Aside from the fact that's all we can go on as players, tell me how you came up with the "now that the standard has been set to high from Mischief and Thornblade?" Where is YOUR data to back up the above? Your feelings? Lol, at least I have a basis to counter argue. You have NOTHING but your feelings. LMAO, easy there buddy as the hay is starting to seep out of your pants. On a serious note, the progress site guild listings are validated. So it can be used as a tool for gauging or at the very least help make an educated assumption on popularity.
What is your argument that they haven't? That is what I am curious about. Even if you do not like the rule set, they still have set a new standard in what they can do with TLPs as they have altered something core about the gameplay vs literally the same rule set minus xp modifications or cadence changes. The rule set aside- a new standard has been set. EQ has proven that they CAN change things and modify how the game plays with these TLPs. You have no argument to counter except "Aradune progress has more guilds" Before Mischief what did we get? Cadence difference. XP rate changes Box / No box Dedicated (lulllllll) GM Oh and start at level 85 lul With mischief they set a new bar with: Free trade Random rare loot Free trade we knew they could do because of FV - but randomizing loot is a new bar they set. They showed that they can modify the actual game play of the server and do something new / different they haven't done before that isn't the standard crap. Again, you just don't like the server - FINE - no one is saying its for everyone. That doesn't mean its not a big update to the normal TLPs.
I disagree with this sentiment as well. In my opinion, the FV-style trading combined with random rare looting only succeeds in making playing the game less meaningful. Since you both can't "target" most loot nor do you even really need to (since everything tradeable), the game is devolved into a plat-farming bonanza where you just buy what you want. Random loot is a fine gimmick, but it replaces the satisfaction of getting the loot you were actually looking for on a particular mob. I think it would be better served in addition to the standard mob loot table instead of replacing it. That being said - I hope the next TLP incorporates a less-impactful random loot mechanism (i.e. Frenzy will still drop FBSS at the same rate, but might also drop some rando loot) and do precisely the opposite of FV-style trading. Making most high-value loot NO DROP / NO DESTROY and bound to be looted by ONLY the group/raid that got the kill would make for a more interesting game.
Firstly, stop insisting that I hate the ruleset. That's your assumption and you're only grasping at it because your argument is weak and you're losing. And, secondly - Population versus guilds has always been used as a clear measure of popularity. It basically determines server life. You can see this throughout the TLP life cycle. Again, as players we have no other metric to use. As for 'random loot'? It's an experimental feature to TLPs. It is not a vertical feature, but rather horizontal. When named spawn points are no longer static the server will probably take a huge population hit.
This is obviously just my opinion, but I've played on every TLP since Fippy and I dont know that I will be able to go back to a traditional style loot server. I think id need at least FV style loot to get my interest, if not both aspects. the randomization really helps the group content alot. The mischief/thornblade style loot has actually made kunark tolerable, something I never thought id say. its that good. I play on Thornblade, and while it definitely isnt Mangler level of population, it feels pretty comparable to Coirnav. I'd also wager if you take the pops of mischief and thornblade since they are carbon copies, it pretty easily outdoes mangler.
Do you understand how flawed your logic is when you are comparing the count of guilds that cleared an expansion with a server that unlocked Kunark in 1 month versus 3 months? Or that it relies on guilds caring enough to report their progress? A data scientist you are not.
I wasn't going to indulge you, but please tell me where your logic stands? You obviously agree with Wade, so where are your metrics or evidence to suggest that Mischief is the new norm? Please provide it? Can any of you (specifically: Naiderye, Angryking, or Wade) provide even a shred of evidence that isn't based on feelings or are you just going to keep going around in a weak fallacy circle? I'll wait, I have all day.
If you are going to debunk the OP's claim please use facts, not anecdotes. It's on you to do that not the other way around.
The OP debunked his own claim, by not providing evidence. He did the work for me. (I'm still waiting by the way.) Also, what's with all these throw-away-accounts springing up lol?
By all means quote where I said I had any metrics. I specifically stated my view is purely anecdotal and any method of projection is highly prone to error. You can't even refute the holes that have been poked in your "metrics". You or anyone else that claims to know without a Dev tag is talking out of their rear end.
Clearly, the same percentage also believes I hate Mischief or never played on the server. /boggle Which is kind of funny now that I'm thinking about it. Why would anyone need to actually play on Mischief to understand it? You don't need to be a "data scientist" to really understand what playing on Mischief entails lol. Though some of these throw-a-aways clearly believe this is revolutionary stuff.
Let me clearly spell this out - What I want for you or someone from your little band of throw-a-aways is to produce a metric that makes Mischief the new standard. Not give me an 'eye test' or 'feelings test' to prove your point and say that you debunked me - that's not how an argument works. Stop running around in circles.
Oh man, take a breather. You've posted like 10 times in the past 30 minutes, whooooshhhaaa. Here is why the bar has been set to a new level. 1) Mischief and Thornblade are the most populated TLPs currently around. If you don't agree, check the server status page periodically. They likely outpace every other server by themselves, however if you combine their populations it would be a tremendous blowout. 2) About 75% of people that I've grouped with or talked to in game for any length of time have made unsolicited commentary about how this server's ruleset is a game changer and that they can't see themselves going back to a normal ruleset now. 3) I've played on each of the past TLP servers after ragefire. The quality and generousity of the player base has never been matched to what is experienced on Mischief. 4) 'Joinability' - For people wanting to join in later stages of an expansion or many expansions down the road, they can easily equip their character with best available group gear and spells for a single krono. If they want raid level gear, they can join a raiding guild or buy those items for significantly more. In other words, the ramp up time is significantly shorter because of the low cost of groupable gear. 5) Open gameplay. There is no more contention for an AC ring, or having to battle or pay a kronolord for GEB's. This loot drops randomly from rares of the same level base. I can explore a new zone and experience content that I historically never have without sacrificing the ability to equip my character. This even applies to raids. Instead of bottlenecking a single item from a single raid boss for 25 people in a weekly rotation, that content can drop off of any raid mob. You don't have to skip crappy raid targets because their loot if no longer terrible. 6) The amount of loot. Loot drops at 4+ times the rate as prior servers. Loot is flowing and it gives all players the ability to gear out, help friends, and afford things they need. Items are worth less on an individual basis but the process of gearing and getting items is significantly more enjoyable. 7) Random Loot - It's just fun. You might get all loot that you don't care about, but the potential to get something rare from a named and not knowing what it might drop is simply fun. Remember the little bits of mystery that made EQ fun? It's great to not know 100% of what will drop and the approx drop rate for each item every time I'm engaging a mob. It's much less mechanical. There are probably 20 more things but I've ran out of interest.
I think you are missing the key point of the random loot which is you don't have to compete with many other groups at a single camp for a drop you want. As for your idea of making the loot no drop/no destroy all that will change is the people perma camping it will just sell spots in the group/raid for loot rights. They can still keep killing it and letting it rot in order to force people to join the group and loot it. Personally I like the idea of loot not being at a single camp so that it can't be dominated by a single or couple of groups.
I do appreciate the long post, I have a question for you. This 75%, Can you give me a rough estimate of the amount of people that you've grouped with? Like a hard number?
If that's your only response, I assume your defeat on this topic is self-evident. Thank you for playing.
I'll make this a little easier for you. (Let me take on the form of Wade Watts and make a wild assumption)! Assuming that you've probably only grouped with 5 people - if I round to bodies, only 3 of them share your view? See where I'm going with that? You have used "75%" as a bolster to your bad argument. (And, there's a lot more that I can easily pick a part.)
You have a serious reading comprehension problem. YOU made the claim that Mischief's population was laughable in comparison to Mangler rulesets. When pressed for you to back up that claim your response was the progression site. I've provided you reasons as to why that's not a valid and you have yet to refute those points. Instead you just pivot to other nonsense. Idk what the "gold standard" is or do I care. To add to the topic of how the ruleset is actually benefiting the server...there has been much, much more OW competition than Ive seen betore. On normal servers the top guild will prioritize the high end mobs and not let other guilds touch then. When VS, Faydedar, Sev, and Tal are all snipeable, it provides opportunities for other guilds to get extra loots they would normally have no shot with. I look forward to how the next expansions play out when the potential target count increases substantially.
Unless you mean to lump them both together, Thornblade is consistently lower population than Rizlona. Since both Rizlona and Mischief are always high, it's impossible to know which has the bigger population from the server status page alone.
