Is it really necessary to remove this ability from the game? yes it really is the same thing as making it not work on mobs over 100. Did you have an alternative upgrade or something that works on mobs above 100? So therefore in future expansions you can't use it anymore etc? Can someone actually explain why? p.s. How many people on the current design team actually played eq when it first came out? Can you tell me why a group would want a enchanter? Because noone I talk to in the game does. Dps? no cc? not needed anymore. So many classes can pull easily now and thats all a group wants puller? not really. Yes they can some but a group ever really want a chanter to pull? tank? no healer? no. Ok some of the runes are helpfull with named ae's... Anyone else care to chime in that really likes the enchanter class and feels the same way?
I really enjoy the class, though I'd prefer not to have to rely on charmed pets to have any dps at all. I know that in my groups I almost always pull, but I group with people I know and that know me. Bards can pull better than I, that I know. I think if our 'fade' was on a much shorter timer, and didn't stun us it would be a toss up (though we definitely can't take the hits they take... runes kind of work that out though.) Some say we can replace a tank as well, but those people aren't thinking of nameds/stun immune mobs. I'm not sure why compliant lurch being unable to pull level 100+ mobs hurts us, I've never used it on them myself. What is it about this change that hurts us in the current game? (or is it only on raids that it's used?)
Its not like its a game breaker but I would really like to know why they think its needed to remove it from the game. Obviously they think its overpowered in some way. What you can do to use it to pull is if a named is in a bunch of trash mobs, you can complaint lurch on the named then just run to an area with no mobs and then self stasis. All the mobs run back to their spawn point except the named. Of course you need to survive some hits from the named. Because its stuck to you like glue.
when this came out, I would mez something, lurch it, blur it, and just run a trash mob pretty much any where i wanted. I could see the Root issue with named, this spell just has so much utility.
The thing is, in group or raid content, you can use it the same way. An enchanter can keep a mob lurched, while a tank keeps agro on the mob and backing away after getting summoned. In this way, any mob can be 'summon tanked,' greatly reducing the amount of heals necessary on the tank. The other classes' 'get over here' abilities aren't constant, so can't be used in this way. I'm not trying to say I agree with the nerf, it is a great 'trick' that chanters still can provide and haven't been given to other classes. They could just make certain mobs immune to lurch, if they absolutely wanted to nerf it against some mobs.
I remember when CL first went live, and people were using it to drag nameds arcoss rooms and such. Hopefully, with the fixing of the level cap they will introduce a newer versions (maybe in aa form?)
The only mobs I ever used it on was raid mobs (level 100+). So this nerf just effectively made the spell useless. /sigh
This will make the spell near useless for the future t3 (100+ named) and t4 zones (98 too 101 trash and 102+ named) and raid mobs 90% useless. MANY other classes have gank or grapple abilities to position mobs but Enchanters? Heck with Enchanters!!! We can punt them with a very little control and risk the wraith of the tanks when blur takes effect though. We are over powered obviously . If this goes live we will again lose a piece of our tiny sliver of utility for raiding. Mythose
Should be group mobs only or selected raid/group named mobs. No one (in there right mind) is going to use a Lurch+ Summon tank stragegy for taking out the trash.
Can we actually get a response from someone on the dev team? This is why I have never posted anything on the boards since playing from day 1 of release. Because I figured that I would never get an actual real intelligent honest response. Can we get an actual explanation as to why this change is being made etc??
I feel there is a slight over reaction to this ability being "Changed" Consider the fact that Even in the new expansion, You will still be able to use Compliant Lurch on white con mobs, or lower. Consider the fact that being able to use this on a even con, is not going to change the way CL works when it comes to pulling, very much, It's just going to make you use more of your tool belt to make such things happen. Its not going to affect charming, at all. What this change is really intended for, is to prevent Enchanters from using Lurch on future raid targets. Lets be honest, Many MANY guilds abused this to gain access to higher tiers through VOA. To ensure summon tanking could be utilized, when it wasn't necessarily intended to be used as such. I propose a different change, A different approach to the problem SOE is attempting to fix. Instead of placing a level cap on the ability "Complaint Lurch" Instead, flag it so it can no longer be able to be used on RAID content. We all know the Raid flag exists, By linking Lurch to this flag, you ensure no lurching could be utilized to make some raid events easier, Without actually directly impacting the group gameplay experience. This will prevent exploitation of this ability, while still allowing the utility of such to be used in a fashion that will retain the enchanter toolbelt, without sacrificing "Intended usage"
I would love to see the change that Dandin is suggesting. Yes I over-reacted some. Its mostly in response to, what every enchanter already knows, that cc'ing isn't required anymore. And enchanters aren't sought after in groups anymore. I totally agree that summon tanking should be stopped. Thanks for the posts in response to mine. I didn't know people were summon tanking. I wanted to hear about some kind of valid reason.
I thing that people are forgetting is the lack of people coming to the game today. With the introduction of merc's I also feel clerics/healers are not as plentiful as they once used to be. Lurch made it easier to deal with the lack of healing that guilds have. I am not in beta so I am not sure what is in store for us to nerf us in any way at all, But I am getting back to the point where I don't even want to play again.
CC isn't required? wow, news to me, and i play a druid/enchanter/mage trio. so if something wants to wander off, or if one gets adds, we no longer have any need for crowd control? snares, mez, charm (I have used it as crowd control too... charm one of the extras and let it be a free DOT on the one being tanked)... they have given enchanters some really good spells to use in groups... besides the exp boost aura, the aura and spells to boost aggro on targets, enchanters still slow (with cripple combined for 6 minutes at top end), mez, the Aura rune that pulses a nice rune on the group that's nearby over and over and we have a few nice nasty debuffs for nonslowable NPC's like Mental contortion (cut the chance of the NPC hitting by up to 40 percent), spin stuns... let alone the buffs for haste and such... sure we're not required for groups. and sure, we're not gonna out DPS shadowknights harm touch, ranger's endless quivered headshots, magicians who can really lay on DPS in spells... but we fall into a niche that still works with groups...
they have given enchanters some really good spells to use in groups... besides the exp boost aura, the aura and spells to boost aggro on targets, enchanters still slow (with cripple combined for 6 minutes at top end), mez, the Aura rune that pulses a nice rune on the group that's nearby over and over and we have a few nice nasty debuffs for nonslowable NPC's like Mental contortion (cut the chance of the NPC hitting by up to 40 percent), spin stuns... let alone the buffs for haste and such... sure we're not required for groups. and sure, we're not gonna out DPS shadowknights harm touch, ranger's endless quivered headshots, magicians who can really lay on DPS in spells... but we fall into a niche that still works with groups...[/quote] Yes enchanters have a lot of abilities, but we either lack the spell gems to keep those up, or the ability is not worth using. Yes a run aura sound nice, but it is not enough to help out a weak healer and not needed when you have enough healing, it is much better to just drop the enchanter and bring up another merc cleric then use the rune aura. Deep sleep is one of our better debuffs, but it takes luck to land it, either it lands on the first cast or it never lands once while chaining it on a named mob. And mental contortion reduces the chance to hit by 40 percent with all SKILLS. In the old days tanks had problems holding aggro, but that is not true anymore. A group will make more experience per hour with a dps class then an enchanter going dps and using the exp aura. Yes we have a nuke that lands a spin stun, but the duration on that stun will be fixed sooner and later and if any tank has problems tanking trash mobs, then they will never be able to tank a named so why use that tank. Enchanters strengths are not really needed when most area's are easy to pull and where most not all classes have an ability to at least CC one mob. Yes we have a spell that is a combination of slow and cripple, but that spell can not land if a shaman lands a slow.
The change was an over-reaction. They don't want guilds negating the need for a real tank by using an Enchanter to lurch the raid-boss which allowed you to essentially summon-tank a mob reducing its DPS by a huge amount. They could've just made Lurched mobs function like a perma-rooted mob with a pet at 2nd on aggro. So that it immediately turns on the closest person who is highest on aggro, either the Chanter or a DPS. Either way I'm glad they removed lurch-tanking because that was a pretty stupid strat. However I would like Lurch to continue working on raid-bosses until they remove push, which was the original point of the spell I think. To counteract push on raid bosses.
When I first saw the spell, I was all "what the hell am I going to do with this?!" Myself, and the chanters I raided with at the time, never thought about using it to lurch tank, nor did we ever do it. I would like to think this was an attempt to cure push, but that never happened haha. Honestly, the only time I messed around with lurch was when I wanted to pull mobs around to mess with other players. But here we are, and people have been using it to "lurch tank" raids and it shouldn't surprise anyone its getting changed. I don't think thats what its intention was to be, and even though I get upset at any change made to our class, I'm not as much for this one.
