20 Teek Guilds (4000+ players), 2 Tormax Guilds (40 players)

Yup, the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many.

I truly think the right choice is:

Make Tormax a Teek clone with boxing enabled. This likely represents the best population split. Then once we're well past PoP, both server populations start to fall off and Teek is already relaxed Truebox, just combine the servers and call it a day.

I am not trying to attack Tormax. I am just presenting the numbers I see. These numbers are more concerning for Teek players than Tormax players in my opinion.

Most things people in the thread point out in favor of Tormax apply in equal measure to Teek (There are guilds not advertising, there are players who don't join discords before launch etc etc). Generally we expect to see a similar percent of the total playerbase of each server end up in guild prior to launch. So if 40 people in discords/guilds prior to launch for Tormax is likely to yield 400-1000 people on game day then you can do the math on what that means for Teek.

And you have no knowledge about how many of those discord users on the servers for Teak are actually going to play on the new server. If you look around at discord servers for the live servers you will find they all have plenty of people that either don't belong to the guild anymore or even no longer play but stick around to chat with their friends.

It has never been a question about which server will have the larger player base rather the idea that there are only 2 guilds with 40 players between them looking to get going on Tormax.

There are better ways to point out that Teak will have a larger population besides making a claim that Teak will have 20 guilds with 4k+ people and Tormax will have 2 guilds with 40.

But that was never his claim. And you know it.

The problem is when looking at those guilds with larger discord servers you have no idea how many of them are actually planning on playing on Teak and are not just members that joined for previous TLP servers or other reasons.

The title of the post was never the claim?

No, it obviously is not. He was very clearly pointing out that one server has a ton of interest and the other does not. No one thinks there's going to be 2 guilds on Tormax total nor does anything realistically believe there'll be 40 players on Tormax total.

Using flawed data that doesn't give an accurate picture of what is going on. Not only is it true that not every one who is forming a guild has posted a recruitment it is also true that not everyone in a discord for a guild that is recruiting is going to join the new server.

But honestly what is the point of making a thread with a title about the number of guilds/players on both servers if it isn't to try and say that one server is going to do much better then the other?

I guess you misunderstood and are having difficulty with keeping up with the thread. He is showing that there's higher interest in one server over the other. Much higher interest.

There's been no conjecture that Teek will have only 4k players nor that Tormax will only 40. You are the only one to assert that was the point of the thread. Both servers will have a much higher player count.

The data is not flawed as it is not a complete data set. There may be a nuance in the data. Someone mentioned guilds that play every TLP would likely have a higher discord count. This may be the case and would certainly change numbers if there's players that aren't planning on playing on Teek in that count, but there's still relevant information in that data. For example, why are all of the TLP rerolling guilds on Teek and none on Tormax?

If I were running a business and wanted both servers to stay successful long term, this is the kind of data point that would have me losing sleep right about now.

Right? It's a legitimate canary in the coal mine for Tormax

I think this is the best option too. I don't know if they'd ever combine them and obviously Teek would still be much more popular, but it would make a chunk of the community extremely happy and split the population of the servers more evenly than Teek vs Tormax in its current form. A Yelinak rules server just won't compete with a Mischief rules server

I don't think they've merged Thornblade with Mischief yet, probably due to the popularity of the ruleset.

What we learnt from this thread:

1. A lot of people dislike a certain responder to threads. I won't name names. Said individual also fails to understand how extrapolation and surveyed samples work. Let's provide a scholarly example for said individual on how this works.

Statistical sampling occurs when a random number generation is used to select a subset of a discrete population. Extrapolation is the second step of the process, where values are extended by inferring unknown values from trends in the known data set to make determinations about the population as a whole.

2. Barring drastic change to Tormax, the queues for Teek are going to be astronomical. Good chance we melt the entire DBG infrastructure like we did on Aradune. (not intentional of course - but just sheer volume of players) Hopefully we can log in before Memorial day bonuses are over.

3. Please for the love of your servers, just make Tormax a Teek clone + relaxed truebox or no boxing restrictions on launch. <insert bernie sanders meme here> we are no longer asking.
This will balance the populations nearly perfectly split if not actually making Tormax more popular.

Looking at the population of discord servers for guilds that have posted that they are recruiting on a server doesn't give you the data that you think it does. How many of those guilds/discord servers have been playing on TLP servers for a while? How many have been created just for this new round of TLP servers? How many of the users on those servers are actually planning on joining the new TLP server?

The problem is you can't say for sure that any user in those servers is going to be playing on Teak

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Teak isn't going to be the stronger server, just that the numbers being used are not realistic

The higher, the fewer

I highly doubt Darkpaw will create a Thornblade 2.0 after the past outcries about server mergers were dismissed.

I posted suggesting this but there was a big disclaimer. They should just set a date now where they plan to merge the servers. "After OoW, we will merge the servers on X date". They should just do it and it wouldn't be an issue. This serves many purposes including infusing aging servers with fresh people. And it lets people know that they'll be merged no matter the server they pick early. It would really help even out populations. Oops I rolled on Tormax but that's OK!

Because you are right, historically they haven't done the best job of doing it when they should.

It is scheduled for this summer.