Is the Challenger's Perk Creating the Experience We Want?

You keep claiming that it is a no xp death but that is not the case you will still lose xp, just not your level.

The fact your can bind rush raid targets with MoTM using this perk is gross and needs to be fixed. It defeats the whole purpose of the game if you just make hundreds of corpses to kill raid targets and in my opinion is exploiting.

Easy fix is make players respawn with no mana.

Better yet, make them respawn silenced...can't cast, can't melee. Even a 2 min silence debuff upon respawn would take care of it.

Sorry, but the people abusing this perk to bind rush raid targets and solo/box them by dying 50+ times should be banned. I don't know where this culture of "if you can do it, it's ok" in EQ came from but this is textbook exploiting and in most games, bannable behavior.

Instead of trying to target the perk why not look at the FTE mechanic that makes it possible? This can't be done on any other server and on this server you already have many more chances at those targets.

That is just stupid, with full exp in a level you can die around 20 times before you lose it. IF (and that is a big IF) they put any restrictions on it it should be a minimum of 20 or equal to the number of deaths it would take to die in that level.

Anyone who dies 20 times in a row without earning experience probably should find a simpler game to play -- tic-tac-toe, perhaps?

Actually it was more around the 400 death mark, from level 75 down to level 55, all exp was gained back after completing the level 55 kill cragbeast queen on Vaniki. All exp was gained back by using the exp recovery AA.This will continue to happen on Vaniki until Daybreak give the players away to delevel for achievements. Shrouds are hit and miss if they work for achievements, some do and some don't.

But you missed the point totally, even without the Perk AA anyone can die 20 times and not lose a level.

What I find interesting, is this got to 12 pages of argueing a perk that, at the end of the day is not even a big deal even if it can be abused creatively.

Yet there are bot groups in the hole Power Leveling people for Krono, warping around the entire zone pulling everything as there bot group stuns, and aoe's them down all day. IMO this it just a bit higher on my list of problems with what TLPs and lack of being policed. Then someone spending $3 to not lose a level.

Ooof. This thread has stayed open much longer than I bet on.
Need to check the original odds, but I'm pretty sure I owe Rijacki and Servers_are_Down several krono.

That's not what I said at all...are you serious?

The problem isn't attempting to fight a mob that you know you cannot beat. The problem is the perk now allows you to leverage strategy outside of design intent, exploit, and beat the encounter. Throwing bodies endlessly isn't a valid strategy and causes a total zone disruption for people due to lag and potential for zone crashing.

And your point?

No, it's an issue with the perk because if it didn't exist, the strategy wouldn't be effective. After a certain number of deaths, the mob would not be killable by those people. Being able to retain your level for infinity is the problem. FTE, yet again, exacerbates it. I don't think you understand that you literally need the perk for this to be possible. That's why it's a problem. You don't need FTE to make this possible, but FTE helps make the problem even worse.

Again, wrong.

A dumb one. Maybe we can agree with that?

Maybe...read?

Not always.

You do realize the programs act like a man in the middle. If they don't have the decryption keys they aren't going to work. That's how SSL works, you realize that, yes?

No, you're trying to throw random whataboutisms into the argument rather than understand the root cause of the issue. Don't try to tell me what to do when you simply lack the knowledge to understand the nuance of the issue.

CdeezNotes has made an eloquent point by point summation of the whole problem. The problem isn't with FTE, it's with the perk. Friends that I did launch with on Oakwynd talked about how this perk was already abused on other servers and will truly allow unintended and degenerate play patterns in classic on a fresh server, and they were correct.

I am being convinced throughout this thread that Waring is intentionally misunderstanding or misrepresenting the issue to an end that I cannot comprehend.

This is basically every thread he or she enters, which happens to be like 90% of the threads that get posted on the forum as a whole.

And all of this sounds like a problem with FTE as none of it would be possible without FTE and you are talking about mobs that become trivial quickly.

Except for the fact that the problem is only happening because of FTE otherwise anyone else in the zone that wanted the mob would be able to kill it.

Holy smokes. Quadrupling down on being wrong.

On any other server the mob would be killed by other raid forces, the only issue here is that the encounter locking prevents that. If the claim is that someone is able to bind rush a raid mob while no one else is attempting it does it really matter? The only reason it would matter is if them bind rushing prevents others from attempting it which is only possible because of FTE.

So the threshold for if an exploit is acceptable in your eyes is if the target isn't currently being contested? Sad!

Bind rushing isn't an exploit and it has been happing since the start of the game.

And....full circle.

Dropping out as you can't discuss anything with someone who is intentionally obtuse or just plain dense and doesn't realise it (sad if so).