This game needs a gear check for average item level of a set of gear to match the minimum CR required to queue for said Role. Dual Queuing players who are full well knowing they have no intention on tanking if the tank role needs to be filled is aggravating. Youre game allows and welcomes players to be as toxic as they please and as selfish as they want because their arnt systems in places to encourage it and discourage bad behavior. That needs to change.
And with all the arguing that ensued, it was hard to concentrate listening to the back and forth. Hardly anyone was doing pick-ups and I was the only activating the cogs on Kerbak/Jakkec/Theon/Proma. I don't know it was because others were busy arguing to pay attention to what was going on or what the reason but failing to activate the cogs could have made things worse than they were. And don't even get me started on the pick-ups! RAWR!
It's usually the opposite for me. If I queue into an instance as a healer the group is usually filled with them and nobody wants to dps. Some of the weirder behavior I've seen is the tank, healer or troll switching to dps in the middle of an instance. Raid groups with multiple healers and trolls. Speeding forward starting fights even though theres no tank or healer...and doing it over and over. My own rule is I don't queue into instances expecting a carry. If that character can't handle the content (keeping in mind I do enjoy a good challenge) I work on them until they can. Not all people feel the same way. Also sometimes when I queue in I forget to only queue in as one role or the other (or both)...
Nothing of substance, its frustrating to have to deal with 10 minutes left till shutdown and someody wants to jump the line to get in first and in doing so screws the entire run in 1 fell swoop themselves.
No, it doesn't. Most of the content can be completed with battle role builds, or with mixed gear, especially if the player has high SP, augs, arts, allies and knows what they are doing. Even in EG it's not always necessary to have a full role-specific set, if you use high level DPS pieces in place of the ones you're missing, because they haven't dropped for you yet. Having a role set does not guarantee a player will be willing or able to perform their role anyway - a lot of the ones queuing dual role in EEG and refusing to play as the role they are assigned have role gear equipped, because - presumably - they don't know any better. There's the kick system. There could be some sort of warning added, in order to educate new players about the importance of roles and the fact, they need to be able to solo tank, heal, or troll if they queue a raid as a role, but it would still rely in good will of players. Not being able to queue as a role because you're missing a troll ring, or whatever, would also be aggravating and would make queues longer, since many people capable of performing a role could not fill the queues, unless they have the specific gear the game arbitrarily decides is indispensable. And there would still be people gaming the system, who would keep a bare-bones role set in their banks just to get into instances faster, hoping someone else will switch to the missing role they're not able, or willing to perform and leaving if no one does just to try again - as it often happens now.
My issue is with the system leaving goodwill up to the players, it never ends well. Bake it into the system. If you dont have the gear to tank, then you shouldnt be able to queue as tank. Its nice that people can battle-role but high SP players are the minority of the community. And designing a run sabotaged by 1 person who queued for tan/healer but doesnt have the gear/setup/want to battle-tank or even tank /healin general. Is allowing one person to potentially fail a raid because nobody can fill the role. THis games community behavior needs a serious overhaul, but pretending nothing can be done is doing them no favors.
But but but....how will they learn? WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?! Seriously though, I doubt you can make a gear check. And even if you could, what is the threshold? What about 'battle' builds. Is a CR 412 DPS person who has CR 355 troll gear from a CR skip but they never put it on past the style still 412? Will it take into effect banked gear, what is imprinted or not or if the person has a proper LO or artis? And on top of all of that, there is no saying that player actually will switch, or if forced, that they will be effective. Also, if forced, will it force 2 healers if only 1 is needed? Will it force a 2nd tank where 1 will do? Mandatory tutorial (or you can't switch role), maybe even an annual re-up, like a RL licensing exam for some trades/professions. If someone knows what they are doing, it would be a 1 time a year 2 or 3 min distraction. If you don't know what you are doing, you'll learn something at least. I'd throw in a way to get a 2nd armory for 'free' as well, maybe earned via runs, or bought in Dr Fate....1 per toon max, but that would mean everyone can have 2 functional armories. Not saying they'd use them for role/dps, but it wouldn't be an excuse for people.
Having gear is not usually the difficult part and does not guarantee that the player can, or will tank. People refusing to do their role are the minority of the community - arguably smaller than the number of players with high SP. It's a pain when it happens, but it doesn't happen very often - at least on EU server - and when it does, you know within a minute of entering the instance. You can leave and requeue. Or just LFG a group. Simplistic, heavy-handed solutions won't do anybody any favors either. Expecting the game to police every aspect of players' behavior is not realistic. It would also take away a lot of variety and fun of running with different group setups - what if I want to make a group and run a raid without a particular role? Should I not be able to enter the instance, unless someone has a full gear set for the role we don't need? EDIT: Often there's someone who can do the missing role in the PUG, despite not having queued as, or been assigned it. AND many raids can be completed without certain roles. I'd rather be in the instance sooner, so I can play (or leave if necessary), rather than wait for a player with the correct gear to queue, especially that they can still be awful at the role, or just refuse to switch, because they don't think it's necessary, or whatever.
Everything seems heavy-handed when nothing at all is moderated. All im asking is, hey if the player doesnt have tank gear for the raid they run, dont allow them to dual queue as tank. Its a small quality of life improvement that would deter players from joining groups to jump the line. creating issues for the groups they joined. That's not a big ask. Its such a duh position to me, i dont get why people are defending people who intentionally use the tank role they dont gear for to jump the line and say. They shouldnt have to have gear as tank to queue for the tank role...? If i took a handicap spot, and simply pretended to have a disability, should i be able to keep that spot? I say no, because you dont meet the criteria to take/have that spot.
What kills me more than anything is that it's 2023 and some players STILL don't pickup on this right away. For f**ks sake, look at the role symbols as soon as you get into content! Don't be that group that wipes on the first set of adds, or gets to the first boss only to realize you're already done. PAY ATTENTION! As someone who queues up for everything and has done so for 10 years, chances are, no matter what you queue into, you DID NOT get grouped up with 3 or 7 god tier players who can handle themselves in any content without a heal or tank. Most of the time you're playing with a mix of new players, alts, average joes, and bad players. You don't just assume a random group is gonna fly without a heal or tank.
So if im in a group with a player who queued up as tank/dps. And nobody else did so its 1 tank/dps, 1 troll, 1 heal and the rest DPS. Why am i as a healer forced to tank/heal? When the guy who queued up as a tank, refuses to tank? Why does the game not do anything to deter people from intentionally sabotage a group run to get in a group first?
And all I'm saying is - read my previous posts, I don't feel like repeating my points. It's already not uncommon on EU server to wait 30 min for an Omni raid, or spend hours in LFG, trying to form a group for a specific run. I'd rather take my chances with a tank, or troll, who's using mixed gear, than extend those times further, if those players couldn't even queue, thank you very much. You're on a more populated server - just make a group if you don't want to deal with the few a-holes who won't perform the role they queued as. Not a big ask for you, but - for reasons you've been already given - it may actually be QOL impairment for many players. That's because you're only looking at this from your privileged position, as someone playing on a fairly populated server and you refuse to take any other perspective into consideration. Nobody's defending those people, if you read the posts in this thread - you might understand why many may be opposed to your idea. I get it - someone p***ed you off and now you want the game to turn into a nanny state, whatever the consequences. We've been over this before, with the 30min Deserter Penalty you proposed... Calm down and make a group, or - if you enter an instance without a tank - just leave and requeue. I hate when this happens too, but it's not the end of the world. Again - not necessarily, at least not a full set and at least not in most EEG content, where this happens most often. That's just a silly analogy, which I won't even bother to address, because - lol...
We're long past any kind of "check" system because of EEG. EEG gives you the bare minimum you need by just switching to the role. All but three Episodes are always covered. I mean, that's a substantial amount of content. It's something. If a player queues up as a tank/dps, they can both tank and dps. Outside of not knowing how to play the support role, there are no other excuses. You have what you need. Now if that player can't do the job, well that's no different than actually getting a bad tank. It happens. Those Superman clone characters still exist; they've got the gear, augs, maybe artifacts, but they think they can tank with: Heat Vision, dps abilities, with no shields, with no tank mechanics, and with no understanding of taunts and aggro. The game can't deter a bad player from joining your group, lol.
Meanwhile how the game is moderated: Duped cashed Cashapp RMT Speed hacker galore Bots Rampant in Hubs Open toxicity in chat DCUO got it all with little to no moderation of it in sight.
This is my biggest reason that I think it's a bad suggestion. I'd take a person who KNOWS how to tank/heal/troll and has an alternate loadout on their DPS single armory they can switch to over someone who has a full set of gear, but doesn't know what LO he/she should be using. Unfortunately, there is really no way to implement a check for what people know vs what they have...well except a pretty tight tutorial/test to unlock role queuing...and even that would not be 100% effective. I've had to run role before on an alt that has NO gear and did NOT queue for a role because some guy who did queue for the role and who knows...maybe had gear...couldn't or wouldn't switch. I'm not saying I did anything impressive, but in the instances where I had to tank, I had a tank LO that works and had multiple pulls and shields, even with no gear or artis. Instances where I had to heal, I provided HOT and instant heals, and depending on the power, shields as needed. Heck even on my lowly gadgets DPS (12th tier farmer), I've got a troll LO slotted on the alt side....still unused, but there. It doesn't take much to find your debuffs and power dump....if you know what to look for, which many don't BECAUSE there is no tutorial. Most of the time, unless you are trying for a feat, knowledge outweighs gear....in EEG least.
I asked this in another thread, but I'd like to hear your answer. Would you be willing to have a future episode focus primarily on designing a tutorial for "Role" mechanics & responsibilities? My suggestion was a Suicide Squad theme. Duo/Alert/Raid 1 & Raid 2 for EG. First 3 would be test (tutorial), with objectives & scripts aimed at guiding new/unfamiliar players. (Who better than Waller to treat you like you're a noob) It would have an open world, elite, plus, etc. However the "event" version is inserted MUCH earlier in the game. During the leveling stage. My concern is the backlash from EG players, unaware of the goal, being treated like noobs in 3/4 of the content.
No. I would not want it as an episode. This kind of stuff is 'fun' to an extent, but after everyone has run it 10-20 times you just want to get it done. I'd rather see a tutorial that would REQUIRE the player to make some choices on power...not 'press triangle' to throw a debuff, similar to how the tutorial used to be on the ship "Press R1 to block...NOW"....wooo...some challenge . And it should be a few 'bosses', each of which would teach some lesson on that role, but again...the important part...to me... is that we, the players, need to look at our power trees and pick a power that would do the thing we need to do. (i.e. You are going up against Grood or something and Flash is with you and says "I can't do any damage on him with that shield he has....see if you have any way to lower his defenses" during a troll tutorial....and similar). It wouldn't matter if we did it all that well, but the goal (to me) would be that anyone who can do that will have SOME understanding that there are different powers that roles have that don't do the pew-pew, but do other things depending on if you are role or not. Things that are necessary when running role, and would have some experience in actually reading the powers and selecting the right ones. And again to any vet, this should be as easy as blowing through the artifacts run on alts. You know what to do, you know how to select your powers, in and out in a few minutes or in your sleep. For the noob who either doesn't want to, or CAN'T figure out what a LO is to run role...they fail the tutorial, and can't queue that role, or have to try again. Now...I'm not saying they can't ask a buddy to give them a LO, or go to youtube to get a LO, but either of those things are helpful and...apparently...out of the reach of some of our noobs. "what's a debuff" or "what's a single taunt" should never be something we can hear/see in a run, but we do....often. And remember, I'd only want this to QUEUE as role. I'm not saying that a person can't switch role to to play as role, and they can get gear, mess with loadouts, etc....but to get in a run where the matchmaker will say 'assigned role....tank/troll/heal', you had to get through the tutorial once...you had to read powers and pick the right ones....once.
That's about how I thought ppl's reaction would be. They'd recognize, maybe even appreciate, the effort being made. Cross their fingers & hope really hard. Then just feel annoyed that one of the episodes got turned into a tutorial.
