I've found a few issues/bugs with stances. -Flash of Anger doesn't work while 2H skill is up, which is a major problem for raid tanks, and frankly, this basically breaks the entire point of stances as far as I'm concerned since it makes it too dangerous to use 2H stance if you're a backup tank. Warriors already have a lot of DPS abilities that make it dangerous to be next on aggro with, like vehement and offensive, but flash of anger is what buys us time to click off DPS buffs/discs and prepare to tank -Flash of Anger overwrites DW stance due to the DW stance's parry mod -S&B Requires a weapon and shield, therefore you can't activate it or use it with a non weapon primary (should make it only require a shield) =============== Additional critiques: -Since the stances already nerf other weapon types, I don't see why the 30s reuse timer is still on these. Should be shorten to 5s -DW stance has a shorter duration than he other stances and the same buff icon as overhaste. At glance, I think my overhaste has 5 minutes left on it, until I see it's a h instead of a m. Should change the (modified) duration to 10h+ and the icon to something else -Eli: I thought you decided to remove the penalties? As far as I can see, the penalties are more intense than you originally proposed. I also have no clue why DW stance has any defensive penalties at all -The increase block chance on defensive proficiency isn't properly tuned. It seems like someone put 35% into the spreadsheet because it sounded about right, but it's boosting an ability that goes off < 1% of the time by 35% -Our DPS is still a joke. 2H doesn't benefit as much from Fellstrike or Mighty Strike as S&B. So in beta everyone was happy 2H did 50% more DPS than S&B with vanilla melee vs arena dummies, but on actual raid burns our total DPS will only go up by 25-35% on >30s burns. Since 2H works well with brutal I have no doubt some pally will post a 30s 100k+ warrior parse and say OMGZ NERF WARS, but our 1.5m-2m DPS is still at cleric level
It looks like Phalanx of One is broke. I get exactly a 25% mitigation increase with Shield Stance on. I should be only seeing a 15%, correct?
Dual-Wielding Proficiency has a 10% melee mitigation decrease. If you are comparing versus it, that would explain it. From what I've seen Phalanx will only work with no stance or in 2h stance.
No, I'm speaking of only shield stance and having no stance. I shouldn't be getting a 25% mitigation increase under those circumstances, but I am. The only explanation is that Phalanx isn't working.
Yep that sounds pretty likely. It used to work fine but who knows what got messed up with this patch.
Something in tower of rot raid also seems to be overwriting Last Stand (or perhaps it is one of the proficiencies). Very annoying to see Last Stand is down and having a 9 minute+ reuse -- endurance was ok.
You should be getting 25% percent when you have Defensive Proficiency up and 10% with no stances and just Phalanx AA's. The higher % of mitigation cancels out the lower ones. LS active = no Defensive prof or Phalanx, Defensive Prof active = no Phalanx. I haven't paid any attention to whether it messes with the proc from Phalanx but I will run a HA here shortly with Def Prof up and see if I get any procs.
My chatlog has a whole bunch of "You twincast Phalanx of Fury." in it, so that seems to be working for me. Maybe Phalanx isn't working depending on the Proficiency you have activated...?
100% agree on this. If it takes awhile to fine tune some of the other things, please quickly correct flash of anger not working while the skill is up. Very much so defeats the purpose and makes it too much of a hassle/dangerous.
Yes, but the Difference between shield stance and no stance SHOULD be only 15% (25-10=15) but I'm getting a 25% difference. Hence why I'm wondering if Phalanx is broken. Not sure why this is complicated that people aren't understanding me. No stance, no LS, no buffs and I'm seeing 25% less mitigation compared to with shield stance ON. That's the problem. It shouldn't be that.
If that were so, then the improvement we see should only be a 15% improvement. IOW, 10% mitigation (Phalanx of One) -> 25% mitigation (Defensive Proficiency) = 15% improvement. That's not what any of us are seeing. Defensive Proficiency appears to be giving us a 25% improvement over the baseline with no stance. Maathers did some testing on this last week. He compared himself to his zerker, looking only at the max hit numbers (i.e not DI spread, which is affected by AC, only max DI values). Using the same mob attacking both characters, what he found was that with no stance or disc, his max damage hit was right about 90% of the damage of his zerker's DI 19 hit (i.e, second-to-largest hit). This matched the prediction for max hit based on a warrior's innate 1 DI shift downwards and a 10% mitigation baseline from Phalanx of One. Where it got interesting is that his max hit under Defensive Discipline saw almost exactly a 45% reduction of that number, and his max hit under Defensive Proficiency was almost exactly a 25% reduction of that number. In other words, it looked very much like Defensive Discipline / Proficiency were stacking with Phalanx of One - and we all agree they are not supposed to. So as far as we could tell, something seems to be working not quite the way it is supposed to there. Our working hypothesis is that it's behaving like item haste and spell haste, or item regen and spell regen, i.e. that the game is letting it stack, although in this circumstance it's not supposed to. I am not certain whether AA passives function more like cast spells or items, but I was always under the impression that they are treated more like constant worn effects. On another related issue, does the block chance actually do anything? I ask because the second line of Defensive Proficiency's spell description is: 2: Increase chance to block by 35% This appears to be the same effect as line 2 from Improved Parry / Block, which for VII reads: 2: Increase chance to block by 56% And in fact it shows a stacking conflict under Lucy. So, first off, warrior block chance is not from a skill, it's exclusively from our shield block AA, and if I remember correctly, it is not affected by Improved Parry/Block in the first place - at least that was the finding way back when we first got it, and wars were considering getting both Improved Parry and Improved Block from raid TS seals back before they were merged. If this is so, doesn't that mean the line giving the same effect in Defensive Proficiency also does nothing? Second of all, even if it is working, doesn't that mean that the Improved Block effect from Defensive Proficiency will be overwritten by the Improved Parry / Block from my melee focus? Third of all, if they do stack, a la haste/regen item/spell stacking, does that not further suggest the hypothesis for why Phalanx of One and Defensive Disc / Proficiency might be stacking is correct? Note that Dual-Wield Proficiency would seem to have these same issues with the Parry chance that I noted here for Defensive Proficiency and the Block chance.
I don't think you are understanding the situation. Triconix has (should have) 10% mitigation from Phalanx. He gets hit for 10k max hit. Triconix puts on Defensive Proficiency. He now gets max hit for 7.5k. If they were working correctly, his max hit should be 8.5k. (as like you say Defensive wont stack with Phalanx, then the difference should be 25-10% = 15%). Yet he is seeing a 25% difference. Phalanx is either stacking with both Defensive disc and Defensive Proficiency, or else it is not working at all. We think it's the later.
Phalanx is 10% Defensive Stance is on its own 25% (afaik) If they were stacking it would be a 35% increase in mitigation
what Kreacher was trying to point out okloo was this: each 5% = 1 di shift down well say 500 dmg for simplicity zerker took di 20 @ 10k dmg ex 1 ) war took highest di at di 17 (8500 dmg) in S&B w/o proficiency running normal di reduction for war (5%) + phalanx (10%) ex 2) with S&B proficiency he was taking di 12 (6k dmg) (25% reduction + normal + phalanx) ex 3)when he should have been taking DI 14 (7k dmg) just the 25% + natural (5%) since phalanx was not supposed to stack The new proficiency is not supposed to work like ex 2 but thats what his parses are showing and he wants Eli to make sure its working like ex 3 so that things dont start becoming balanced around it being broken then fixes later. IE the FR fix going on with ber/mnk/rouges
If Phalanx of One has been stealth-stacking with the Defensive disc line when it isn't supposed to, it may already be too late to prevent the game from being tuned around it being broken.
I agree if it has been then it needs to addressed in the next expansion by reducing mob dmg, and fixing the stacking issue. I wonder if fixing little coding mistakes like this could bring the game back from twitchquest. I also wonder, My highest war is 85, so someone can test if they want, if the original defensive disk and the new LS works the same in regards to phalanx. I wonder if it was something that was broken recently or has always been that way.
The coded mitigation effect for all the defensive line discs (defensive, stonewall, final stand, last stand) is exactly the same; not just the same spell effect, but even the same value of the effect. If Phalanx is stacking for one, it's stacking for all, and Maathers tested that it appears to be stacking with the Defensive discs at the same time he tested the Defensive proficiency stacking.
