Someone explain to me why FTE is so hated, I don't get it.

I always play a puller, I like to pull. I usually have a good grasp on the mob density in an area when I'm in a group that is killing fast and I have noticed on many occasions adds that shouldn't be there, mobs pathing through the camp while I'm further out etc. Do a /who and see there's one player in the zone who disappears. Not all training is the idiot who spends 15 minutes rounding up a cluster of mobs that lag the zone out. Also the fact that you attack people with a accusations of PTSD or that people are "anti-social" sort of makes me wonder about your play habits

Me anti-social? I made a Youtube video for my thread, care to join me? https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq...-added-to-the-swag-store.296766/#post-4293273

As for PTSD, this is literally a 13 page thread of people licking each others words because they got trained once or twice and now they want bowling bumpers added into the game. Conflict is not always a bad thing and can at times be controlled. Some of the friends ive made in this game was through conflict, you train someone have it be on purpose or accidental you end up talking to the person, same with KSing and or races. Am I the only one who put on that plastic headset earpiece thingy in 2001 and got called gamer words while playing Halo? Id get called gamer words, maybe id call them gamer words then three games later we would be friends.

well if you get super lonely you can still go sit on top of someone's camp and race for each tag. there's still other toxic ways to make friends, be creative!

Look at all these zerglings going absolutely mental because they couldn't DPS race someone's mob or train them for a whole server!

Must be from all the time playing in those "top" guilds with your 300 closest helmet wearing pals.

FTE was not about TRAINS....the fact it solved that issue also was simply a bonus....it was called FTE (First to Engage) for a reason. Max level characters farming zones way beneath their level and preventing level appropriate players to xp there. Kill stealing has been an age old problem in EQ. That is why FTE was added. The issue of trains was a bonus benefit.

Man you are angry. Did the monk who hasn't thought about eq in 20 years hurt you that badly in 2004?

Works fine for me - except for the couple of classes that can abuse it, Generally only happens on epic mobs.
Didnt solve the PL people

It never was intended to solve the PL problem as they could have just made it so that no one got xp/loot from a mob that was unlocked by /yell.

Why would other people Pl'ing be a problem for you?

Well, Mr. "PNP didn't exist" that got shown it DID, you might want to read the part that discusses Zone Monopolization/Disruption, most PLers do either or both where an entire zone is locked out for others.

If-when they would adjust PL zones to pickzone at appropriate thresholds for how the PLers use them, it wouldn't cause that issue - but they will take a 20-40 threshold zone and have 10-15 people MAX in the zone.

Not sure why this thread keeps rolling.

Riler Devour was right. Their post already solved this thread on page 4, we're now at page 13 and still not a single pointed coherent argument has been made.

Nope, that post is just plain wrong.

#1, the reason why I am still posting is because of the constant lie that nobody gives EQ reasons why they don't like FTE. I guess I gave half a dozen.

#2 I have been consistently saying, fine have your FTE servers but I will play non-FTE, while the FTE crowd has consistently stated "All servers should be FTE." They have NEVER backed off on this! No, "Right, we should have one new FTE TLP server and a Non-FTE server for those that want it." Just the same non sequitur attacks "You must be a looking to train people or kill steal in game!" In 25 years I have gotten exactly one warning, for saying "you must be a troll" to someone that said I was faking screenshots and lying. Jerk reported me for language. Yet even though I have been here for 25 years w/o a mark in game, people still bring this 'You must be a kill stealer" up.

As a side note, if you(meaning those that say it) think you can out compete a cheater using hacks, god bless you! Really, it means you don't know what is available, how data is delivered to your computer, and that is a good thing.

I'll say it one more time, I have been playing since 1999 and I doubt if I have sent 5 petitions reporting bad behavior to Verant, SOE, DB, DP. The level of hysterical responses is incredible! Some people just make it sound like they are getting harassed 24/7. 100:1 type responses? I haven't been harassed 100 times in 25 years and I spent months on the PvP server. It makes it look bad for people running the game and the people that play it.

FTE is bad, not only does it ruin immersion, but it also wastes the time of every single person playing on a server with that rule engaged. It's a small amount to be sure, but those nickels and pennies sure do add up quickly.

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If a mob has a 3-5s variable on it's ability to be engaged and dispatched, you are affecting my experience rate.

(40 mobs in camp, 17m:30s respawn times)

If I want to have a clear camp and reach the maximum potential for XP I would need to kill 1 mob every 26.25s.
Completely achievable on non-FTE servers with a solid group.

With FTE delay-to-engage I am now killing at 28s-32s.
Meaning that the camp is no longer completely clear and over the course of the time spent there I am earning less XP than I should be able to obtain. And over the course of that 17m:30s it has prevented me from killing approximately 8 mobs.

And this occurs 3.5 times over the course of an hour at that camp.

Should each mob provide you 1% of experience, you will have 28%~ less experience at the end of that hour than you should have been able to obtain.

This is without anyone contesting you for dibs, or having to deal with the mobs "pathing" back to their spawn after losing agro from another encounter.

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This alone should be enough to warrant FTE to be changed in it's current form, but naysayers will just say I wanna train someone for some GEBS...

Pity

They could change FTE to have zero delay but then it would favor the botters...So your extra tick per mob is laughable...

What this thread has clearly proven is that the FTE HATERS in general hate it because they can not kill steal (fight for a mob already engage) or train someone in a camp they want that is occupied.

They will make up a bunch of non sense because the we want to train people who got there first is not a winning argument...

And there are a few people that think this game was designed for DPS racing....it was not and was never the intent....early on in EQ before we made it to 2000 taking an already engaged mob was called kill stealing and was frowned upon to a point that in early 2000 they created the PnP...

This thread is a showcase of the FTE Fanboys extreme cases. They make it sound like everyone who dislikes FTE was running around Kill Stealing them in all past servers, and FTE delivered the fanboys from that rampant evil.

I was okay before FTE (With all the issues) , I was okay in Oakwynd with FTE (and all it's issues). I am just amused to the extremes some go to paint whoever even breathes a word of criticism about FTE as some KSing RMTer. Guess it makes them feel good about themselves, it just amuses me.

We know FTE is here to stay - Some of us are just saying it is not puppies and unicorns all the time (and it was NOT doom and gloom Pre-Oakwynd), and those of us saying it are also players from 99, and players on multiple TLPs, including Heaven err Oakwynd.

There are like 1 or 2 instances of someone KSing me in the last decade - i find it hard to believe you are being continuously KS'ed as you seem to take particular exception to it. If your group is clearing mobs at a proper pace no one is coming to squat on top of you and kill mobs unless they are provoked or a botter. So if you are being KSed constantly what are you doing to provoke it?

People taking pulls you tagged but haven't engaged is not KSing and it is annoying but not as annoying as some of the flaws in FTE.

FTE itself isn't half bad they just need to put the extra effort into fine tuning it and I think the complaints would go away.

Edit - just to be clear proxy aggro / taunt should not be triggering the lock. Engaging should be 3-5% dmg to ensure mob is summoning and prevent exploitation. This is the way.

The primary function of FTE was to eliminate petitions from training and the associated petition wars. It has accomplished that, so FTE is here to stay.

I can think of MANY cases from pre-Mischief, as I like to do GEBs camp for XP (boots/ring are a bonus, not a feature) and the number of times I'd have people run in and try to steal the camp is nearly beyond counting.

Yes, Mischief cycle it was almost nil because of the random factor. And Oakwynd due to TLE. But Yelinak before that? It was not nearly as bad as my previous on Phin a long while before (I was with Phin almost cradle to grave) but it was still something that was a FREQUENT occurrence, almost always solo folk gating in and trying and failing, with rare successes - but even then, the attempts were quite annoying.

True there is still a lot of exploitation on Oakwynd even in its current state. You can just tag a mob and kite it to prevent someone else from fighting it even if you are not killing it.

Pretty sure they added in a time limit before the mob unlocks to prevent it from being kited forever.