbers were hacked out of their system...and they were another multi-million dollar merchant. I am a network security consultant in my civilian capacity, and am well versed in the how-tos and the realistic possibilities of network vulnerabilities. Every company has them believe it or not. Even multi-million dollar giants like SOE...And far as San Diegos bandwidth, you have no idea how much bandwidth San Diego Naval Base has do you? @ Jay Far as me only providing one ss so far, sorry I got a real life. Said I'd check it out as I got the time... Message Edited by StealthM0de on 05-26-2005 01:49 PM
I think she is refering to the resist checks on poisons. Before the DoT resist check, the gap between High DD/Low DoT and Low DD/High DoT dmg was considerable. Since, the intial DD portion had to go through the resist check, where as the DoT dmg never did. It would hit for full everytime. That isn't an issue anymore, since the DoT resist change several weeks ago. I'm still dissappointed that Rijacki didn't make her Ranger a Gnome.:smileytongue:
Holy off-topic posts, yeesh. Okay, we realize you're a smart network guy, but the discussion was about your claims regarding poison use in EQ2.
Yeah Jay, I got way off topic there sorry. Far as the poison thing, I am still testing for all intents and purposes, it appears that at least two of the poisons are working at the same time. I'll try collecting more info on this. Btw, /log....I had it on, zoned into the hidden meeting (thinking it was still on to log the DD and Dots) and guess what? Unless I type /log in each zone I go into...it doesn't record. Least thats what it did last night... (1117084923)[Thu May 26 01:22:03 2005] Logging to 'logs/Antonia Bayle/eq2log_Stealthmode.txt' is now *ON* (1117084963)[Thu May 26 01:22:43 2005] \aNPC 12220 Shieldsmith Azima Kaddor:Shieldsmith Azima Kaddor\/a says,"Go on take a look at the stock. You'll never beat this price in the city I guarantee it!" (1117084973)[Thu May 26 01:22:53 2005] You begin to focus upon your elven reflexes. (1117084974)[Thu May 26 01:22:54 2005] You have entered a Discreet Meeting. Thats it, other then that my log is empty...seems when I zone in to a new place the log turns off automatically. Anyone know of a way to stop this?
I have tested this. You CAN stack a "debuff" poison (20% chance to proc, 80 procs) and a "damage" poison (25% chance to proc, 200 procs). I'm starting to think, though, that it may actually be possible to stack three poisons. I started asking myself WHY these poisons were stacking and I think it has to do with the % chance to proc. I suspect that 15%, 20% and 25% chance to proc poisons will ALL stack. If I'm right, what that means from a practical / balance point of view is actually pretty cool. We would be able to have three poisons up: 1. A base damage poison (25% chance to proc, 200 procs) 2. A mitigation debuff poison (20% chance to proc, 80 procs) 3. A stat debuff/stifle/slow/etc poison (15% chance to proc, 4+ procs - variable) Obviously, with the lower number of total procs, not everyone will want to use the third type at all times but it does give us a tiny boost when fighting named mobs, etc. Message Edited by Langeloc on 05-26-2005 02:45 PM
Try checking both in /logs and /logs/Antonia Bayle. It puts files in both places sometimes. (I normally leave game logging all the time, and it usually puts the file in /logs. I think it only puts them in /logs/Antonia Bayle when I explicitly turn them on or off. Perhaps zoning is when it switches over from one to the other, or maybe zoning causes you to lose part of your logs altogether? I'm not sure of the details.) My apologies, too, for the off-topic debate.
The debuff stacking is known. I mainly use them for raids. I saw a post on the alch's board about the idea that different proc rates stack. There are some rare 4 charge dmg poisons that have a different proc rate than the 200 charge ones. I haven't had a chance to test that out, since I really don't feel like paying 30g for 4 procs. As for the normal DD/DoT poisons, I have yet to see any procs off of both while they were both active. been testing is all day.
YOUR Open Shot hits a Giantslayer tracker for 37 points of piercing damage. (1117145628)[Thu May 26 18:13:48 2005] YOUR poison hits a Giantslayer tracker for 52 points of poison damage. (1117145628)[Thu May 26 18:13:48 2005] YOUR poison hits a Giantslayer tracker for 9 points of poison damage. I had all 5 poisons loaded. This is only ONE that hit. I wrote down all the DD and DoTs of the poisons and the only one that actually did anything was the first one I loaded (caress of the phantom). Poison+dd+dot... Caress of the phantom 54, 9, 8/6 Acidic Massage 45, 15, 13/6 Crypt Sludge 33, 8, 30/6 Abrasive Goo 22, 13, 12/6 Blight of the Eventide 25, 20, 23/6 All DMG poisons. Only the first one I loaded was doing anything (Caress). So I was so wrong its not even funny. Far as these buff poisons. I can only use tier 2 poisons atm. Where would I find these stat/buff poisons? I am interested because I want to try them out, but I don't know where to get them. Also, I was using Caress, but I am noticing it does relatively no damage on the DoT and thats where I think I am messing up. Its a nice initial power hit (especially in combo with the sneak attacks 120+ dmg so far max. on initial hit), but I think I want something thats going to do the most recurring damage (54 hp intitially is nice. but only 9hp every rd thereafter is kinda weak). Out of all the poisons above that I can use (at least till I can access tier 3 poisons) would you say Crypt Sludge would be the best well rounded poison for DD and DoT? Or what would you recommend? When does one get access sufficient enough to get these buff, etc. poisons? I haven't seen any that I can use yet (to my knowledge) and I have been to the poison shop in SQ. What level does one gain access to higher level poisons? Btw, I apologize for getting everyones hopes up. But it got us testing again, and we found out that some poisons can get stacked. Just not DMG ones with its own kind.
No worries Stealthmode. I wish you were right, thats why I went out and did the testing again. The mitigation, Mez, Stifle, etc poisons are player crafted. Some are rare and some are common. I know, my favorite the poison/disease mitigation debuff is a common one. Most Alchs have stocks of rare by products which is what is used to make those rare poisons. I only pay 5g for my t5 rare poisons, whichn't isn't to bad since common t5 poisons go for 1-2g on my server. You get access to new poisons every 10 lvls. At 20, you will be able to use t3, 30 t4, and at 40 t5. For now, its probally best to stick with vendor made. Not sure if this is your first char or not. If it is, its better to save your money and buy vendor poisons. The difference isn't that much at the lower lvls between PC and vendor. I didn't switch over to player made until the late 20s. By your 30s, you should have switched already, the differnce is noticable. As for which to go with. Personally I prefer the Very low DD/Very high Dot ones. I like to kite and those are the best for kiting. In groups, I usually get a poison hit off of Hidden as an opener, so a full bodied Dot is great for that. It depends on yoru style. With my group sequence, its probally better for me to go with a High DD/low Dot, since I use my bow shots at the end. But, my solo sequence is better with the opposite. It really depends on your game play. Either way, I think going to one of the extremes of the poison dmg is the best.
Thanks for the info fluster. Yes this is my first character for the game ever. I love rangers. Its pretty much all I ever played in PnP D&D too. Far as money, not a problem, fortunately I found some rather nice rares in the first levels after trial of the isle (bronze, silver, blackened iron, etc.). And on the Antonio Bayle server these rares go for 10-20gp per. I have almost 1pp at present, still in my 1 room flat in Willow Wood, moving soon. Got my house pet, getting my travelling pet at 20 in Eldarr Grove. After that moving into a 2 room flat in NQ, then I should have around 50-60gp left. Do you think I would be able to pick up decent tier 2/3 poisons for a few gp? I'll solicit some alchemists and see what they say their fee would be. Although I don't think tier2 offers anything but DMG poisons. Have to check on that. Although would be interesting if I could find custom tier2 DMG poisons that had better DD and DoT over the merchant ones for my tier. Update: Just made a post in my home servers marketplace forum. Hopefully I'll find a good alchemist and get me some good juice to coat my blades and arrows with. If any alchemists are browsing this forum from Antonio Bayle server, please check out the marketplace forum. 8) Message Edited by StealthM0de on 05-26-2005 11:43 PM
Thats good you are set on money. Way ahead of where I was at yoru lvl hehe. For prices, I don't think it should be that much. Probally more in the range of 30-50s per for t2/3. Also, do a LFW search, you might get lucky and find an alch that is willing to help you out or find one that is lvling up and is in your tier range. Also doesn't hurt to join the crafters chat and try and find some alchs that way or atleast get some pricing info from them. Thast how I found my armorsmith. Here is a good page with the poisons and potions listed by tier and what they do. http://home.earthlink.net/~shader_eq2/potions.html
Ty for that list. I was looking for an alchemists list. Now what would stop me from attempting to make these myself other then the increased cost in fuel (since I chose outfitter instead of alchemist)?
