So... *attended* automated gameplay IS allowed?

They could have just said that automated gameplay is against the rules, but they chose to qualify that with the word "unattended". The obvious implication is that attended automated gameplay is permitted. Is this why they have never done anything about the PLers automating their enchanter stuns, or the SG farmers, or the raid loot sellers? Even if they are doing it unattended, there's always the plausible deniability that it was attended automation so no action taken?

And then, if you try to automate attended gameplay you could just get a GM who doesn't like you and then claim that you were unattended when you were not. It just gives them an excuse to pick and choose favorites for who is allowed to automate and who is not. This is why people want more transparency, but they only make it more opaque.

One of the topics I wronte a letter to the CEO about.

Technically in-game 5-line macros are automated attended gameplay. For the most part, you can't go afk fast enough for them to be considered unattended. I've done it on my chanter though, for greater mass enchants. Set up a 5-cast macro, click it, run afk to stir the food on the stovetop or hit the fridge for some delicious door water, run back, and drop all 5 cursor items into my inventory. Come ban me!

I sense a suspension in the thread.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and say that it's possible they chose that specific wording, to avoid litigation. For example, a lot of past and probably current players have some degree of disability. For some, using automation to any degree, may be the only way they can play. Banning a disabled player might open them up to a civil suit on the grounds they violated the Americans With Disabilities Act.

If they just banned all 3rd party programs and developed their own in-house boxing/automation program that included ONLY the things they are fine with, then they wouldn't have to do this dance through the legal minefield.

You guys are splitting hairs.

I wouldn't read much into any of their answers.

I asked a similar question a few months ago - there was a guy I saw 24/7 afk-killing frost giants for pp (I guess). I was in and out the zone for a couple of weeks doing LDoN's and they were always there, you could go up and hail him, nick the giant corpse's stuff - whatever.I guess that was a technically okay behavior as it was merc-afk killing from the look of it.

It's not so much what is / isn't allowed, it's if anyone gives enough to actually police it. Personally I wish they would, it's one of those things that the mindset filters through elsewhere and might actually end up with a slightly more respectful atmosphere everywhere in-game.

Short answer its bannable, long answer is probably bannable. They can essentially ban you for whatever they really want in the end.

I don't believe they have the people let alone the ability to mesh with an antiquated game engine, something like that. Probably why they haven't outright banned automated gameplay.

One of the other questions does not use "unattended" as a qualifier.

In any case, the best thing to do is to report them anyway.

Yeah, but that says "illegal use of third-party programs", and we know what they consider to be illegal use of 3rd party programs, "unattended automated gameplay"

Much of what they said about things that sofrware is or isn't allowed to do in the past has been about the actions that it can perform and not about the player being present or not.

There is a different issue around unattended play where actions that are normally okay are not allowed. This includes things like a merc or pet killing things for you while you afk and do other things. While there is no issue for you to let them kill things for you if you are at the keyboard it isn't okay if you are not at the keyboard.

from this post

That's a very cool story. But from this much more recent post (by 2 years) they will not say what kind of software is not allowed, only behaviors done with that software, specifically unattended automated gameplay.

Look at what I have bolded it is using unattended automated gameplay as an example but didn't say that was the only thing that wasn't allowed. You seem to be doing a lot into twisting the statement into saying something that it doesn't..

I am merely speculating, but I would think if I hit one button and then lean back in my chair, hands clasped behind my head, while my six person box group crowd controls and defeats a seven mob pull in five minutes... I would think that (a) this is attended automated gameplay, and (b) I would get banned from the game.

To me, it feels like threads created like this are either by players who (a) are trying to circumvent the system and playing game lawyer to try to allow themselves to do something they know is wrong but can reword it to match a dev saying yes... or (b) they are so scared to play that they forget common sense and need everything in black and white.

Just sit at the computer, hit some hotkeys, move your mouse around, type away at the keyboard, and play the game.

And this is why lawyers and way to long EULAs exist, someone always trying to game they system, versus common sense.

It's really simple. Suppose some sharp coder writes an app that does all manner of illegal stuff in game. Warping across zones, nodelay melee, teleport straight to mobs, invulnerability etc. and every time the game is patched he renames the app. So DBG knows about the GAWDMODE program and specifically names it as banned and bannable but he patches and now it's Grandma'sjam.

They have to specify what's illegal not what the current name for a program

It's really simple. Because they know people will try to twist their words (see: this thread), they use a cut-and-dried example to illustrate their statement. Of course, then people still try to twist their words (see: this thread).