So according to update notes....Divine Light no longer critically applies.....can I for once ask what gives? Let us so humbly take stock of what non-shamans in general and templars in particular got to help out doing our prime job this xpac shall we....better buckle up! Mana Ward - an utterly and completely useless damage type ward attached to proc off of a just as utterly and completly worthless ability, Mana Cure. Ward duration of at best 5 seconds, that is if it even bothers to proc (have a better chance of seeing the second coming of Christ tbh than to find I may need an ability that procs so poorly that when it does decide to work it barely registers...that is if your not tandem with a shaman which tbh is another headache in and of itself). Added at the end of beta after the furor over non shaman fixes reached its apex. Ending assessment = pointless. Reverence - A semi-marginal until canceled useful single target ability in which 251% (at grandmaster) of power consumed is converted into a heal. For this xpac again due to complaints over non existant non-shaman fixes/adjustments you added a 4.2% decrease in bleedthrough to target spell is maintained upon. It's usefulness is just this side of a screen door on a submarine. Ending assessment = pointless. Bleedthrough - unwardable damage by any other name is still unwardable damage and every time the dev staff have implemented it it has turned out so badly they have had to eat their words only now instead of a few select high end raid mobs having unwardable damage you place it everywhere in the current tier of the game which has lead to an ever increasing disparity between shamans and non-shaman healers. The state of non-shaman healers currently is pretty bad, in that in raid if you do not have a tandem shaman you are already working behind the 8-ball as non shamans do not have the flexibility of heals or buffs to reliably maintain their group especially in a raid situation. None of this is new as there has been quite a few threads bringing the concerns of the non-shaman community to the forefront on this issue with only raidio silence as an answer. Reactives by themselves in a raid situation will not keep your group up...tandem with a druid only buys you time until the damage catches up (I wont go into the druid issues which are a plenty and others play that class have a far better understanding of their issues. So instead of addressing issues which were apparent on beta over the disparity of shamans vs non-shamans you now decide to nerf our one class ability that helped to contribute something other than heals (which tbh if we are tandem with a shaman are near pointless and go unused) to the ever increasing dps checks and raid mechanics. We could have probably lived with a slight nerf to Divine Light if there was long overdue adjustments that the non-shaman community have been asking for since ToT came out, even more so when Siege of Zek came out and you gave us live testing of Resolve/Bleedthrough which seem to be nothing more that gatekeeping mechanics anyhow. We are not asking for much but we are asking that are of some use when there is not a shaman in group...do our concerns even warrant a response or will the dev team continue to ignore the issue if hopes it may go away???? Welcome to Gatekeeping Ascending.
The only consolidation that we can maybe hope for is that this was done with epic 2.0 in mind. Perhaps epic 2.0 has an effect that makes divine light overpowered to the point that a crit would break the game? But that's probably just thinking too positively about it. I think they just don't care or realize that the fixes to balance healers are too overwhelming to try to implement.
LOL, partner, you act as though they've PLANNED in advance on those...or anything for that matter. At this point in time, in a slow, methodical way, templars have been meta-gamed and nerfed into near uselessness. Our reactives, in raid fights and many heroic fights are awesome, assuming you think using a res spell after someone gets one-shotted is the definition of awesome. We have spells such as ManaCure, which never procs, Reverence and Glory which are so unscaled that casting them is optional to pointless. They meta-gamed around Sanctuary and Holy Shield ("no beneficial spells" and "targeted aoes"). They nerfed sacrifice, shield of faith, divine guidance and divine light. Watching my group drop dead with Divine Guidance up pretty much is a statement as to how useless templars are right now.
I play/have played both clerics only in the ToT to now era and i agree it isn't fun unless it is you and just a tank with you. Tank heals are still pretty solid for a templar, but man, aside from that...it's rough. I feel like an easy fix for clerics would be to have reactives act like wards. Instead of the heal reacting to the damage AFTER it occurs, it would react AS it occurs. Oh well. At least there's immaculate revival.
I like playing my druid atm. idk what issues you're talking about, druid wise... I'm far less annoyed with the lack of attention to my class this xpac than previous ones. The insinuation that a cleric (specifically templar I guess in this thread) paired with a druid (most likely warden since a templar should be healing a tank) is weird. I constantly heal with both cleric classes and have little to no issue. If you're having trouble, I suggest more practice or speaking to those who raid a little more hardcore for some advice.... or get a better heal buddy. If you're calling yourselves useless because your Divine Light doesn't crit now then that is just silly. Play warden from AoM until ToT then you'll see what useless looks like.
Interesting the response Anaiul gives is speak to someone more hardcore or get another heal buddy or more practice....or that she is completely unaware of any issues for druids this xpac and yet even a cursory review of threads going back from KA beta heck even ToT show considerable concern on the part of non-shaman in general and druids in particular by oh my gosh druids....perhaps they didnt get the memo or maybe they should all do as you say or is it command? As for reminding us the issues during Aom....perhaps she may want to refresh her memory of the issues from ToV...if all we are doing is bringing up previous balance screwups that left 2/3 of healers near useless. Ignoring past and current issues with blinders on only brings short term gain at long term losses.
Man this post is out of touch. I don't care how uber you may think you are or anyone else is... the healing is really imbalanced right now.
So let me see if I got this correct....non-shaman (btw that includes druids and clerics in multiple threads since ToT through KA beta and launch) that are seeing issues become exacerbated since we went live are all what in error, wrong, dumb, suck? Your answer to a considerble amount of the community both on the forums and in game that have repeatedly brought these issues up is that we all need more practice, speak with someone more hardcore or get a better heal buddy...wow just wow. As to your reference of the problems during AoM/ToT encountered by druids and if you didnt play one during that time not to talk with you (least thats the way it's coming)...shoot if we want to bring up past class balance mechanics and their issues that were intentionally ignored...well than lets all enter Mr. Peabody's way back machine and review ToV and the pretty massive issues non-druids had there... Ignoring class issues does not make them go away it only compounds the problem.
The difference is: play any difficult instance with a shaman and then play any difficult instance with any other healer and see which one feels better. We had a 9k potency defiler who didn't meet the resolve check heal our group the other night. It was flawless. I have been in groups where someone double boxed healed shrouded temple with a defiler compared to a 13k warden having trouble. The biggest thing is, a good defiler can carry a bad group. A GREAT cleric or druid can heal a good group and bring people back to life quickly and keep them cured. That is not balance. And in no way do I feel that shaman are OP. It is just that the game mechanics don't allow for other healers to do the same types of things. I switched to inquisitor because my guild already has 3 templars, and I wanted to try out the hp buff. In doing so, I can keep the group alive better, but I am gimped on tank heals compared to a templar. Also, my damage is terrible because of having to spec left side with no good damage procs like the templar has (divine light and right side prestige). So I trade great tank heals and damage for keeping a group alive a bit better and perhaps boosting my summoners a bit. Conversely, if I were to play my defiler, I would have the best of both worlds. Damage from the wards, good single target wards, good group wards. If I had my crafting and greenmist done on my defiler there is no way I'd have a cleric as my alt right now. Unfortunately, KA has made it so that even my cleric will probably become obsolete soon enough because I don't think I'll want to get epic 2.0 for him. 1 character is enough. If they allowed reactives to act like wards and if they gave a big hp boost to a few druid HoTs, it would go a long way to making the world a balanced place for healers. But again, I really don't think they care.
I'm not sure if allowing reactives to work akin to wards or certain HoTs to jack HP is where we should go but I'm all for the discussion....they may be a benefit they may not but to not discuss it is foolhardy. Plus not exactly sure if they could code reactive mechanics chages like that...thought I remembered reading somewhere that wards/hots vs reactives coding wise were easy peesy whereas reactive mechanics were a nightmare...but still worth discussion.
On a serious note, the solution isn't to code reactives to work like wards (seriously, keep dreaming, that would be so stupidly op). The solution is to increase HP to a point where healing could be challenging for reasons other than surviving one-shots. We have 30x as much potency now as we did in tov, and what... 5x as much hp? And that's before you consider cb, fervor, and special crits. Little wonder, then, that healing has gotten unbalanced. Same for tank temps - the strong classes are those that can DR or avoid damage outright. Paladin/bruiser self-heals aren't much help, and SK is only better off because of stuff like Furor. idk why they're going to complicated stuff like bleedthrough when it could be solved easily through itemization with a simple HP bump.
Nah, I'm saying you're making a mountain out of a mole hill over this Divine Light thing. My comment about if you want to see useless, play a druid from AoM from ToT should have been taken exactly the way it read. You don't know useless until you've played a warden through those expansion packs its essentially why wardens are basically hard to find except as alts of alts. Exacerbated... please. Not once though did I say someone was dumb or they sucked, that was something you inferred yourself plus it is against forum rules.
They cant just buff hp like that.. Inq gets the huge HP buff (which is amazing) But then they added to mobs 200-500% max hp dmg every so many secs(dot)... so when our max hp goes form like 6mil to 20mil the amount of damage we take increases dramatically... which even hinders wards. So we go from a 12mil hit (200% @ 6mil hp) to a 40mil hit at (200% @ 20mil hp) to each person in group. lets say group wards hit for 60 mil... only 1 and half people actually get warded... you still have 180mil health not warded. Then reactives and dots... but those hit after damage is hit.. meaning everyones already dead from taking a 40mil hit with only 20mil hp. not to mention that bleedthru (was said to be higher) still only does like 10% or so even in raids..
"Not once though did I say someone was dumb or they sucked, that was something you inferred yourself plus it is against forum rules." Anaiul you did say and I quote " I constantly heal with both cleric classes and have little to no issue. If you're having trouble, I suggest more practice or speaking to those who raid a little more hardcore for some advice.... or get a better heal buddy." Now you may have not ment to imply that but the reality is that how most took it....when you suggest people who do believe there is an ever growing problem with regards to heal mechanics and wards vs non wards and one of your suggestions is to go practice...not really sure how else they will take it... It is also true the longer a fight goes on the more apparent these issues become so dps or the lack thereof is yet another indicator we need to consider.
Yeah, scripting hits for 200% max hp is the sort of thing we can easily agree is a terrible idea, and they need to stop that. So I'll have to go ahead and disagree with the idea that "[paraphrased]they can't improve mechanics because then horrendous script ideas won't work."
