Let's talk Catchup Mechanics

So, for reference I play on Mischief.

I have noticed lately a trend. People are getting tired of playing their main characters. Some have been playing them for years, others have been playing for shorter, but as Mischief plugs along these expansions people want to change it up.

The problem that most are facing at this point is that starting a new main TSS+ becomes, well for lack of a better word, a slog.

Leveling is not really the problem. You can level super fast (at least ill 80. 80-85 is annoying) but the real problem is the massive amount of AA's that a new character would need. This forces any new players or people who want to main change into committing to one of three things.

1) Spend literally hundreds of hours exping to get enough AA's (Or waiting for an EXP bonus. Super cool, I wanna play EQ but to not spend hundreds of hours exping I need to wait months to start my character. Let's also be honest here, finding a group can be tough and moloing is even slower, forcing people to box, which is also slow for most.).

2) Spend a fair handful of Krono to get powerleveled.

3) Buy characters (Clearly not supported by Daybreak, but its there and i've heard a lot more talk of this lately.)

What I am finding in my guild that instead of doing those 3 things...people just quit. They are bored with their current class either cause they have played it a long time, or it goes through a "bad" phase, or any combination of things. But when they look at the uphill battle to get a new character raid ready...they just quit playing. This should never be an option in a game that the game has become so daunting that people would rather quit than keep playing.

So, what about catchup mechanics? There is a lot of nuance to when it could happen (I'd say TSS+), but I do think something could and should be done.

Whatever happened to the extra AA if you are under 4k? I get why it was removed, but at some point that should return. Want to make it super useful but more complicated to code? How about AA thresholds per expansion. For instance, in SoD let's arbitrarily say that 2k AA is what we consider "good". If your under 2k you get 100% bonus AA. If you are under 1k you get 200% bonus AA (completely arbitrary numbers).

Same could be done for levels (though I don't think its necessary).

Mischief fixed the gearing catchup with double loot and tradeable loot, coming back to Mischief is better than ANY other server before it (Though Oak will be better ultimately).

But what I find unacceptable as a guild leader is my members telling me they are bored with their class but the prospect of hundreds of hours or RL money to AA a new one makes them just want to quit.

Anyway, just a thought that I think would especially help TLPs that get long in the tooth as they say.

I prefer fresh made with some smoke flavoring. Use actual crushed tomatoes, white vinegar and smoked paprika. Rest can be standard

If you ask me nicely, ill come back.

Call me crazy but I never liked store bought pesto.

As a guild leader, you see the problem, figure out a solution. Offer to PL those new toons for the guild. Pull in some resources from your guild and help retain your members. To me, if that is the reason they want to quit, they have been wanting to quit for awhile but never found a good reason to. With the help of others the leveling and AAing is alot faster and easier. And as part of the guild management, it does fall into your hands to keep your members happy and keep them playing. I myself have main changed on TLPs and not once did I want to quit because of it. I accepted the issues ahead of time. The problem I always had with rerolling a new main is the lack of help from others in the guild. In fact pushed to the side on alot of quest items I would need because I wasn't 'maxed out' at the time. DPG can't do anything about that since it's a player driven choice. You want to keep your members figure out a way to make them happy. I am sure you have other members in your guild that would be more than happy to help out fellow guild mates. Just take the first step and help out, the rest will follow. Just like in real life. Sometimes people stumble and need a hand to help them out. If they were a friend you would try to help them out til they got on their feet again. It's not the toon you want to save it's the player behind it you want to keep.

Yeah, just donate hours and hours of your time to grind other people's toons because the devs don't want to fix the issue.

It would be nice if they offered a heroic options at different level ranges for TLP's. Currently you have to wait CotF for the level 85 Heroic. Characters do require spending real money.

Heroic characters should be coded so they take you from zero to hero. What ever the current expansion max level is -5. You still have some work to really max out, but at least you're in striking range.

Better for daybreak too. Rather than paying krono to PL'er, just buy the PL directly from DB.

These are good ideas. They should also increase the autogrant to the current expansion -2 or so, so it is a bit more useful. Adding rested experience could also keep people logging in. The fellowship/campfire system sort of does this, but it is very confusing and requires some extra work.

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/what-the-heck-is-side-kicking.293601/

Yet utterly nerfhammer per kill xp.


Just dumb decisions.

Don't forget gear and spells. It's not much help being level 105 when you have level 70 spells, defiant gear and an inventory full of 115/120 gear you can't use yet, and being told to "Go get levels" from what.... grey mobs that kill you?

Honestly, we could do with removal of required levels on gear entirely.

Play on Vaniki then of you don't want gear levels. Also, you're doing something wrong if gray con mobs kill you, regardless of gear.

you dont need to farm 1000s of aas in order to do your job in a raid or group. first there is auto grand ( hello catch up mechanic ) and after you're at the max level, there are only a few aa lines that are crucial to your class to be able to function at an acceptable level. so you get those done first and you are good to go.
same goes for gear btw, you really do not need so called bis items in every slot in order to win raids.

Agreed. People forget about how long it takes to make a new character. I had a couple toons power leveled up to 85 during the extra life bonus. I wasn't really playing the entire time, just watching youtube while they did their thing. Usual stuff. So I then needed to get their spells and work on their spell skills. We've all done it, spamming level 1 spells constantly, but man it is the most boring thing ever. At least defensive skills (and offensive maybe...I could be wrong, I've mostly only ever played casters) seem to have some form of accelerated skillup chance, but casting skills definitely do not.
And then there's the AA, augs, progression, etc.

I don't think he is in a guild of 1. There are other guild mates. Most likely the person is rerolling a class that is needed. Set up groups to help the people level up. Don't have to 'donate' hours if you are just chilling with friendly guildmates grinding xp.

EQ is oddly unkind to new players. What? Extended target is now quality of life?

Not if you're under level 20 though?

"Why are they like this?"

OK, we took down the mercenary barrier to entry, you know, mercenaries that wrre made as a "catch up" enterprise, but then keep them locked behind quests that new players can't do.

Then years upon years later, finally realize this is crapping on the approachability game, but then make the plat cost bankrupt anyone who is a true new player.




Something something "summon stones" in lobby basically saying if you're undergeared we tax you, the lesser player disproportionately. This lasted over a decade. Now finally removed he death tax.

EQ seems to dislike retention of new / returning players and favors raiders and Krono sales.

Nerf APPROACHABLE per kill xp, you know, the stuff undergeared players HAVE to do. 22 years into the game.

Why are they like this?

If you're level 105 and only have level 70 spells and defiant gear, how did you obtain level 115/120 gear? Especially since gray con mobs are killing you. That toon obviously is being leveled up by high level toons and being neglected. TBM has decent gear for a level 105 and you can get your spells quickly doing heroic adventures in that expansion.

Nailed it.

Folks are typically willing to let you come mooch exp off of whatever they are doing, and send gear/spells your way, well before you can use. Charitable yes, but it further deepens that character's dependency on others.

What's needed is a method for players caught in this catch-22 to do it for themselves.

Sorry, I have to agree with HT. I assume you haven't played Eq past the "golden" game of PoP. Up till Probably TSS/SoF it really wasn't too bad to restart a new toon, but once you start hitting those expansions the AA grind becomes very very real.

Our guild powerlevels people all the time. In fact we have a few new players that we plvld to 85 in just 1-2 days. That is super simple to do. What is not so simple is the then 2000 AAs (Thats with autogrant) needed that take 200 hours to farm. No matter how many people you have in your guild. Powerleveling that many AA's takes hundreds of hours. Right now on Mischief most players need around 3k AAs to be "solid" Some classes more (Necro, Knights, Mages, Pet classes) some less (Wizard, Bard, Warrior) but I would say most classes need between 2750 and 3250 depending on class.

That isnt just a simple "Oh powerlevel" them, and if you think it is, then again, I question if you've played Eq past OOW or PoR. And Underfoot makes it even worse, with most classes needing another 1k aas to fill out Underfoot (Planar Power is 35 AA PER RANK in UF....for Planar Power). Getting AAs at 85 is no faster than getting them at 65 (actually I find it much slower, as uber zones like PAW just dont exist now). So now we need triple the AAs and it takes longer to get them.

Also, just because you are willing to put hundreds of hours into a new characters because your tired of your current main, doesn't mean some or dare I say MOST people are. I am not willing to do it, nor are most of my guild. It just isn't fun. Im bored with my Bard, but the prospect of AA'ing out a zerker has completely stopped me from doing it and so I just slog along on my bard not really enjoying it.

Anyway, the point I was making is I wish there was some sort of catchup that was better. Maybe instead of 4 expansions behind on Autogrant, it was only 2. That would help tremendously on catching up.