Rogues adjustment for new tlp and PLers

Were rogues weak in 1999, or did TLP rogues become weak due to changes in the game?

Noone is balancing the game around group damage output. Come on.
And how exactly do you create a situation where rogue damage is ONLY buffed in classic? What does that look like?

Rogues dont need help past classic. Once they do their epic in kunark, they are doing pretty well. Again, just because they arent #1, doesnt mean they need buffs.

Rogue was very strong back in p99. Stronger than other dps classes. There have been a number of changes to spell damage values and pets across the years that are much higher than what they were originally. This is also the case for monk fist damage ratio. It was not as good as it is currently.

Example, Frost Storm spell for wizard
In classic it did 250 dmg in 3 Waves for 312 mana. Total of 750 dmg. 2.4 mana efficiency
It's now 512 dmg in 3 waves for 271 mana. Total of 1536 dmg. 5.6 mana efficiency.
About 2 in a half times better now

Rogues were gods before they implemented some permanent dmg buff to monks, I don't remember when it was, maybe in Luclin? But monks were 1/2 the dps of a rogue back in the day. P99 is a great example of how useless Monks were outside of being pullers for raids.

Even right now as is, a monk could only dream of keeping up with an Epic'd rogue during Kunark, they're not touching rogues until Gharn's in Velious and even then it probably just balances them out. It's only during Luclin that they start to SLIGHTLY outpace rogues due to AA's making monks even more powerful.

A good rogue knows how to play, they know they can backstab from side angles, they should know positioning, they should PREDICT mob changing positioning, and they need to focus on giving it their all. Monks are AFK auto attack automatons, just like SK's eventually become such a busted broken class that even the worst players make them look OP.

Rogues DPS is just as horrible in raids. Let a cleric nuke on a raid and they will probably out DPS the rogue. I am pretty sure my guild actually did this on a classic raid on one of dragon kills. It was near the end, we were bored. Rogues are bad.

I literally just said in the post you quoted how you would buff only rogues and only in classic. You give them a buff that is only active while Classic is active on the server. They can give mobs buffs that are only active while certain expansions are active, I am sure they could do the same for rogues. They aren't going to because it is no where near the top of their priority list, but they could.

Unfortunately, it seems like if you want the rogue experience - roll one in WoW Classic - much better feel of a rogue. If you do roll one and nothing wrong with it, just advertise DPS LFG and hope to sneak into one before they realize you are a rogue! People love to hate the rogue - and keep your pick pocket skilled up!

I know of damage bonuses that START in certain expansions, thats easy, its locked behind AAs. But i wasnt aware of any damage buffs that ONLY stay active during certain expansions. You know what i mean?

And i agree rogue dps is BAD in classic. I just dont think you need to mess with the game just for 1 small part. Once rogues get their epic (which is probably the easiest epic in the game) they are just fine.

It's simple, just add augs to the melee aug vendor that only affect backstab damage on 1hp.

That and giving the Front Backstab AA innately would basically 'fix' rogues.

your rogues must be terrible.

The problem with rogues is it's not an 'easy' class so most play something they don't really need skill for.

It happened way before the removal of corpse runs. Bards, SK, and well played Enchanters could perform some of the most difficult CR's or if you had cash ask a necro. They should have gave rogues a better poison and use for decades ago.

Uhhh, What? Rogues are among the easiest classes to play skill wise. My necro had to juggle 6-7 dot timers, manage aggro, manage a pet, figure out which spells will land on which mobs and what the best rotation is for each. My rogue... set backstab on autofire stood behind the mob and evaded every once in a while.

you're a great example.

Thank you!

This made me chuckle.

Sounds to me like there are lots of bad rogues in here. You all want more DPS because "you're" not the #1 DPS on the charts. There is more to the game then hitting auto attack and then watching Netflix... Some of these ideas show your just being lazy like "frontal backstab at day 1." lol... yeah that tells me you cant be bothered to watch your positioning and your losing DPS from that.

Frontal backstab would improve 2+ boxing and that seems to be what EQ has devolved into for the most part.

They were weak always have been. Once real data started coming out and players began learning fights more advantages such as evading were no longer needed.

I managed to top parses on both classes, against players I know are good at their class. Pray do tell, what do you think it is that makes a rogue so complicated? Timing when to use their handful of discs? Or maintaining their position behind the mob? Or remembering to hit the auto attack button? Hell, even my Beastlord was more complicated to play well than the rogue. I ended up quitting the rogue because I was falling asleep mid fight (and still winning the parses). Was easy and boring.

Rogues get BiS weapons for 1 DKP every expac. Unfair.