Maybe they're saving Velious...

Chel'drak I think was more neutral than anything if you consider him a dragon. Also was a shame the two from DoF only end up dying as well, it would have been nice for them to have been freed from the Djinn Master. Only other dragons I can think of that were not truly 'evil' are Harla Dar and Wuoshi, though we end up killing them anyways.
The changes and overall lore involving the dragons mostly just amount to 'go kill them'. We never even learned how Trakanon took over the ring of scale, or why Xygoz has narcolepsy or any of that for example and that was all past expansion stuff now.
I honestly hope they do some interesting things in Odus, like perhaps have a few scenes or interactions with Toxxulia if she appears at all, though I honestly am not expecting much. The lore writers seem more interested in creating new lore, than addressing holes or flaws in the lore that already exists.
I wonder how much of a fail it is going to be when we end up killing the crusaders of skyshrine for their dragon loots, causing the knowledge/ability to re-seal up Kerafyrm to be lost forever.
To be honest though, they should just declare the dragons extinct or something if they are not willing to make them more interesting than 'raid pinata in the shape of a dragon'. The newest dragon added was Zarrakon, and he has three lines of dialogue (not even spoken) and no lore or history whatsoever.
In eqlive there were quests you could do for each of the dragons in Veeshan's Peak, and many of the dragons in Skyshrine/Temple of Veeshan that actually explained the character and their situation at times. Not so much here in Eq2 aside from Nagafen who I doubt many people even really like (I know I dont.).

ah cheldrak. ya he was used as a guardian for zebs knowledge. he knew that would eventualy happen. but even then...
really if sky shrine and/or temple of veeshan are just dragon loot pinantas with no option to aid then against something else instead. it might be time for me to quit. yes i am that serios.
*gets out a "save the dragons, SoE is unfair" picket sign.*

The problem isn't that dragons are loot pinata's. The problem is that there is no REASON for them to be such. There should be some story that explains WHY. Have the dragons suddenly decided that the "lesser" races are to be exterminated? Oh, ok, let's go kill them, fine.
What happened in the last 500 years that has turned dragons into massive, slobering guards of l33t loot? They were at one time among the most intelligent and long lived of Norrath's creatures.

Outside of EQ...Dragons are always hoarding treasure...but yeah, we have no reason to kill most of em, but now...hopefully, dragons aren't the main things to kill.

With Velious, i have a feeling that the giants will be the main thing, when we get it.

Galithdor wrote:

i wouldent say always. remember dragon heart? few other things out there where they dident hord and they were still nice. and even D&D had the metalics who helped others.
even a dragon that hords dosent have to be killable to get its loot. could hand out rewards for a quest.
and thats what im hopeing for Velious myself, aid the dragons against the giants. or possably something else, i dont want to be forced to kill the CoV or any of the dragons there to progress if it can be helped.
... wow i rambled more then expected there...

Slayan wrote:

This has been close to my thoughts as well. I don't want Velious wasted on the grind to a new level cap. I think a lot of the reason EoF was IMO the best expansion release was that they were able to focus on more than making sure there were enough cut and paste soloquests to get the player base to the new level/AA cap. So let unloved and unmissed Odus polish off the Void storyarc, be filled with the crappy quests and new token/faction grinds that will get people to 90/250 and then give us a truly epic Velious that will do it's EQ1 legacy proud instead of screwing the pooch like they did with Kunark

Galithdor wrote:

I hope not. My guild was allied with the giants, even if most weren't, we had fun with it. I'd rather see it like it was, your choice of which faction to help, that was part of what made Velious fun, imo.

Sorako@Crushbone wrote:

that would be for the best actualy. actualy being able to choose what side to fight for like EQ1.
back then had the dwarves, giants and dragons, but the fight was mostly between the dragons and giants.
it would end up being something like Maj'duls three courts. exept even more of an all out war. provided the dwarves are still around. wouldent mind a choice of just dragon or giant thogh. long as the choice is actualy there.
althogh the issue with pick and choose is how will raids be handled? need one person to unlock them for each of the 2-3 sides but dont actualy take faction hits for participateing?

Yeah Velious might also be saved for the no cap raising expansion, so they CAN do exactly that, relying on Factions, but not like RoK, but EQ1 Velious...which would be fun!

Actually, there IS lore behind the reasons why you have to kill all of the dragons in EQ2.
Darathar was a manipulative jerk who was using you to acquire a prismatic egg from Nagafen. He had to die.
The Cult of the Awakened worked for Kerafyrm. If that wasn't reason enough to kill them, then you could always cite the fact that Nagafen needed their marks to create the talisman that enabled you to enter Deathtoll in your search for the Qeynos Claymore.
Wuoshi was guardian of the Bloom or Growth, but it seems like he was really more interested in his own well-being than the cause of Tunare. Anyway, he's one of the few that we off simply because we want his phat lewts (and some Tunarian Wolfsbane to use against Mayong).
The Ring of Scale you were basically duped into killing at the request of the void so that they could acquire the Chelsith Stone, the last rune of which was in the possession of Trakanon. Fortunately, you manage to defeat the void minions and keep the stone for yourself (well, for Mayong).
I totally agree that Zarrakon feels like a random loot pinata, but I feel that most of TSO was rather poorly designed.
Anyways, most of the Dragons of Norrath DO have lore surrounding them, and a perfectly good reason for the PC to want them dead. You simply have to care enough about the lore to look for it.
EDIT: Almost forgot Venekor, who enslaved the Froglocks until you kick his bootay, forcing him to take some of his slaves up to the Overrealm with him to use as manual labor to build the Halls of Seeing. Oh yeah, and he decides to join the Cult of the Awakened as well, presumably so he can steal their stuff just like he stole his daddy's stuff.

Odus sounds dull, yes, but look at it this way. If Velious was next instead of odus, they'd be finishing off the Void in the velious expansion instead of the odus one. Do you really want them to screw up Velious with that void bulls***?

Rebaleo@Antonia Bayle wrote:

They stated this as the reason why they didn't go with Velious this time around. They know it was the most popular expansion back then, and they want to start it off with a brand new fresh storyline.

Cusashorn wrote:

Yeah i remember this, and it will be better with a fresh storyline for sure hah

In all honesty, what I hope for Velious is simple- make it epic.
I fully believe after Odus we are going to have a filler expansion due to the shortened release schedule (If they go back to Novembers), more than likely filling in the last parts of the Shattered Lands with Kithicor, Highkeep, etc.
Then with the level cap raising to 100, I expect Velious to debut the next major story arc- The rise of Kerafyrm the Awakened. This opens up both the Claws of Veeshan and the Giants as allies (like they were originally). I don't expect the Coldain to be an option since judging from the expansion files the Coldain will be present in New Halas, however it is possible that there are still Coldain in Velious as well. The Dragons hate the Giants and vice versa, but everyone wants to stop Kerafyrm. Something also tells me that the level cap will probably freeze at 100 for a while (if not permanently) at this point. More than 100 levels is just... daunting.

i dont play Eq1, and that Odus sound cool, and i do hope it is lot of "eye candy" freaky landscape.

i think Velious were reserved for high-end levels, maybe saving the best of best for last tier adventures.
don't forget, Halasia could be next surprising expansion, the home of barbarian-half giant folks. i dont get it, why we call them barbarians, they seem more "civilized" and artistic crafters, they would have been name as "Aesir" race, sort of offspring of norse asgardian race. devs need time to make "local" causal attire for highlander outfits, nordic robes, and armors.
local scenery for norse buildings, and housing zones, and maybe a guildhall.

also, dont forget ogres and troll's ancestry homelands
reason why devs isnt ready for Velious and storyline as the ocean are dangerous for standard ships, that why the gnomes are currently "Testing" for submarine ships due to no ships were able to navigate treasonous sea or get sunk when trying to locate Velious.
having those ships used for Faydwar and Karnak were already used, so having those newer mode of "travel" is just click on parked submariners as part of new gnome storyline used from Enchanted Lands quest would make sense.

I do not think we will have a "short release year" this year; I think expansions from here on out will release in February at the earliest or possibly moving toward year and a half intervals. I dont really have anything to base that on tbh but its what I truly beleive. Anyway, I think Velious will probably be released as a tier increasing expansion so prob not until 2012. With the recent activity I can see us being led toward a Planar expansion next. Events in the Shard of Love with Mithaniel rushing off to protect PoValor as well as Morell Thule (most likely) returning from his dream sleep, and not to mention Theer for sure playing a role in the next expansion; I see some big godly delimas happening soon rather it be in the form of expansions or Live updates. Some are against another PoP expansion cause they say that PoK killed EQ1 but EQ2's PoK is already in the game; guildhalls.

Cusashorn wrote:

I remember we were slightly at odds over The Void when we were learning about it. I just thought I'd let you know I have tired of it.
/rejoice!

I am one of the many players that anticipated velious rather then odus, but i was ok with odus being the focus of the next expansion. So velious is on the back burner perhaps? It will come out when they devs think it's time i assume. But when i found out odus is sky islands i immediatly concluded it as KoS 2.0.

Hopefulyl Velious is still on Nrorath, from the looks of teh released screenshots, Odus is floating.

Velious would be void free and with that, I am happy.

The dragons in EQ1 were NEVER nice. not one of them.
the ones you 'ally' with in skyshrine and ToV make it very clear that you are nothing more to them then cannonfodder. you are 'permitted' to help your 'superiors' by proving your loyatly, but that's as far as they care about you. and that includes VP as well.
In fact, out of all the dragons, Nagafen is just exactly what the dragons have always been he's frankly just a little more open about it.
out of all teh dragons, the only dragon that we seem to kill under 'false pretenses' is Woushi. mostly becuase the text reguarding Woushi and the bloom we knew about leads you to think Woushi is coveting the Bloom, and doesn't care one way or the other about Tunare or her plans.
We kill VP for a very clear reason. Trakanon has the missing medallion to the Chelsith Stone. we can't get to trakanon becuase the dragons protect/guard the wings with magical barriers we can't get past without thier deaths. basically the entire Ring is just a side casualty of getting to Trak.

As to Odus...Odus itself as we know isn't 'attached' to Norrath. we were told that by Doomcookie before. or it was alluded to. the text reguarding thier Ulterean spires being built and powers by 'Kaborite' refined Void shards, hints even more at a Void influence/infection through the Erudite/Quellthulian race.
I too, was never impressed with Odus. and frankly, so far they've done nothing to impress me about it as far as the continent itself. but we'll see about that in due time.