Selling Veteran Rewards in Marketplace.. hear me out

No, because the plan is no longer about retaining 14 year subscribers for a 15th year. They (we) are hooked, we know what the game is about and we're "in". The f2p player acquisition & retention game support model is wholly different.

There definitely needs to be an alternate way to gain Vet rewards. Either in-game or marketplace. 14 years...That's how long it will take a new player to get Blessing of the Devoted. If you really think EQ is going to be around in 2029 you are poorly mistaken. There is no reason to tell a new player "You can't have this because you have to play for 14 more years!". There is nothing EZ mode as someone previously said to being able to buy or quest for the vet rewards. It's logical.

What's the difference between someone who purchased and played EQ 14 years ago (and stopped playing) and an actual new player? Neither of them "Earned" it yet the guy who happened to have an account gets them and the n00b gets nothing.

How about making you work for it instead of spend your daddy's money on it. This is a generalization and not directed at OP. I don't mind there being a shorter route than waiting 6 years to get something like Intensity of the Resolute, which is invaluable. Make it rough to get tho, real rough.

I'd be for lowering the time requirements and then increment them for each year.

Example
Current year 1 after 1 month
Year 2 after 3 months
Year 3 after 6 months
Year 4 after 1 year
etc etc

The reward is not the same no matter how many people who have it. I get a 25 years of service gold watch for 25 years of service and you get the same watch for nothing (or $1.00) and the recognition for the person in the first category is reduced.

I buy a res token from the Loyalty Vendor and Fred gets Loyalty Points without exhibiting loyalty the reward is not the same for me. I kill a mob and get a sword/you pick the same sword off the ground and the reward is not the same for me.

Arguing that Gold Subscription accounts should not be able to use or gain Veteran AA's would be a different thread since it's no longer tied to subscription time but to time from creation would be appropriate in a different thread. (Gold Subscribers do not get many things subscribers get. Daybreak chooses to give them 1 bone? They also took away 25).

Perhaps the 25 years of service watch became the Started With Us 25 Years Ago Watch. Someone who started yesterday STILL isn't qualified and should not get the award.

I believe devs thought about this a few years ago and came up with the right answer. Did I get 7th Year then and Johnny OneYear not get it? Yes indeedy. Not faaaaair? Well Wizards doing more damage is not faaaaaaair - how about making Timmy the Warrior happy by giving Warriors the same DPS as Wizards? After all, Wizards would still be doing the same DPS - they wouldn't be losing anything (dumbest argument I ever read and I've been reading them for 15 years).

There are many rewards in this game. Some of them we are qualified to receive and some of them we are not.

They're called Veteran Rewards for a reason; a small thank you commensurate with time invested. Every year a token of appreciation for hanging around and playing.
Why should someone realistically expect to have 14 years of veteran rewards available to them when they sign up on day-one?
It defeats the entire meaning of it all.

Perhaps EQ won't be around in its current form for another 14 years affording someone signing up today the ability to earn all of the rewards but there's nothing flawed about it.

A. I've been a client at this bank for 14 years and each year my interest rate on loans has decreased.
B. I just opened an account today. I want the same rate as A!!

A. I've had this same insurance for 14 years and each year since i started my rate has gone down.
B. i just insured with you guys today. I want the same rate as A!!

A. I started patronizing company C 14 years ago. The first year they sent me one pencil for it. The second year I got two, year three I got three, ...
B. I just started going there but I want my 105 pencils!!

etc.

Veteran rewards in the market place, no. But I wouldn't object to seeing them added to the loyalty vendor. Plus, this whole, number of rewards is the number of years thing and you never get them back is outdated. Open them up to all toons on the account.

^ Those who make less than reasonable arguments should take notes.

There will always be people who argue that the ability to spend time playing a game is spending RL money in another way. Fred has 4 hours to spend and does. Bob doesn't have 4 hours to spend but has $40. Same thing (it isn't).

I argue that the loyalty vendor is the same kind of thing with some major differences. You can buy the rewards in any order being the most significant.

Although not all Veteran AA's are equal in usefulness, I believe its appropriate (although a bit arbitrary) that you don't get the most useful ones early on. Year 1 you get the warm handshake, year 25 your get the Gold Service Watch and that's the way it should be. I'd criticise the Vet AA program for the fact that the quality of the rewards do not increase but are uneven, but it is what it is.

Further, Loyalty Points are capped too low. It should take a year to save up for something like the first Veteran's AA with the second appearing only after you have purchased the first.

Finally many of the Loyalty rewards are consumables. They are meant to be pretty trivial when considering their impact on a daily basis. The ability to buy a res token or two each month is awesome for non-ressing classes (that raid). The ability to CS Res every day for non-ressing classes would be wrong and bad. As a 25th year Vet AA, I'd blink but I wouldn't think it was totally crazy - after all it would be the Gold Watch earned after 25 years - a presentation sword for exemplary service. If a new player could buy it as soon as they accumulated 5000 Loyalty Points it would be nuts.

It's not service, Battleaxe Burlydorf. You're not in the army, you're not a firefighter, or even an oh-so-loyal claims adjuster for State Farm. It's a game.

Further, the Vet AAs aren't shiny watches. Not pins or ribbons. They're functional abilities.

FURTHER, these don't even reward your "loyalty". If they did, they'd attach to player or character, but they don't, they attach to the account, with stupid consequences vis-a-vis twinks/box alts/transfers/et al.

Your reward, if you feel the need to call it one, for playing this decade and a half, is that on top of a decade and a half of entertainment, the account you've been playing on gets these abilities gratis. If some upstart feels like jumping in, then for that person to go out of pocket for a matching bene kinda doesn't concern you.

Speaking of gold watches & presentation swords, how about you just campaign for a fancy ornament instead of jealously guarding a shady longevity reward scheme? You could have a a veteran tricorn hat

Here are the rewards:

• 1st year -- Lesson of the Devoted: The player is surrounded by a beautiful blue/white glow as they gain double experience for half an hour once every 20 hours.

• 2nd year -- Infusion of the Faithful: Usable once every 20 hours, the player enjoys maximum resistances, statistics and a faster run speed for 15 minutes while he glows brightly with power.

• 3rd year -- Chaotic Jester: Usable once every 20 hours, this summons a Bristlebane puppet that persists for 15 minutes or until you zone. Bristlebane will randomly cast various spells that provide benefits or minor penalties. His wry sense of humor is sure to get you noticed at that next gathering!

• 4th year -- Expedient Recovery: Usable just under once per week, all the player’s corpses are summoned to their feet and given 100% experience resurrection if they are still eligible. This reward is very handy to use for those difficult situations where getting a resurrection is inconvenient.

• 5th year -- Steadfast Servant: Summons a faithful servant that casts healing spells upon the player and others nearby. Lasts for half an hour or until you zone and is usable once every 20 hours.

• 6th year -- Staunch Recovery: Usable once just under every 3 days, the player is fully restored with health, mana, and endurance. Great for those emergencies but it does take a few seconds to cast.

• 7th year -- Intensity of the Resolute: Surrounded by a glow of energy this greatly increases the power of the player’s melee abilities, spells and heals for 1 minute. This handy ability is especially useful for tough situations requiring your best and is usable once every 4 hours.

• 8th year -- Throne of Heroes: Usable every 72 minutes, the player is teleported to the Throne of Heroes in the Guild Lobby.

• 9th year -- Armor of Experience: Usable once every 20 hours this grants you several layers of protection from harm for 90 seconds or 10 strikes. This protection lessens as you take more damage. Great for when you know you’re going to take a few hits.

• 10th year -- Summon Resupply Agent: Usable once every 20 hours this summons a helpful mechanical merchant to your side. This is great for stocking up on supplies or selling loot when getting to a merchant is inconvenient. He will stay up for 10 minutes or unless dismissed by the player.

• 11th year -- Summon Clockwork Banker: Usable once every 20 hours, a helpful mechanical banker is the latest initiative from the new Norrathian Banking Consortium.

• 12th year -- Summon Permutation Peddler: Usable once every 20 hours, this summons an augmentation distiller vendor to your side.

• 13th year -- Summon Tribute Master: This summons an tribute master to your side.

• 14th year -- Blessing of the Devoted: Reduces the reuse time of all other Veteran's Rewards by 25 percent.

They do not change regardless of how you get them and regardless of how many people have them.

Your Lesson of the Devoted still gives you double xp for 30 minutes every 20 hours regardless of if Daybreak gives it to everyone.

The same is true of all of these "rewards". You seem to be saying that somehow, because you have an old subscription, you get some kind of reward not listed here that would be tainted if given to everyone. Each of these rewards would still give you the exact same benefits if given to everyone. They don't get weakened or changed.

Your feelings about them might be weakened or changed but the REWARDS remain the same.

Now, on the main subject, Veteran Rewards are a marketing scheme. They always were and always are. "Our loyal customers" is a marketing phrase. Everyone who pays for an All Access account is the same, regardless of how long they have been playing, everyone is paying their money and deserves the same game. Veterans of EQ are not paying more per month. In fact, many are paying less because they took the options in the past for a discounted subscription with a lifetime renewal.

Yes, those of us who have been around for 15 years or more have seen our money and comments help the development of the game to this point. But, Joe Smith who begins his EQ paid account today is helping the game starting now.

A lot of companies actually do the opposite and have special discounts for new customers only. Your cable company will offer new customers a lower price for the first year than you are paying now. Be glad Daybreak doesn't announce that new customers only get half price off the first year's subscription.

I don't think Veteran Rewards should remain a slave to marketing.

I would like to get vet rewards on all my toons, up to the same level on other accounts I have. some folks might say that I should have to wait on each acct until that acct has put in the time, but this was a reward for customer loyalty and I'd argue that they are all my accts and I have been as loyal if not more by paying the company double or more for years. Just to use some examples from in here, if keep insurance with a company and more cars or a home, they give me my valued customer rate on the new policies, I don't start from scratch. If I go to a bank and open more accts and put more money in, I might get more pencils or maybe a toaster. Lots of folks looking to get these vet aa on accts didn't start yesterday but have been paying and playing for years on many accts.

Marketplace is fine because more revenue inside of EQ = bigger budget for EQ = more Devs = better expansions and outside of expansion content.

Yes, some of it goes to new games and that, but it also helps determine how many Devs EQ can hire or not.

My reward is not the same should the criteria for receiving it be diminshed. Veteran AA., not I Pay $19.95 too AA. I would hope ANYONE who plays a character advancement game would understand this.

The game is the same. Some play it more cleverly, better, or longer than others and obtain different outcomes.

Fred however has already made 15 years of contribution and rightfully has obtained levels, gear, and abilities Joe Smith does not have.

New customers can benefit from Heroic Characters in ways a level 105 can't. Hotzones, Defiant Armor, this, that, and the other newer player benefit.

In fact one poster in this thread proudly displays
This is my Recruiter Link. If you're making a new account or just returning, use it to get a free mount, big bag, and starter armors to wear
in his sig. No problem with these kinds of benefits. Problems however with rewarding Veterans.

Besides
Vet AA's stop 14th year. Loyalty Vendors still reward people for running an account vs. not starting one yet. LoTD which you get after ONE YEAR is mimiced by hotzones for low level players, double experience weekends (lots of them), LoN rewards, and SC purchases. There are familiars available to all along with Bankers, Tribute masters, and vendors. Gate pots and Origin. AA res - Loyalty vendor tokens.

Almost everything is available in a different (and a bit less convenient) form.

SOE/Daybreak honored their Veteran account owners and they should have. Veteran account owners should not be dishonored by sharing their longstanding privileges with newer account owners who also receive benefits specifically directed at them.

I appreciate that everyone except for one person has been able to have a civil conversation about things.

The discussion can be difficult because for many in a game like this the idea is to be the best and acheve things others haven't and get rewards and items others don't have,. Some feel that by paying a subscription for 15 years they have earned their veteran rewards and they shouldn't go to anyone else. Just like everyone should earn all their regular aa, all their levels, all their gear etc. Its a valid viewpoint.
Heck when they did the aa autogrant I felt a twinge of entitlement... now people were going to be that much closer to my well earned aa.... So I get this viewpoint.

It's not the only viewpoint though. SOE/Daybreak though heroic toons and autogrant aa would help concentrate the smaller playerbase TOWARDS but not AT the high end game. So I opened the discussion on Veteran AA. I just wonder if allowing an avenue for these might help us retain or draw in some more players. Might help increase some revenue for Daybreak.

It's fine to say no to suggestions like this. Or say no to heroics or autogrant aa. But all I ask is think about whether it will help the game go on a bit longer maybe get a bit more resources. I am not asking people to agree with the suggestion just give it some serious thought.

I've been civil.

While two or three others have agreed with me, a few that lead casual guilds, are casual, box and have new accounts, possibly a single account owner who has exhausted the number of toons he can grant Vet AA's to, etc. predictably want Veteran AA abilities they've not earned by meeting Daybreak's qualifications. I understand wanting them. I wanted them. I looked forward to them and I stuck around and earned them.

. I do note that their focus has been claiming Veteran accounts are not entitled to any special rewards and /cough a large number of suggested schemes by which they should be shared. Despite the fact that the most desirable one for new player is LoTD and new players get something like that 24 hours a day through hotzones and we all get LoTD after one year.

I want therefore gimmie.

I gave it some serious thought. My serious conclusion is that there is no compelling reason to do so (see hot zones/exp pots/double exp weekends, a variety of teleportation means, vendors/bankers available in all PC cities, etc.) and very good reason not to. Special reward shared by all is no longer special. Veteran AA's are for veteran account holders. I think we're entitled to the in-game recognition. We're the one's that started early and stayed through thick and thin.

I think devs gave this serious thought the last time someone suggested handing out Veteran AA's.

Appearing in a sig in this very thread:
This is my Recruiter Link. If you're making a new account or just returning, use it to get a free mount, big bag, and starter armors to wear
Benefits targeted at a specific group of players based on how long they've maintained an account.

Everyone should feel comfortable posting here. But, ideas will rise or fall based on their merit. Disagreement and starting why you disagree is not uncivil. In fact sometimes its a kindness.

I have no need of any veteran rewards. And up front I can say I probably would not be buying any if they were to be sold in the Marketplace. I don't play alts and any I have are ones my nephews created and played. They haven't been logged in for autogrant aa's and many probably have never claimed veteran rewards. Four of my accts are over 13 years old with two being over 15 I think.. The rest aren't much younger maybe all 10 years or older.. Some of the accounts I maintain for my nephews are a fair bit younger though. And look at the veteran aa list... you don't need to have all toons with all veteran reward aa if you box. And yes I lead a casual guild though my main is raid geared from the CotF just from open raids.

The only advantage to me personally is if they restart veteran rewards and continue giving us new ones because it is profitable for Daybreak to do so.
AND
If allowing people to purchase years to increase their Veteran aa helps improve daybreak profitablity AND possibly encourage more people to continue playing EQ.
NOT
Its not about me wanting to buy veteran aa. Believe me or not.

Some players and mostly they are raiders although definitely NOT ALL raiders are so concerned about holding tight to every advantage they have over the EQ general population that they would rather see the game die then surrender even a little bit of that advantage. I understand that for some people having things others don't in the game is a big part of the game for them. Heck I take a bit of pride in knowing I have gotten along farther then others in the game too. I just ask people to balance this against something that MIGHT help keep the game going along with other ideas. I am not asking everyone to agree with me but give it some thought and don't blindly disagree with it.

Even if Daybreak liked the idea it might need a lot of coding to implement.

so in 2004-2009 or so you could sign up for a year long sub, get a vet reward for $0, cancel sub and repeat, these accounts are still being rewarded to this day

in 2015 someone would have to actually pay $119.88 to get a vet reward immediately granted and 12 months of gold access

assuming dbg is interested in revenue this is something they should look into, assuming players are interested in staff to work on the next campaign this is something they should support

if someone creates a new account and spends $1678.32 to immediately get all vet rewards or even only $839.16 to immediately get 7 vet aas that person is doing far more to support the game than some whining on a message board

I like the loyalty vendor idea, especially in a tiered approach that users can't cherry pick the rewards but the time investment also scales down to about the 5 year mark to earn them all (if that's all or nearly all you spend loyalty crowns on).

I'd also be interested in a dialogue about how it impacts those of us with multiple accounts. My main is very old but I've created additional accounts recently. I don't think my alts deserve all the veteran AA my main gets, but I also think they are different than a single account who just now started.

Incorrect. Accounts were adjusted.

No.

But let's see here....

One paid year at standard pricing rate (No discounts) = $179.88

You want Veteran Rewards in the Marketplace? Fine. You buy them in the order they were introduced. NO cherry-picking!.

You purchase Year One at $179.88 and must have Year One before purchasing Year Two, again at $179.88. You want Year Three? You must have both Year One and Year Two to purchase Year Three at $179.88. And so forth.

You want all fourteen instantly? Fine. $2518.22 up front PER account.

All current rules continue to apply with regard to transferring characters between accounts, deleting a character that has some assigned Veteran's Rewards, etc. etc. etc.

Anyone who attempts to claim that they are entitled to Veteran Rewards who has not earned them by either actually paying for those years or maintained an active account for those years is merely saying "Gimme, Gimme! Johnny has it! I want it, too!" Claims to the contrary are hogwash.