New TLP & Rogues

Playing a rogue on a TLP is like playing "solo self found" in an MMORPG. Very painful, rewardless, and boring.

Having said that, I do know a couple of people who do like the playstyle and the "Rogue" thing and play it as mains. Most others I know who mained rogues (and got epics in era in Kunark) have moved on to other classes.

A couple switched to shaman after grouping with me continuously.

Shaman is one overpowered class in TLPs (like SKs and the uber-broken-monks)

The worst part of it is you get all the gear but then have to play a rogue.

Are you new to the game? Rogues definitely have to work harder to compete, but we own Kunark/Velious except on isolated single fights. How do you get smoked when rogues have have continual 5 minute cooldown discs; vs 22-20 on monks. Monks win 1 dragon, then they have to wait 2 fights to even compete. I don't think you've ever met a competitive rogue that knows its rotations.. its really not that hard. Rogues are the kings of super long fights or multiple fights back to back ex. ToV and VP. If you're talking about 1 isolated fight like Trakanon of course they are going to lose and even then, if its a super fast fight and it burns , rogues will be ahead. I'll be happy to smoke you in classic /kiss

Any monk you were competing against in classic that you were "smoking" in dps was clearly so AFK they didn't even turn auto attack on.

Who do I believe?

Saying something like this just tells everyone you have no idea what you're talking about

I've had a lot of fun with Rogue's on TLP when I am in a guild that actually groups together and I can get a group... outside of group it is miserable... the big turnoff was MoTM gimping my backstabs and stuff so it turned me off and I quit playing Rogue specifically.

EQ rogue is just a badly designed class and the issues with EQ affect it the class more than any other. Those who say otherwise are in complete denial.

EQ rogue is like a class they put in for the D&D types in a half-hearted manner, and then just forgot about them for years heh. Sad, but kinda makes sense if you think about it.

Remember the furor on the forums on common loot pool for pickpocket in 99/2000 (it still is, FYI)?

I just love how playing a rogue ends up with you being ultra sensitive to mob push and mob positioning and how through no fault of your own, you can lose a lot of damage due to the actions of other players.

Sneak Attack as a passive perhaps?

Maybe move the rogue mez-trap thing earlier and even some sort of fade with hide so that they can become more of a pulling class? Makes sense RP-wise to me. Sneak, hide, confuse, get the mob to camp?

If the basis you decide whether a class needs buffs is whether they are the #1 dps, wouldnt that just lead to an endless cycle of never-ending class buff roulette where classes are consistently cycled from good to better?

Rogues are always viable (except classic), ive played on nearly every TLP and have never once seen someone ask a rogue main to leave the raid. Its ok to be 2nd quartile on damage.

Incorrect, I played both classes. Rangers easily get out DPS'd by rogues in Kunark/Velious. Rangers can WS to save a raid or engage a mob.. They can buff, nice utility.

However, they don't out DPS rogues who on most major bosses in Velious, if being properly split by your guild will get to use multiple discs. Rangers might win the occasional minor boss if they are FM and everything lands without any resists. Heck, rangers have to spend half their attack time casting jolt or they pull aggro and die. Rogues are the superior DPS class in Velious and Kunark.

Thanks for attending my Ted talk.

That reason was already removed when they changed it last tlp cycle so that it puts a message in chat when you pickpocket. Now you know they aren't pickpocketing.

Corpse recovery was the huge rogue perk in classic, this is proven out on servers. When THAT was removed rogues needed something else but weren't given it. It's glaringly obvious and should be the main point of any rogue improvement thread. You have to play in that era to fully understand the little feeling of security you feel when your group has a rogue in it. It's a huge help to recover from group destroying wipes that would otherwise be the end of the group. Removing corpse runs gutted the class of it's main appeal so it needs something that replaces that. Doesn't even need to be some combat boost but something that makes the group want a rogue, I'm sure there are a million possibilities, If you don't want to boost rogue combat how about just 10% coin drop increase when there's a rogue in the group as just one of many possibilities.

What if the basis is the fact that rogues get out dps'd by pets in classic? Not pet classes, PETS.

TBH, I see that as more of a problem with pets themselves. Classic would be insanely balanced if pets, including charmed pets, and fist damage ratio was nerfed.

We wouldn't even need to actually nerf pet damage directly. Give every mob a buff that reduces pet damage by like 50%. Then change fist ratio to where monks need to equip weapons in classic. Boom, done

Almost every class gets out dps'd by pets. This isnt Unique

Sorry, you need clarification. I'm talking about Necro or Mage pets. Not charms, I thought that would have been obvious.