This section is going to be kinda fuzzy. The recent changes to Bolster are a balance issue - they were intended but perhaps un-necessarily harsh. Perhaps it's an ability that simply isn't as strong as it should be. There are a lot of things that will fall in this catagory. What doesn't belong here is something that doesn't currently exist in game. So, something like the ability to kill any mob once per hour or something like that would be a Wish List item, not a balance issue. I'm going to probably have to shuffle some things between here and the Wish List and vice versa. So, list away. I'll juggle and edit as necessary. 1. Bolster nerf. Ok, explain to me how a decrease in effectiveness the likes of which recently hit Bolster can be defined as "slight". Are we back to the nerf first ask questions later stage? Bolster had been in it's form for the entire beta period, during which we can only ASSUME it was tested and deemed to be appropriate. 2. Stamina buffs are, in the endgame, not nearly as valuable as a raw HP buff. Since most of Mystics buffs revolve around Stamina, this is a huge problem for Mystics. We would like some consideration given to this. Some possible solutions include allowing Stamina buffs to raise the cap. By allowing Stamina buffs to raise the cap, you give Mystics back a decent amount of desireability since the full impact of their buffs in this tree will be felt. 3. Shaman (both Mystics and Defilers) did not receive a new Group version of their specialty heal at Level 70. This clearly breaks the standard spell progression that has been in place and further it breaks from the progression that every other Priest in the game has followed. There has been no explanation of this. 4. Reserved. 5. Reserved. 6. Reserved. 7. Reserved. 8. Reserved. 9. Reserved. 10. Reserved. Message Edited by Banditman on 03-03-200609:39 AM
I think we should address the reason the Bolster Nerf hit us so hard... The fact is that our buffs meant to make a tank sturdier all revolve around buffing stamina. Stamina has a cap. Defilers do not have this issue. Between Spirit of Mammoth and Ancient Avatar, theres so much +stamina on the tank its doing next to nothing. And it only becomes worse as the level cap increases. The +stamina amount we add goes up, but its always in a higher percent effected by diminishing returns. This causes us to buff hp on a tank inferior to a defiler. So Bolster became our way to offset that for a short period of time. It is very reminiscent of what happened with Haze. Something else is broken, so we rely on another tool as a crutch. Then they take our crutch, break it in half and laugh at us.
I think the underlying problems with Mystics are related to a very unclear concept of the sub class division. What is the Mystics sphere of greatest influence? What is the Defilers? I suppose my concept was that the Mystic was the buffer / defensive side and the Defiler was the debuff / offensive side. I believe this is a view many of us share, we'll see. I am not sure whether getting a clear definition is a wish list or balance issue, hopefully we can discuss it and decide.
During beta, we were beta buffed to level 70 to test some raid content. We were given most tier7 masters. My level 70 Guardian MT was capped on all three physical stats using only t6 armor. Oh yeah... that was before Bolster was applied. So raidwise, this spell is of limited use, other then the max health increase and the slight heal from that.
I agree the root to our problems isnt so much the nerf to bolster that was rly more of an bandaid fix we had for a short amount of time the real problem is that defilers buff HP while we buff sta thats allways capped
I apologize if this isn't the right place to be asking this, but was an explanation ever given as to why shaman ended up getting an upgrade to their noxious/health group buff at level 70 instead of a group ward? Are we to assume that this is just a shift in the progression of these spells and that we'll get an upgraded one whenever the level cap is raised again, or is that the end of that line? Was that due to balance? Every other priest receives an upgraded group specialty heal at 70 but shaman... I am curious at minimum as to why they chose to do this, since on the surface it seems unfair that all other priests get an upgraded tool that is what they specialize in at that level while we do not. Granted, I am not at the end game to be able to tell if it really impacts shaman's effectiveness or balance, but it still seems like we should have gotten an upgrade to the group ward, even if it was minimal over the previous version and if for no other reason than to keep upgrade consistency with the other priests.
the whole balance prob is because of the sta vs hp buffs, i dont understand why both classes cant buff hp (sta is capped and not hard to hit - hp is not capped and unlimited), they would still be very different classes: defilers have bigger heals but longer cast times defilers buff more disease, mystics buff more poison defiler has slightly better debuffs, and a little more offensive capabilities defiler has an anti stun, mystics have a cure all as a raiding mystic, i find that the classes are very balanced in debuffing, resist buffs, and most aspects - except that the defilers hp buffs own mystic stamina buffs (by a longshot). how many mystics were kicked outta mt groups when dof came?, i bet the number is staggering - that should prove the balance prob right there. i am not saying we should buff the exact same amount of hp but it should be at least close. i would trade bolster right outta my spell book if i could have constant hp buffs instead of constant sta buffs as that is the reason we will never be picked if a defilers available, ever Message Edited by fitzerelli on 03-03-200612:55 AM
Currently there is no benefit to upgraded group cures above about the adept 1 level or so. I find this slightly annoying, I wish they could make it beneficial somehow.
I'm moving that to wish list. It affects all Priests equally, so technically it's "balanced", just sucky.
Why is it that all I ever considtently see here is hate for defilers and envy for what they have why not focus on what mystics have and work to make things there own insted of takeing from what others have?
I might ask the same thing of Defilers. It was a Defiler who spearheaded the effort to get Bolster nerfed. After six months of listening to Defilers tell the world how superior they are to Mystics, Mystics are pretty fed up. Sorry if that seems negative to you, but perhaps you might look at what Defilers have been doing first. Message Edited by Banditman on 03-03-200610:18 AM
The defiler board is a ghost town lol Hardly anyone posts there compared to here what got bolster nerfed was sony not a defiler.
You are wrong. I have some knowledge of the situation beyond what you do. It has nothing to do with the Defiler boards.
ask tanks which they would prefer hp buffs or sta buffs?, ill bet everythin i got they pick hp buffs evertime hands down, that is the point i was trying to make by posting above. other differences between the classes i can live with but hp vs sta makes the mystic inferior
"Why is it that all I ever considtently see here is hate for defilers and envy for what they have why not focus on what mystics have and work to make things there own insted of takeing from what others have?" -Darksong- Good question why did the defilers hate on the mystics buff and envy it to the point where it got nerfed. We are not asking for any nerfs to defilers like defiles asked of the mystics. We on the other hand want our spell brought back up to what it was doing or near enough, and for our STA buffs to be looked at and balanced. I dont hate defiles, I just want each class to be balanced as much as can be so one is not 100% better than the other. Currently the STA is the biggest problem followed by your over zelous demand for blood when it comes to our spell. Personaly I go read the conj and necro board I dont see the necros calling for blood agaist the conj 65 spell. Which is much nicer than the necros. But hey if you want to come over here and state something that is not true then by all means, but the truth is even with the nerf to bolster and before the nerf. Defilers and mystics were not balanced. Defilers still buff better in all situations while a Mystic buffs better with a poorly armed tank. There are alot of solutions to this problem we just need SoE to take the time and care enough to do something about it.
Why is it that all I ever considtently see here is hate for defilers and envy for what they have why not focus on what mystics have and work to make things there own insted of takeing from what others have? darksong have you even looked at the defiler forums?, ala the posts http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=20&message.id=8435 http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=20&message.id=7714 grats defilers you are once again the strongest mt healers in the game wb
???????? Here we go again, more misguided "holier than thou" type of attitudes. I don't care WHO has WHAT ability, if it's overpowered, I will support nerfing it. If it's underpowered, I will support fixing it. The point here is that saying "I am not asking for X class to be nerfed" doesn't make you a better person or player, it just makes you short-sighted. This "Don't nerf" disclaimer seriously pisses me off. No one has a "right" to any ability being a certain way. Makes no sense at all how everything we talk about class balance the words "don't nerf" come up. What kind of balance is it if you simply increase the underdog every time? With that said, I never thought Bolster was overpowered. Defile is just a stupid, stupid spell to give to a healer class as their class defining spell. Bolster was an example of a good implementation of an ability that fit the class, and as a spell of our counterparts, it was the logical choice to put against Defile when looking at whether Defile is appropriate for our class. As you may have noticed, all we have still is an AE DPS spell - I still say they should've let the whining for DPS Templars have it, I want something that is healer-like.
sokolov - I don't care WHO has WHAT ability, if it's overpowered, I will support nerfing it. If it's underpowered, I will support fixing it. then sokolov would you support lessinin of defiles hp buffs, or changes to mystic sta buffs? because thats where the overpowered problem lies sokolov - What kind of balance is it if you simply increase the underdog every time? so what are you trying to say here, just leave the underdog the underdog always? is that better balance? i guess so if you are a defiler dont mean to be so harsh here but its just extrememly frustrating Message Edited by fitzerelli on 03-03-200603:37 PM
