I can choose to subscribe and play the game without buying the latest content. It doesn't make much sense anymore, especially with F2P, but that option is still available.
Come on...be serious. "produce new content at the same rate (actually faster) than it did at the beginning" then "cheaper than when SOE did 2 expansions a year" doesn't make any sense...it was 2 expansions a year but now the content is produced faster? If SOE released content monthly should the price be 4 times as expensive as it is now? Because there are 3 content releases (if it follows the "pattern" of one expansion) now...and 12 content releases is 4 times as many content releases. That is "faster" because it is one every month...instead of one every year. As for the price...the reduction in price is directly related to...kindness? Competition and lowering subscription rates has nothing to do with a balancing of the price point by SOE? Just the content release cycle? Makes you wonder if people would rather pay more for 2 expansions per year and no staggered release...maybe that would be the fix for making more $$$...2 expansions per year at a higher price. Back to 12 releases per year...how about $2 per release? OR $3...but not $4...and those releases are just a single zone each release...in a storyline that can extend as many releases as they feel is appropriate. So 12 zones per year...each with merc/partisan tasks, group missions, and raids. So there are a minimum of 12 new zones....12 group missions...12 raids each year...but probably a lot more... What if you increased the monthly subscription rate by $3 with the 12 month release cycle? Give a discounted rate of $2 if you pay for a full year at a time...and $1.50 if you pay bi-annually. Would this cover the costs of the expansion?
This implies you can buy the latest expansion and take advantage of the features of that expansion in a F2P manner. Is this true? Otherwise, the cost is $40 + 179.88 = 219.88 annually for one account.
YES it is true you can buy an expansion and play on f2p or silver you do NOT have ot have a sub in order to make use of the content, subs have their own set of restrictions and additions completely independent from expansions. expansions are CONTENT, subscription status is basicly the amount of "l33tness" you're allowed to acquire from ANY content you own, or from the content that is already free. you buy new expansion and go do the collections, np, collections are part of the expansion the subscription part simply limits how MUCH of certain things you can acquire, not what things those can consist of. if you want to spend you 1k aas on a silver account on RoF-only aas you're more than welcome to. if you want to level to 100 on a silver account because you bought RoF you can do so, but with a sub and no rof you can not do so. expansions are content, subscriptions are something else entirely i can buy a computer and use it all i want, and that ocmputer can have a gigabit ethernet card on it, but if im on dialup im not going ot get roadrunner speeds until i pay for roadrunner. i can have roadrunner and use a 10 year old computer, the best scenario is of course to have roadrunner AND a new computer, but you pick and choose based on needs/wants if one is more important than another. if i have a massive CGI build computer i can still build all kinds of CGI but if i dont have the internet i cant access stuff on the internet, conversely having internet and a crappy computer doesnt enable me to do CGI simply because i have the internet. another example along the same lines: i can buy the latest and greatest top of the line graphic pc game, but buying the game doesnt automaticly upgrade my computer to play it on, theyre separate expenses. the game and computer to run it on, and in this case the CONTENT, and the freedom of limitations from a subscription. content once purchased is jsut as available on f2p as it is on gold but it depends on how much of your f2p limitations youve chosen to use on older content already on how much is available for the new content you buy
Lets assume some costs here...they can be adjusted...and other costs can be added if they seem valid...but lets start with these and move forward... Team costs (pay, health insurance, chairs, desks, individual computers to work on, and similar items) = $750,000 per team member. Server costs (server purchase/maintenance contract) = $100,000 per server (game servers and email/application/etc servers) Network costs (switch, router, FCOE, 10Gb, etc.) = $100,000 per network "device" Storage (game storage, developer storage, artwork, marketing, etc.) = $1,000,000 per storage "system" Infrastructure (OC3, HVAC, server room support, etc.) = $500,000 per "structure" Marketing/Travel - Team (Fan Faire, E3, GDC, newspaper ads, online ads, slicks, etc.) = $25,000 per "event" or "person per event" Overhead (things that cost money...coffee, sodas, trash cans, etc.) = $1,000,000 Environmentals (HVAC for office building, security guards, cleaning crews, phone system, etc.) = $2,500,000 These will be annual costs...and some are per person/structure/system...so we could have this... Team: 50 x $750,000 Server: 100 x $100,000 Network: 20 x $100,000 Storage: 5 x $1,000,000 Infrastructure: 10 x $500,000 Marketing/Travel: 50 x $25,000 Overhead: 1 x $1,000,000 Environmentals: 1 x $2,500,000 This gives a total annual cost of $65,250,000. If these numbers seem off we can adjust them...more network devices...more cost to infrastructure, more for marketing, etc...can all be adjusted as appropriate...but it is a start. Now...if EQ has 500k subscriptions...and 100% of those subscriptions buy an expansion at $40 and pays $14.99 per month for a full year...that generates...$109,940,000 annually. The expansion generates $20,000,000 annually. The subscriptions generate $89,940,000 annually. 500k = $20 million for expansion, $89.9 million in subscriptions. $109 total Ok...so it isn't 500k subscriptions? Is it 300k? 250k? 200k? 100k? 50k? 300k = $12 million for expansion, $53.9 million in subscriptions. $65.9 total 250k = $10 million for expansion, $44.9 million for subscriptions. $54.9 total 200k = $8 million for expansion, $35.9 million for subscriptions. $43.9 total. 100k = $4 million for expansion, $17.9 million for subscriptions. $21.9 total. 50k = $2 million for expansion, $8.9 million for subscriptions. $10.9 total. So...clearly at the assigned annual costs of $65.2 million...the customer subscriptions needs to be at 300K to even break even... Changing the subscription rate of 300k subscriptions to $18.5 (increase of $3.50) then just the subscriptions would cover the annual costs of the EQ team. That works out to $42 per account per year increase. Almost the same value as $40 for an expansion. Assume that for those that stop paying for one or more subscriptions that new subscriptions are adds to make it a constant rate. So if someone doesn't want to pay for 6 accounts anymore...there are 1 or more people that increase accounts to replace that 6 lost accounts. For this discussion...for this expansion...just to keep the numbers at these values. Would it be better to increase the subscription to $18.5 or charge $40 for an expansion?
If you play for a whopping 2 hours a week thats around $2 an hour for entertainment. Considering what a movie rental costs, what a movie ticket costs, what ANY type of event costs, that is a bargain. And thats for someone that almost never plays. If you play for 10 hours a week you're paying 42 cents an hour. Oh, and thats assuming you are paying month to month instead of a year at a time to save. So what are you complaining about again? The subscription fee is to maintain the service. Expansion price is to cover development costs. Both have a profit margin built in because its not a charity. Its a business. If its too expensive, stop paying it. Honestly, the vast majority of people that complain about the costs like this always shell out for the stuff anyway, and they are just whining in some vain hope to get a discount on something they know they are going to buy. We are in year 14 and the expansions have been $40 for over a decade and we're on expansion 20. Be happy we haven't seen the same inflation in expansion costs as we have in the subscription fee (which was $9.89 originally a month, then went to 12.99, then to 14.99).
So merc AAs will work on apprentice mercs as well as journeyman mercs? Great. It is good to hear that buying an expansion lets you level to the max level of the game...but it is sad that you can be a paying subscriber and be capped at level 90 unless you buy the RoF expansion. Didn't realize RoF had 10 levels tied to it but OK....
Who is complaining? But didn't someone post that the subscription rate is significantly cheaper now than when 2 expansions per year was the standard? The numbers listed don't seem cheaper...in fact they have only increased. Also, does anyone know the expansion release dates? How many years were there 2 per year versus one (or less?) per year?
Wonder how expensive it is to maintain the service vs development costs. Would seem to make sense that development costs could be a big cost...given the number of people involved in the development process...artists...programmers...designers...concept thinkers....lore folks...etc. It would seem reasonable that development costs are not a small number. Maintaining the service...equal to development costs? Less? More? By a lot (less or more)???
The Ruins of Kunark (April 2000) The Scars of Velious (December 2000) The Shadows of Luclin (December 2001) The Planes of Power (October 2002) The Legacy of Ykesha (February 2003) Lost Dungeons of Norrath (September 2003) Gates of Discord (February 2004) Omens of War (September 2004) Dragons of Norrath (February 2005) Depths of Darkhollow (September 2005) Prophecy of Ro (February 2006) The Serpent's Spine (September 2006) The Buried Sea (February 2007) Secrets of Faydwer (November 2007) Seeds of Destruction (October 2008) Underfoot (December 2009) House of Thule (October 2010) Veil of Alaris (November 2011) Rain of Fear (November 2012) and Shadow of Fear (April 2013) and Heart of Fear (July 2013) Call of the Forsaken(September 2013) Game was release in March 1999. Kunark was $35 retail (they had a preorder for $15 + $8 shipping but then told people it wouldn't be shipped for weeks, so people cancelled their preorders). I believe all other expansions other than LoY and LDoN were $40 retail but some early ones had a price break for digital only download when they still made box sets.
Their major isolated development cost are the character models and zones, supposedly. The rest is done by the regular staff and profits from the expansions should be rolled back into their salaries and overheard on top of the subscription fees. And there is no where near 500k subscriptions. EQ had 550k as their peak subscriptions almost a decade ago. It wouldn't shock me if the current subscription rate was anywhere from 30k to 100k, because its so hard to guage all the people that keep paying and barely log on and all the alt accounts, and then FTP makes it even more difficult. I bet its in the 60-70k range.
idk how the merc aas will work, but the game has ALWAYS been buy the expansion to get the extra levels, but now you have the option to have it for FREE up through HoT without ever paying for an expansion, and theres always been a subscription but now you have the option to play also for FREE rather than monthly but that option does have tradeoffs as far as paying subscriber goes you can wear the top gear and max your aas at 90 as a gold subscriber without having ever bought an expansion, as a bronze you can only wear the nonprestige stuff and get 250aas and as silver (meaning you have spent 5bucks or been a subscriber in the past) you can get up to 1k aas but still no prestige gear, along with the merc restriction. RoF doesnt have 10 levels tied to it, VoA had 5 and RoF had 5 but instead of having to pay for both if you want them you only have to buy RoF, or wait a month and get voa, rof, and the next expansion for the price of only 1. There's so much free, bonus, included, etc content and features in this game at this point i dont understand the complaints. Prior to F2P launch players paid 160-220 a year per account just to play and be current. Now you can pay 40 a year to play and remain current, or nothing a year to play as long as you arent rushing to the absolute end or trying to join a current raid guild, or you can get anythign and everything available in the game, for 130-220 a year depending on subscription format (there are some with $90 a year subs all the way up to the flat 15 a month, plus the 40 a year expansion) they're all choices theyre all options. i seriously hope your statements have been tongue in cheek sarcasm because if they're not all your complaints are baseless if you truly dont have any idea what you're complaining about in the first place.
this is have to disagree with. there is NO way the actual subscription rate is anywehre near that low. very very few people that have paid their subs over the years stopped paying subs just because F2P launched, instead they created more new accounts that arent subbed for other "stuff", if they stopped theirsubs theyd lose a lot of work theyd put in on those toons in the form of gear augs mercs etc and the ability to gain aas as no matter how many on the forums here may be max level/aa in reality thats only a very small % of the games population and those still wanting to progress will continue to pay, their form of payment may have changed is all- kronos, gamecards, different rates, the old cheap tirple sc sub deals, wahtever. however the games population ahs been rising especially recently so the actual % of players that are subscribed has gone down, obviously, because of the influx of those on f2p as new players , returnees, and estra spare accounts made by those already paying for other accts (i know ive gone from 4 active and 3 inactive to 4 active 1-3 sporadicly active and another 8 or more fully f2p for some odd OCD reason, just since the launch of f2p as i can make accounts nda toons and mess around with it or use for housign etc whatever without FIRST committing to a monetary expenditure, and then later spend something to enhance the experience) i would guess there are still a good 300k or more active subs be they recurring or not and 1-200k unsubbed or sporadicly subbed. your estimate would require that 80-90% of the prior paying subscribers had cancelled their subs sicne f2p launch and thats far from the reality.
300k subs lol. EQ2 dropped below 200-250k which is why they went F2P first and EQ2 had more then EQ at that time. My guess ? 100-125k active Gold Accounts. Subs don't matter though they're most likely making a good chunk from the marketplace. Also kronos were huge and will continue to be. We all know kronos were added as a way for them to sell plat without selling plat because its exactly what people who buy them are doing. No ones buying a krono for a 1 month sub when its 3$ cheaper to just pay for 1 month + you get 500 SC. Marketplace aside development teams are not cheap especially experienced ones. For all we know expansion sales keep this game afloat. By the way SOE if you were SMART you would offer ROF for 19.99 right now because anyone who's going to buy it will just wait for COTF unless you lower the price.
You think the current population is 300k subscribed plus an additional 1-200k, (400k average), when the height of EQ's population was said to be around 550k and it had 3x the number of servers it does now? Are you insane?
LOL...all these people that love defending the "F2P" model as being a great model. SOE's F2Browse model is great to see if the game is interesting enough to pay for a subscription. Other than that...the free and silver levels are largely useless. What is with all these "complaints" questions or claims? Who is complaining here...other than those complaining about people asking what is the point of paying for the next expansion and a monthly subscription if the expansion fee is what gives you access to the newest content over a year. The previous model of paying for expansions to gain access to the newest content was the standard before "F2P" was implemented...why is it so strange to ask why the expansion fee is still applicable for those paying a subscription. Sure sounds like people want to embrace the F2P model as great but any other considerations to the fees and subscriptions are only allowed to be baseless statements...LOL.... This is great...what other things are baseless statements because they don't fit someone's personal agenda for what is a factual statements?
Yes, but with a car maintenance is not included. If the expansion needs maintenance or a bit of a fix they fix it for free even for the ones who do not have a sub. 40 dollars divided by 52 weeks = less than ONE dollar a week (pennies a day if you divide less a buck by 7 for the week) and a cup of coffee is 1 to 2 dollars for one cup and you are complaining about price? /boggle I see it now. This thread is a conspiracy to have us realize how cheap it is for content and to talk about it so we understand when they raise the price of the expansion. btw...I hope you get after car companies like you do here about their prices...their prices tags are MUCH bigger than a wee expansion to the game. I would definitely like to see a price break on a car.
