Beastlord Hate decrease ability needed for competitive play

DBG here is a simple solution.

Potion of Beastlord Aggro Reduction
Beastlord Only
10pp Per Bottle
For the next (x) seconds melee, spell, and pet damage done will cause enemies to ignore you (your generated hate/threat will not change.)

Needs a downside, so pick one,
1) during this time melee, spell, and pet damage is reduced by a percentage.
2) damage taken during this time is increased
3) run speed is reduced during this time

It's funny to see people tell us how to play a class and prove that they are not quite as informed as they would like you to believe about the class in the process...

Spell Icon Spirit of Vermin Strike Share

Description
1: Decrease Hitpoints by 102
2: Increase Hate by 50

Notice the increase hate mod. Pointless to use this under the current situation. Might as well not use a proc at all. Use the ones that have agro reducing built-in, or no proc but use pet weapons. (Or proc & no weapons).

However, even in era, if you played to the classes full potential you would pull agro anyway (I did it all the time ). Find what works best for you and don't worry so much. I wanted agro reducing abilities in PoP on live. Just remember. No one thinks of a BST being on the parse anyway, so if you need to back off to survive, then do so.

So many people hating on a simple request to make it so that DBG's MoTM change to punish pet-walling bad actors doesn't negatively impact people who just want to play their class as intended. I have a question for all of you giving GK and the other beastlords/mages in the thread grief over complaining about the recent changes to the TLP game that crippled their ability to play in a normal way. The question is this. Why the hell do you even care? If tomorrow DBG came out and said, "Yeah, that was an unintended side effect of the changes we made to MoTM", and made a few tweaks that would either adjust their hate or advance them a later ability that allows them to better manage it, how would that possibly impact your ability to enjoy the game and contribute in group.raid situations? Get over yourselves. Arguing with people just to puff up your own ego over your "skill" at playing an always-somewhat-broken 17 year-old game is just sad and pathetic.

Oh course use the other arm until the broken one heals. Trying to use a broken arm is dumb. That's a silly analogy, but let's be honest you're probably using that swarm pretty weapon.

To the other beastlords point that vermin had a +50 hate mod, stun generates ~400 hate so yeah vermin is a better choice.

Not sure why Goodkitty and yourself are getting so hung up on the +/-50 modifier. Last I heard, barring scaling based on mob hp, stuns were generally considered to be what, 500 aggro per proc? Or 10 times as much aggro as that modifier you guys are obsessed with.

That'd make Spirit of Snow roughly 132 (dd @ 1:1) + 500 - 50 as opposed to 102 +50. That's 152 aggro for Vermin vs 582 for Snow. 26% of the aggro for 77% of the damage. Given the proc rate of NPCs & the innate 150mod on the spells, that's a massive decrease in aggro per minute.

Not that I'm really advocating bothering with either on a raid.

Zanarnar's hate override suggestion is a solid one and would require very little work.

Whimper of thunder actually sounds like a great idea for an ability. It's shame it won't happen!

Thanks for the assist Random newb. I often use Rellic on raids, but if I start having problems with my pet going splat, I swap to Vermin. In my book, Vermin is the go-to conservative Pet Proc spell because it has the highest damage without the stun. Anything with a stun component, even if it's on a stun immune mob, is going to cause tons of agro.

In Time P4+, On TT, Bert, Cazic, RZ, and Quarm, I conserve a large portion of my mana for slows, heals, and cures rather than using mana completely for nukes and dots. Don't get me wrong, I still cast Malaria, Scorp Venom, and both fast nukes every time they pop/drop on fights where I am strictly playing DPS, but I generally do not begin fully cranking out the DPS until 80% or so because I know I will turn the target and get stomped. It was my understanding that most DPS were supposed to follow suit on that.

I choose to focus on the support options when playing my beastlord, and feel that this helps the raids I am on far more than smacking things with my terrible weapons. I don't play the class like a shaman, but I definitely don't pretend that I'm a monk with dots and nukes either.

wat.

The point is if something is broken, why not get some help with the broken thing rather than just expecting it to heal correctly by itself like a moron?

I'm perfectly capable of just "takin' er easy" on the mob and not doing anything but I'd actually like to, ya know, do stuff while fighting. I don't want to have to dismiss or remove buffs from my pet because MoTM / DOT aggro is broken.

80% is probably a good 40-50 seconds into a fight. That's a very long time for your whole raid to wait to start throwing down DPS.

Here's a question for all you newly discovered beastlord experts:

While I and probably others appreciate your efforts to ease the pain, is it an acceptable long term solution to load spells that are 3 expansions old so that we don't die?

Yes, we can use old pet spells, dots, and nukes.
Yes, we can wait a full 20-30 seconds after the rest of our raid starts DPSing to lay down some pretty piss poor damage, comparatively speaking.
Yes, we can just turn AA on and/or literally just walk away from our keyboards and the mob will still die

But, we shouldn't have to.

That's not fun and I literally do not care how awesome you are at minimizing your aggro using these techniques. Please exit the thread if these are your suggestions because they're band-aids to mask an actual problem with the game.

100% down for whimper of thunder!

Dot agro isn't broken, your dots just do much more damage then before.

Just give this guy what he wants, FFS. Add Feign Death, Fade and Hide(evade) to a Beastlord's utility bar. Cater to every request people want. Who cares? Combine all classes since we're obviously tired of having individual roles requiring different playstyles.

I melee when assist is called. But I don't start putting every single damage spell I have out there until about 80%.

Ugh, this sentence pains me to no end and it's the reason most in this thread won't give you a serious answer!

There's no such thing as a 'melee dps class!' Think about it, " We are the only melee damage per second class,' doesn't really make much sense does it?! Where did that come from anyway? World of Warcraft?

Seriously, the Beastlord class is designed to output melee, spell, and pet damage. You also have utility spells at your disposal. Your role in a group/raid setting is utility and damage - utility first though. If you want to focus on purely chart-topping melee damage then you probably should have went with a Monk or Rogue. You'll be able to re-roll a lunatic (Zerker) in a few months.

As a Chanter you don't see me trying to keep up with Wizards in damage per second or damage done parses on their turf! Hell, my little 60 Druid can out damage my 65 Chanter in a nuke fest.

It's probably because they can duel-wield and kick.

He doesn't expect to be competative DPS. He does expect to be able to play to at least 80% of his classes ability without dying because of excesive aggro generation. He doesn't want to top the parse, he does want to maximize his classes potential. When he mob is slowed, because he has competent slowers and the players are healed because he has competent healers he wants to be able to output damage, rather than turning on auto attack and just watching the screen.

Or are you guys really saying that beastlords should just sit in the back and pretend to be a shaman?

Have you read the title of the thread? It has the word competitive in it.

To the using spells three expansions old, well beastlords were launched in luclin and we're now in LoY... I agree, you shouldn't be using any luclin spells at all. Beastlords should only melee until 61 so they can use spells that are one expansion old. Of course come LDoN you'll be without spells again, but got to stay current right?

?

How about you just pick random things you can fail to scrutinize and miss the entire point of the thread? Congratulations on 24 hours of not getting it but still posting. You are really killing it with the dismantling of our logic, man. Keep it up. We're in shambles.

Anyway, Kahna mostly nailed it. We would like to be able to DPS a raid mob without a mechanic working against the whole time. A mechanic that actually serves no purpose in this era and can go away without hurting anyone. Clearly some people really hate the idea of a class (or two) that are in a bad spot catching a break and making gameplay a little more enjoyable. Better shut that down, pronto!

Thankfully, no one has listed any compelling reason that we can't get some help other than "don't let the whiners get their way" so I think we might have a shot.

That's a fair enough point. I wasn't advocating being a shaman-lite in my earlier post either, I was just saying that we have way too many abilities that would go unused if we strictly focused on nukes and dots with all of our mana. Sometimes that utility is just too great not to use.

To his credit, I saw Goodkitty last night in PoK with Mace of the Ancients and Hammer of the Timeweaver and I was impressed with the choice of weapons. That is an excellent pair for a beast. I haven't had a chance to do parsing, as I've not gotten raid weapons yet, but a few very high end beastlords used that combo in the day. Granted, the Mace is waaaay easier to get in this day and age when the Essences drop every kill, and people can actually convince their guild to farm Rathe.

An agro decrease ability would be fantastic, but I'm pretty sure that just isn't going to happen. Hell, they removed knight deflection to try to keep spells and discs "in era". Daybreak is pretty inconsistent, but do you think they'd create a brand new ability, or lower Roar of thunder down to 65 after doing that? Best we can do until Omens is to be conservative with our DPS on burn fights for the first 10-20% to avoid getting roflstomped. I generally don't cast anything but my 2 nukes until I feel the fight is stabilized. Every time I've done that, I've still parsed at a level I considered to be pretty decent.

You want to damage per second a raid mob? How does one do that?!

Roar of thunder would be the best solution although its just a patch for the problem until the mitigation buffs are gone. It fits perfect with its 15min cooldown and the time between mobs.

As far as other comments above I know BST dps will never be top for many reasons that I do have to break off and support the raid by slowing adds or even casting a heal on pet or even readjust the pet to be more effective. I don't know why people are so against a beastlord filling in the spots of what needs to be done.

Haters are going to hate.

Just remove the pet debuff off of mark of the old ways and be done with it.