The question of bsts using their new and improved DoT's is easily answered. On a non important raid/pick up raid etc....parse the bsts DoT vs the Necro DoT (assuming that the bsts and necro have equal playing skillz) and see which one does more dps (lol, IKR---I honestly am trying not to die laughing as I type this). If it's honestly a DoT vs nuke issue and you're trying to find out what the biggest bang for the buck is, run a parse with the arena dummy (and not just a 10 minute one either) and see what you get. You'll get a good idea whether or not it makes sense to use em, if not....oh well, some dev at least tried to make the bsts DoT viable.
I assume that our dots have to be better than the lowest 3 of the dots that necros use, and I assume that they should have a place there. ATM it's more of a psychology thing to me. I don't want to lower their desire to play. Maybe I should actually look to see what ticks the lowest. If the lowest necro dots are beating these things I'd be a bit dumbfounded.
That's actually pretty suspect, for pre-buff dots, once crit rate & associated multiplier are factored in.
assuming both have the same adps: Necros love to claim it. But there has never EVER been a parse showing it. If it was true, wouldn't there have been one by now?
What ADPS do you want, man? Anecdotes aside (anecdotes wouldn't support the case, anyhow, but~), just numbers. Pre-TBM numbers, even, since the resource I use wasn't updated with TBM things. TBM things have further slanted this lil' juxtaposition, but whatever. Bst DoT crit at a rate of ~30%, for double damage. With Auspice of the Hunter +33% and BardEpic+FierceEye +24% together, a crit rate of 87% is achieved! High level necromancers have a base crit rate of 82% for their dots. That goes to 100% with just bard epic+FierceEye (just over half uptime, 1:42 with 3 min cooldown), or with Auspice, or with their CoA robe click. They match the 30s disced-up Bst crit rate with just Circle of Power IV going. Their passive dot crit multiplier is +352% from AA on top of the +100% normal crit, so instead of 2x damage, their dot crits are for 5.5x. Not even going to get into the Enc & Dru that Nec get grouped with on raids, or the necro's own discs. The 20th highest damage dot for nec is "down" around 2.2k base/tick. Now, the new 10/11/whatever-k base damage of the new dots may get there, but it's still not guaranteed, and only bst ones have gotten this treatment so far. Other classes aren't even in the same ballpark
I'm not saying I don't believe you Brohg. But as everyone knows, you cannot trust "eyeballing" data. What bugs me is that this is a widely held claim that never is backed up with data.
He roughly gave you the details already so it really isn't eyeballing. The best current bst dot at 12,731 is much better than a necros old 20th dot in non burn settings and just barely better in a burn setting. Assuming the bst has a bard in group for his burn. This is one of the concerns that necros have in regards to their dot tuning when it occurs. We might start getting dots that are inferior in base damage to other classes because we have more modifiers for them. Meaning it suddenly would take us 2 or 3 or whatever casts to equate what some other classes get from a single dot just because we have more and bigger tools for dots on the back end. Despite the same not holding true for nukes. Wizards not only have the highest base damage nukes but they also have the most and biggest modifiers for nukes outside of chromatic haze which works for all nukers.
That wiz/nec juxtaposition is a thorny one, ShadowMan Wiz base crit rate is the lowest there is, and the crit multiplier isn't quite as night/day as the necro/notnecro situation. I feel you, though. Retroactively nerfing 12 years of DoT boosting AA by making the DoTs suck in that fashion would be hella mean. I'm hopeful that the developers wouldn't have embarked on this evolution without a plan in place for the clear lynchpin.
Kirchen's Chill is still viable to use as you can cast while moving in or out without fizzling. As all nukes require you to be standing still to cast.
lol, to each his own. But I think you probably enjoy the versatility too or you'd have been playing a wizard. When I said versatility in this case though, what I meant was dots vs just stronger nukes. I think they balanced this out very well. I always liked the idea of "active dps" vs "passive dps". you have to do more thinking to use the dots well, and if you do then you get more dps out of them, and if you don't then you fail. It's a great example of a person behind the screen showing thought and skill in how they play their class mattering. The more of that, the better.
I kind of like these new DoTs because of their versatility, but at the same time their situational dps, and now a part of our class dps has become for situational use only. (For low dps group/solo/raid if low on necros) A boost to nuke spells would've been more beneficial to the bst class, but at the same time, these DoTs do open up some Dps choices and require some thought of how to make best use for them instead of just mashing the same nuke rotation and ignoring DoT spells altogether like most did before (cuz they were not worth using). I hope they do more changes like this to other classes too, to make it more interesting. Resource management and choice has been replaced too much with copy pasted abilities and mashing the same key rotation. Dichotomic Fury spell is another succesful spell like that imo. Maybe it creates more work for bsts to max out on Dps, but it becomes more interesting to play too and involves more skill.
Having a situational dps spells aren't a bad thing, look at Mages and the storm spell, it's our best, but it's situational, I'd ask to see some parses of before and after, however that might not be the greatest thing to post on these forums . Glad beasties got a bit of a boost though! Always nice to see boosts rather then nerfs!
A little late to this party, but I like the concept of the expensive but powerful dots for Bst. We have mana flow out the wazoo as well as gift of mana. I wouldn't consider it a dot only dps strat going forward. It's more of throwing dots in when the situation is reasonable. That includes using the instant cast to tag a mob while split pulling. I will use the poison only dot for my main set and all 3 for another. It gives us choice and that is good. When you see gift of mana pop up, should you dicho or dot? hmmm
Well, you should dot I think it's pretty obvious you should dot, since Dicho is constantly greyed out if you're not an awful player.
