Atm , bruisers have the same avoidace as monks, they have more mitigation, and more dps. Monks are supposed to be the better tanks, and the masters of avoidance, but bruisers are identical to monks for avoidnace, and monks get no unique buffs like deadly spirit that raid avoidance...Deadly spirit line adds 1000 mitg for 3 min (then its down for 3 min).....the top of the line monk buff is 300 mitg for 30 sec..... thats it, thats the amazing def buff thats supposed to set apart bruisers from monks. Bruisers need to have deadly spirit made identical to face of the mountain (30 sec duration then down for 30) and monks need face of mountain to add 20 deflection and parry for that 30 sec. So ud have 20 deflect ./ parry 300 mitg......vs 1000 mitg....for identical durations
When monk skills start costing you your own health, then it would be more even. My 47 Bruiser burns through health when throwing up his defenses, as well as using some attacks. Don't forget that part of the equation.
bruisers get the +1000 mit line that costs hp to maintain , monks get the 35% haste line that costs hp to maintain .....the haste only affects auto attack dps and doesnt do much in terms of extra dps ... bruiser > monk there too
I was born in it. I ate my Weaties. It's really just a second skin. Sometimes I shed and a new one grows back. The smell's really not that bad, once you get use to it.
I agree. For masters of avoidance.. we certainly don't avoid any better. There are mages that avoid more, just based on their Very Light armor. Monks need a self only avoidance buff. Maybe they could add it to the Everburning Flame line?
They could easily add +agi or something to the control breathing line to boost up our avoidance a bit compared to the dmg heavy bruisers. As it is agi doesn't really do much, but a boost of 20-30 would certainly give us a slight edge. Also, some of our attacks also cost HP instead of power. Message Edited by x0rtrunks on 09-20-2005 11:40 AM
Well, I will add this anecdote: I watched a 50 bruiser solo a 54th level heroic encounter (one ^ and one ^^ coin guards in Maj'dul). That same group tears me to ribbons. He was roughly equally equipped to me (fabled BP, couple pieces of fabled armor, fabled weapon). Now, I suppose it's possible that he's THAT much better at playing the class than me, but I generally hold my own or better. In any event, soloing yellow heroic encounters is not something we are supposed to be able to do these days . . .
Check out this thread on the bruiser forum: http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=7&message.id=8305
I don't see any problem with the balance between the bruiser and the monk class. Especially after we get our 52/55/58 skills. The fact is that I can solo even conned heroics too, if they are the right ones. /shrug
I know moorgrad hates to be quoted, but he described monks as masters of avoidance, and bruisers to be slightly more mitigation based So in the end brusiers self heal for more and more often, they get 1000 more mitgation, identical avoidance, better dps. And their defense buffs last longer, even if they cost hp (minimal at best) just seems a slight bit sour
I do agree on this as well. As it stands bruisers are better then us in everyway except avoidance where they are equal to us. While I am having fun playing my monk, we are just 2nd class when it comes to bruisers.
So are you tellling us Gaige that Monks will get better as the levels go on? I mean, that Bruiser skill that gives them +1000 mitigation is awfully good in my book. WIsh I'd had that when the mob on the carpet quest part 3 turned around and hit me for 1100, 2000 and 2000 in the space of about 5 seconds. (and no, i didn't parry, block or avoid...surprise surprise) I was not particularly happy with the 51 monk skill . . .increased attack speed for the group (how many more of those do we need?) whereas Bruisers get an incresed DPS buff. I'm never sure what the new skills are anymore since some of them seemed to have changed even since the last day or so of beta. Message Edited by Oneira on 09-21-2005 07:13 AM
I beleive the order is Outwardclam (3k self rune duration 5 sec, recast a few min) - lvl52, useful as a second mend sort, basicly when u almost get one shoted u can buy ur healer 5 extra sec to heal you. tsunami (100% reposte for 12 sec from front only every 3 minish) - again useful for geting pounded on but only really reliable if u wait 3 min per fight and fall of pheonix (group fd) - adds nothing to tanking Def stances- bruisers and monks are identical, as are all non paladins (pal get 2 resists mag and divine) Off stances - bruisers get a 10% chance to proc 700-1000 dd, monks get 30% haste (which counts towards a cap) 100% haste is the cap, but theres no limit to amount u can proc. a bruiser with a flail > a monk with a flail other then monks can now self reach the haste cap, but grouping with a bard or enc lets u drop stance and still reach cap so /shrug...bruisres is better in this regard Defense buffs - both get a stone stance clone....2k mitg while stuned for 30sec -we get 30 sec of 240 mitg, they get 3 min of 1000 mitg at the cost of 100hp for 6 sec (our self haste is roughly 56/ 3 sec).....so not only is our def buff weaker, it lasts much shorter avoidance -bruisers get more mitigation and identical avoidance dps -bruisers do more dps Heals 90 sec self heal with higher %...ours is 3 min now but still less cause its used on others ......i know you love your monk and i love mine gaige....but its blatantly over powered to be a bruiser. They have better def buffs (especialy considering they are the offenseive part of the brawler) they have IDENTICAL avoidance to the "kings of avoidance" unless you count a monk who pulls 1 time per 3 min with tsunami, then we have a 12 sec advantage on a 45 sec fight....which then is neglected by the fact bruisers mitigation is a whole 1000 higher bottom line, they do too much dps, get to many defensive buffs, and have no draw back. the evil half of our class shouldnt be more dps, better tanks, ...im fine with them geting more mitigation, but give monks more avoidance, and nerf the bruiser dps PLS they shouldnt be 100-200 dps ahead of a monk who is WAY more fabled then them if they are gonna also be ahead of us in tanking
Monks do get an additional deflection buff where as bruisers don't. So i find it hard pressed to say monks have the same avodiance which they don't an equal equipped monk should have more avodiance. For instance my lvl 48 shrug off adept 3 w 50 agi adds only 0.2% more avodi then the lvl 20ish staggering stance at adept 3 w the added deflection. From that point on monks gain more deflection and i gain agi in that combat art line. And from what i see using those 2 spells the added deflection adds more then the agi i recieve. Not only that but i can not raise my deflection any other way. where as my agi at 50 was almost at the cap self buffed i had 325agi self buff cap of 350 (7x lvl). Add 1 agi buffer to my group and i exceeed the cap and recieve no additional benefit from agi. Monks do have more avodiance. I can not test the actual number at 50 accuratly since i dont recieve a monks lvl 50 staggering stance line buff to compare to my shrug off buff. But it seems monks should have more avodiance.
beleive the order is Outwardclam (3k self rune duration 5 sec, recast a few min) - lvl52, useful as a second mend sort, basicly when u almost get one shoted u can buy ur healer 5 extra sec to heal you. tsunami (100% reposte for 12 sec from front only every 3 minish) - again useful for geting pounded on but only really reliable if u wait 3 min per fight it also provides 100% parry from behind and fall of pheonix (group fd) - adds nothing to tanking Bruisers get 2 new atks and 1 spell rune. Seems your tsunami and ward are better suited for tanking then the bruisers new spells Def stances- bruisers and monks are identical, as are all non paladins (pal get 2 resists mag and divine) Off stances - bruisers get a 10% chance to proc 700-1000 dd, monks get 30% haste (which counts towards a cap) 100% haste is the cap, but theres no limit to amount u can proc. a bruiser with a flail > a monk with a flail other then monks can now self reach the haste cap, but grouping with a bard or enc lets u drop stance and still reach cap so /shrug...bruisres is better in this regard I may be mistaken by the numbers since i am at work but 700-1000 dam is w/o using wpns. We get about half as much DD proc while using wpns Defense buffs - both get a stone stance clone....2k mitg while stuned for 30sec -we get 30 sec of 240 mitg, they get 3 min of 1000 mitg at the cost of 100hp for 6 sec (our self haste is roughly 56/ 3 sec).....so not only is our def buff weaker, it lasts much shorter its not 100 hp its percentage based off health i believe 2% currently it costs me 130hp a tick. avoidance -bruisers get more mitigation and identical avoidance. Monks get an additional deflection buff i posted the results in my prior post. dps -bruisers do more dps. Do we ? were are the parses after revamp i was under the impression it is comparable but monks can do as much dps. Not to mention i belive monsk do more stuns/stifles. Use your stuns/stilfes correctly and it makes soling tankign a ton easier. Heals 90 sec self heal with higher %...ours is 3 min now but still less cause its used on others I got to get back to you on the % difference but i know my % was lowered from pre-revamp. ......i know you love your monk and i love mine gaige....but its blatantly over powered to be a bruiser. They have better def buffs (especialy considering they are the offenseive part of the brawler) they have IDENTICAL avoidance to the "kings of avoidance" unless you count a monk who pulls 1 time per 3 min with tsunami, then we have a 12 sec advantage on a 45 sec fight....which then is neglected by the fact bruisers mitigation is a whole 1000 higher bottom line, they do too much dps, get to many defensive buffs, and have no draw back. the evil half of our class shouldnt be more dps, better tanks, ...im fine with them geting more mitigation, but give monks more avoidance, and nerf the bruiser dps PLS they shouldnt be 100-200 dps ahead of a monk who is WAY more fabled then them if they are gonna also be ahead of us in tanking The classes are close i'll give you that much credit but to say bruiser are massively overpower compared to monks i doubt it. A comparably geared monk should do just as well as a comparably geared bruiser. Message Edited by Gungo on 09-21-2005 08:52 AM
You know what I hate? That's what I hate. If you like calling nerf, why don't you go and join your mates on the Guardian forum?
