0m Minimum range, otherwise known as the major defining characteristic of the bow. In so forgetting, you also negated the changes you made to our AEs to make them castable from minimum range. Fix, please.
To elaborate, for those who don't know, it used to be that none of our ranged combat arts had a minimum range on them--they were limited to not being able to be fired point blank by the 2 meter limitation on the bow itself (since all our ranged arts, of course, require a bow to use). This changed when our mythical was 'nerfed' out of the starting gate. The bow itself wasn't actually changed, what was changed was that a minimum range was added to all of our ranged combat arts so that we couldn't use ranged combat arts within the minimum range on the bow (but we could still use auto-attack). In SF, minimum range was (very very thankfully) taken away from our AE combat arts, because the devs rightly realized that minimum range was extremely aggravating especially on AEs, and especially, especially on raids, where adds are very often running in and out of that ~2 meter limit. Unfortunately, our mythical spell gem doesn't include arguably the most important part of Eagle's Talon's function: the ability to fire auto attack (and now our AEs) without having to worry about a ~2 meter limit. I expect this was an oversight, as the minimum range removal is something that exists on the bow itself, and not as a special listed property. I also imagine coding for removing minimum range via a spell ability might be a bit tricky to figure out, but I'm no coder. The upshot is that as soon as we switch out Eagle's Talon for a presumably better bow, which is the entire point of making the mythical abilities a spell ability, we will lose that function, and once again be limited to standing at 2 meters or more distance. However, remember that our AEs have been essentially reverted, range-wise, to how they functioned prior to Eagle's Talon; that is, they have no minimum range themselves, but they will use the minimum range of the equipped bow. In the flurry of issues on beta, I don't think this additional issue was recognized (I didn't even think about it until the other day). In other words, the removal of minimum range on our AEs only actually works if we have Eagle's Talon equipped. As soon as we use a bow with minimum range again, AEs are once again limited to that same minimum range. I highly, highly doubt it was SoE's intention to fix our AE issues and have that fix only function if one single bow is equipped. The entire idea behind mythical adjustments this expansion was to get us to upgrade our weapons without losing the important functionality that the epics have added. TL;DR: We need, either by adding it to the spell ability itself (preferable), or simply removing it from bows period, the removal of minimum range. I would argue we should have it removed from our combat arts as well, but at the very least, we need our mythical spell gem to function in the same way that our mythical bows have functioned, otherwise we are not only losing out on this important function of the mythical, we are also losing out on the benefit that was given by removing the minimum range modifier from our (now rather considerable) AE abilities. I don't know about others, but I'm sure going to be reluctant to upgrade my weapon if I'm going to be taking on this particular aggravation again as soon as I equip that upgrade. The upgrade would have to be pretty juicy for me to let go of Eagle's Talon's removal of minimum range just now. Please feedback this!
Well another TLDR annotation: The removal of the minimum range on AE's is useless/non-existent when using a bow other than the Eagle's Talon. People need to bug/feedback this.
Somewhere else where min bow range was being discussed, it was mentioned that sony potentially doesn't want to have a 0m range on the bows themselves so that other classes (tanks was the example used, as I recall) can't just sit there and use their bows to dps in melee range. That seems to leave two options; one that I personally would bet they're trying to move away from after myths and seeing what the itemization looks like in this expansion so far, and one that seems pretty simple... The one I doubt they'd do is to start putting in bows that only rangers can equip with a min range of 0m. Basically, some type of direct upgrade of ET. After seeing how cookie cutter a lot of the loot looks so far, this doesn't seem like the way they'd want to go (though I'd bet this would be a whole lot easier for them to code so who knows). The other solution would be to just make 0m bow range an aa ability. While I'm sure it'd be a lot more work code-wise, it'd be a much better long term solution to say, stick 0m bow range on extension, or somewhere on one of the aa trees. Either way, while it's not a deal breaker on the class for me, it is really annoying going back to having a min range on your bow after roughly 2 years of not having to deal with it, so hopefully something gets done with it sooner rather than later.
Neiloch@Crushbone wrote: This. It's a bonus of our epic, it's one of the irreplacable abilities SOE talked about with mythicals, it needs to be put on the spell. I understand this may require some irritating coding on their end, but it still needs to be done, and ASAP. No reason to have to 'earn' it some other way, we earned it when we did the epic questline.
Yea, you're right, it should be on the myth buff. I mean't if they weren't going to put it on the myth buff, it could potentially go one of those other two ways... I probably should have pointed that out a bit more clearly...
For those of you who don't watch the Dev Post Tracker: Fyreflyte wrote: Fyreflyte wrote: This debate has been raging over in here.
Nevao wrote: lol, so you've basically decided to make things completely the opposite of what you did in RoK/TSO whereby you were encouraging (forcing) us to go in close rather than ranged. I'd love to know where this sudden outbreak of common sense came from ? Whoever is in these meetings and came up with the idea can you please give them a pay rise as it seems they understand what Rangers have been going on about. Rangers want to attack from range using their bows. We don't want to get close, and we don't want to melee (there is already a class for this type of gameplay). It's just the crazy combat mechanics that force us to do this to if we are to stand any chance of filling our role in a group/raid. Plus to be frank, a lot of the other classes smell, and it's not very pleasant having to get close to them in the heat of battle. Not very pleasant at all my love.
More importantly if we should fight from range than why all the boni to Melee CAs in the TSO Tree and now to lounging joust in SF ? Funnily now one of the "FEW" SF Boni we got, our AEs with no restrictions is gone
I have no idea what they're doing at this point. The right hand knows not what the left hand doeth or whatever. You've got whoever finalized the AAs wanting us to fight close, you've got the itemization dev wanting us to fight at a distance, and you've got a whole lot of silence when it comes to 'how can we possibly justify our group and raid slots with our class the way it is?' The current plan for rangers seems to be summed up as follows: "LA LA LA WE CAN'T HEAR YOU LA LA!" I desperately hope that I'm just being negative and the vaguely hinted at possible changes are going to come soon. And that they won't just be a load of handwaving and a nerf, like last time. I would dearly love to be made to eat my words.
Neiloch@Crushbone wrote: After reading your replies here and then on the minimum range thread, I'm confused.
That quote was simply how I think it should work IF put in. I was never against it on its own, but I can understand why they may not want to do it when simply comparing ranger auto attack to typical melee auto attack. I could say taking away minimum range could be some sort of compensation for not having flurry or auto AE but I'm not about to give the impression that it could be just as good. If we aren't getting jack in other areas like more ranged DPS or more balance in general then yes, I think we should definitely get it. Otherwise its an extremely minor in the grand scheme of things, and if given other things we need for balance it will allow us to keep some class flavor imo. If people are sick of conceptual carrots on a stick they have shown more willingness to up our ranged DPS than removing minimum range for us so I'm just rolling with the punches I suppose. I'm just trying to concentrate efforts in things that will yield the biggest benefits, not the 'easiest quick fix.' Which is why I keep harping giving us more ranged DPS that I use constantly as does every ranger of every playstyle, opposed to no minimum range on our bow which I haven't personally utilized in a group or raid setting in over a year, so I'm sure other rangers could pull it off with minimal effort. Not like I have some magic trick or leet strat to get distance in groups and raids. Oh hey i'm under 2 meters away from the mob, *tap s for fraction of a second* ok thats better. Admittedly its more of a pain while soloing but at least the root CA and snares are a tad more useful if the mob somehow got in melee range. Honestly though I'm just going to try and stay out of it for now. I just really don't care if we have it or not, what I care about is possible future 'payment' for this in changes or lack thereof we may not even be aware of. Because personally I think this reinstatement is a couple steps in for a plan to up our ranged DPS.
