The regen buff is broken. The haste and rage are the same buff, and its not even that good like master1 would be about 19% increase. Not many people will have the master much less the adept 3, most people only have money for the adept 1 which gives about 8-12% not sure haven't logged on in a while. Granted it does proc alot. All fighters get a group dps buff, so you can't argue that utility cause we all share that one buff. Our self only regen buff works but you have to be hit for it to take affect and it continues to proc, thus overwriting its self. So who knows if it on heals the 31 hp at adept 1. Our infuriate haste/dps buff gets overwritten by our group one. infuriate is 25% at master while the group one is half that. And no way in hell should a guard have the best dps and if you think that you need to uninstall. You picked your subclass for Defense, while I picked mine for Offense with a little tanking ability. The day a guard outdps's me, is the day I uninstall. Sevin Dust Lvl 54 Berserker TDS Lavastorm Server _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________ How is the group regen buff broken afaik it was working fine last week when me and zerker in guild were douing the prophet camp for the heritage in SS. Yeah sorry about the group haste/ rage i meant a slash not comma between them. The zerker in my guild has the master 1 version but rubies are relativly cheap now (80gp) and that buff is insane. It procs so much our zerker is one of the first to overagro. granted we put him in the dps group w and enchanter and a bunch of scouts. I am not sure if he gains the agro from the scouts procing or not but he is always pulling agro w/o taunting. Most people have at least one adept 3 spell nowadays. Which they use to upgrade thier best spells. to say you have the worst utility is unfounded though considering liek i said the only utility brawlers get is shared by other fighters classes. Then we get mend, fd, mezz/fd or invis. zerker get a nice group regen, self hp regen proc (even if it constantly procs thats good it means you are constantly gaining an added hp regen on top of your group hp regen), and rage/haste group buff. Agh i didn't know infuriate gets overwritten by your group buff. that sounds like a bug. Any reason why it overwrites it doesnt sound overpowering at all?
" Follow this logic one more time auto atk dam is equal to other fighters all fighters get aproxiamtely the same number of combat arts all fighters get 1 avodiance buff all fighters get 1 offensive buff since brawlers get more combat arts, guards get more buffs/taunts/protection abilites Hence brawlers have more DPS, guards have better taunting abilities, and protection abilities, more hp, mitigation buffs etc Now SOE is looking into making the Portection abilites more meaningful so that protection combat arts = brawler combat arts usefulness" I have no idea what you are calling Paladins offensive buff to be But if its the lame group proc, give it a rest. the fact is Brawlers can do everything now so to speak, they can heal they can tank they can add something to a group and they can do dps. The supposed class balance in that is a joke because they use all that against other class's any time they ask for more. Paladins want dps or more hp or better mit , sorry no you can heal your self. Guardians want better dps, want a self heal , want to have your buffs be a little better , sorry no you can tank, errrr wait no you were supposed to do that anyways.
IF you consider your group offense rpoc lame then that is an issue dealing w that spell all fighters have 1 offensive spell line that follows them up from lvl 10 call to arms line. That is the 1 offensive group buff i am talking about now if you consider 1 classes version of call to arms superior to another classes version that should be feedbacked and addressed. my point is we all have aporx the same number of combat arts and no fighter has utility mroe then another. What is the problem is some utility is more valuable then another fighters utlity. where i gain combat arts dealign w dps gaurds got combat arts dealign w protection spells. It is those protection spells that must be made as vaulable as my damage combat arts.
How can you make our protection buffs valuable to us while soloing? IMO thats where the biggest inbalance exists..your utility arts help you soloing. Same in small groups, groups with only 1 fighter, groups that dont need to worry about aggro cause that one fighter will always have it...i,e groups like mine...my utility is useless in my groups as well as when soloing...yours however would be useful. In my small groups or when soloing I am half a fighter cause a large portion of my arts are useless.
then if that is the case. Then it is your protection abilites that are flawed and nothing more. Protection skills do not = crusdaer heals/taps or brawlers damage combat arts, or even a zerkers combat arts. the good news is common npcs no longer hit for arcane auto attack damage anymore (on test) and t6 cobalt got a upgrade, BUT past lvl 55 any t5 armour you wear is bascally hurting your tanking ability. Those 2 fixes alone should help gaurds tankign tremendously truth of the matter is t6 legendary (rare harvest ) is better then t5 fabled t6 treasured (non rare) may still be better then t5 fabled. the point being you need to re equip your entire character every tier.
Sure you can, our class was designed around it. If we don't get that, they have to totally re-design our class. They can do whatever they want, and have proven they will. /Attune_all anyone? Guild patron system? Interdependency in crafting? All drastic changes, they aren't afraid to make them (unfortunately, in my opinion). I don't want DPS, I want to be the most defensive tank. Thats the class I chose, not some uber DPS troubador in plate armor.
You can be the most defensive without being the best. Being the "best" would break the game. No fighter can tank substantially better than any of the others.
Or just think, they could up your DPS to lessen the gap in damage capabilities throughout the various fighter subclasses. Same effect, no nerfing. (or they can nerf our dps, I don't care either way honestly).
No, I'm not one of the politically correct guardians who says I don't want another class nerfed, because I do, I want monks nerfed so hard you go back into whine and cry mode for another ten months, rather than insufferable [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] mode.
No don't nerf monks! We would just have 6 fighter classes complaining then. Bring Crusader and Warrior DPS up to the level of Brawlers.
Let me say it again, I don't want to be some uber DPS troubador in plate armor, that isn't the class I chose. Also, I think your probably in the minority of brawlers when saying you wouldn't care if your DPS got nerfed as long as you kept your tanking abilities.
At the risk of you coming up with some seriously creative BS, I'd like to see you explain that one. The game is broke now, thank you very much. I never said we had to tank SUBSTANTIALLY better, just better. Thats how our class was designed and what the description said it would do. The tanking gap should be comparable to the utility/dps gap. This is fairly easily balanced, we should solo slightly worse than you (because we benefit a group more by taking less damage). That means, since we have less DPS and no heals, we have to absorb the damage better. If you don't want the tanking gap to be substantial, then the DPS gap shouldn't be substantial either. It is yours, and obviously some of the dev's, interpretation that tanks should all tank equally. It's a very poor one, and it leads to having no diversity in the fighter archetype if you keep them balanced. You may care to point out that they said all tanks would be tanks. That they did, but remember they also said tradeskills would be interdependant and guilds would use a patron system. Obviously what they said 2 years ago means NOTHING. So stop quoting it. Having said that, I do believe all tanks should be tanks. This doesn't mean they should all be equal tanks, the word equal was left out of my first sentence on purpose. It was left out of theirs as well two years ago, but again what they said doesn't mean anything anyways. All that it requires for you to be a tank is to absorb damage better than a priest/scout/mage. Thats it, nothing more nothing less. As long as your the best choice to tank when your the only fighter in the group, your a tank.
I want to be the best tank, after all, that is what SoE promised me. So I just wish to hold them to their promises. Plain and simple. Message Edited by Airoguy on 10-15-2005 11:05 AM
Because Guardians (self buffed) already have better Avoidance / Health (Mitigation? heard that thrown around, not sure if that is true though) then other plate tanks and are still complaining?
ReviloTX said: Having said that, I do believe all tanks should be tanks. This doesn't mean they should all be equal tanks, the word equal was left out of my first sentence on purpose. It was left out of theirs as well two years ago, but again what they said doesn't mean anything anyways. All that it requires for you to be a tank is to absorb damage better than a priest/scout/mage. Thats it, nothing more nothing less. As long as your the best choice to tank when your the only fighter in the group, your a tank. Eq2 faq sheet Won’t balancing become a real issue with that many classes? Class balance is always a complicated issue, but the archetype system allows us to manage it much more effectively. Each class and subclass is balanced at the archetype level. Every archetype has a main role in a group situation, and each member of a given archetype will be able to fill that role equally well. If you're a fighter, you can tank for a group; if you're a priest, you can heal for a group; and so on. This is the beauty of an archetype system. ___________________________________________________________________________________________________ Those facts sheet has always been on the boards since the games creation. All fighters were meant to tank equally well. That said if they made it so there was 1 best class then you will end up as a fighter who can't get a group because you are unwanted. Sure you might get a group occasianlly but thats because a real tank wasn't available. So no as it is now its fine every fighter can get a group equally well. pre-lu 13 the only tank choice was guard, brawlers were commonly accepted as dps becuase they could not tank as well as a gaurd. Crusaders genrally were considered backup tanks or MA who would use thier gift or armament buff to buff up a guard and land heals on the guard when needed. If no gaurd was avaible because they all were already busy you would take a beserker. But pre-lu 13 you would never have a brawler tank unless you had to. The archtype for fighters is not unbalanced. we all tank fairly equal now. The only issue atm is that your utility type arts are not as useful as other fighters utility. And yes my dps is my utility. since all fighters have the same auto atk damage. My dps comes from my combat arts. You combat arts take the form of protection spells. a paladin combat arts take the form of heals wards etc. we all get the same amount of combat arts. The question is are the combat arts you get equal to other clases combat arts.
Your making a huge assumption and interpretation of what they said. They never said we would TANK EQUALLY. Please find us that quote. They said we would fulfill the ROLE equally, let me explain.. Fantastic! We agree, all fighters should fill the MT role in a group with an equal amount of ability. For guardians, they provide no useful utility nor is their DPS even worth mentioning. However, they take less damage than their brawler counterparts, whom provide more DPS to the group and have some nifty tricks up their sleeves (such as self heals and group FD, among other things). There, we both fill the role EQUALLY well, in different ways. With a brawler MT, you might opt for an additional healer, whereas with a guardian you would choose an additional DPS class. Both choices provide the same end result for the group. On top of that, they specifically mentioned GROUPS. I have never once said guardians should be superior at group tanking, only raid tanking. That's why we all chose this class, to tank raids. On top of that.. I already explained that you can quit quoting what they said previously because it is nul and void and has been proven as such.
There was a post months back that moorguard wrote, essentially he said that tanking would be balanced according to damage,utility, and ability to take damage. He said that if you did alot of dps you would tank less well than a tank that did less dps and so on including heals( which are utility) and your direct ability to how well you could take damage would be less or more depending where you stodd in those 2 areas. Guards had and still have the least dps and utllity. Don't try to shove that crap down my throat that cause guardians tanked better that people stood around waiting for a guardian cause it isnt true and if it were there wouldnt have been all the rabid monks and bruisers running around at lvl 50. Guardians might have been preferred but we werent irreplaceable and every single mob in the game had been tanked by every fighter class in the game, period. All that propogands spewed here is tripe and you all know it.
