Please add option to not stat clamp alongside stat clamping

Ok, none of this makes any sense to me. How could you out perform a tank class player spec’d for the job with an “inferior” character (you did say that it was your baby character) who was not spec’d for that job? Is this a result of being scaled up in the stat clamped content?

This truly baffles me. If this is the case then what you are saying is I could have tanked in Oly as a dps as easily as a player whose a tank class?

I appreciate what you're saying, but let's say the conversation goes something like;

"I went into DWF and it was an absolute train wreck, we died to everything and I had to leave on first boss - this thing is a broken train wreck"

If I've then run DWF with ease to completion and someone says that, think about it from my perspective for a moment, how can I give the benefit of the doubt that there's an issue with the content in that case?

Given the relative ease in which I've completed the content it would signal to me that it isn't content broken but rather the 'player variable' creating the issue.

What's more than likely happening in there is that you've got a bunch of lower geared characters trying to approach the content like self proclaimed gods on crack.

They're disrespecting the content, likely have no support roles or players that don't know how to properly play support, players that have blind queued content with no intention of doing anything outside of DPS and players using wrong artifacts, no augments or possibly even heaven forbid running a Thanos gauntlet with an augment of each color because that must be powerful, right...

It's all this type of stuff that more often than not leads to struggles.

Let's even take a heavy outlier feat that I've always questioned a little bit post clamp "Stake Well Done" that's burn Vampire Lord in 50 seconds.

In the clamped environment that feat may be very, very difficult, but how many people do you think are going in there with 'pyres' and 'pets' and 'boosts' in every way they can imagine. 'timed orbitals', 'optimal loadouts'...

How many do you think are queuing omnibus and expecting it to just "happen" because they will it to do so?

I only have max arts and stuff on one toon and regardless of what toon I go on I havent had much issue with clamped content. Regardless of which toon I run. The only times I have struggled have been when I have run with players who did not know what to do.

If you want I can run an FGSr raid with you. I would even do it with your league so that you can have a more controlled environment. I would even let you chose which of my toons you want me to run on just so that you do not think I am only doing so good because of op power or precision.

My main is prec electric (not because it is op but because thats what he has always been). 359 cr. Max arts 643 SP
My 2nd toon is a HL might. 200/200/160. one of the 200 may be 180 or 199 I cant remember. 359 cr. 593 SP
My 3rd toon is a might Atomic. 200/160/199 (i think thats where his are at). 358 cr. 477 SP
Or maybe my prec nature. 99/129/125 arts. 352 cr. 312 SP

Atomic and Nature are the "worst" dps powers by some players so maybe you would want to pick one of those.

I am more than happy to answer any questions so no need to apologize for anything. Both the omni que system and the custom tab use your settings to que up. If you go to Options > Settings > Gameplay, there is a option that says "Enable Roles Optional". This should, by default, be off. If you turn it off than it tells the game that when you que up that you are ok if not every role is present. This includes both groups you make and random ques.

So for example. If you and 4 friends who all happen to be healer powers que up and you have the option turned off than you will not be able to que because the system is check for someone to que as a troll and as a tank. If you have a group of 4 people and everyone is a different role type, tank/troll/healer, but everyone ques as a dps than the system will not let you que because the system is checking that someone has selected the troll, tank, and healer options. You guys can all que your role but dps in that instance and be able to go in just fine.

This is where people get a lot of hate thou. Queing up for a raid as a healer/tank but not going into your role. People have that optioned turned off on purpose to make sure they get one of each role.

That is because of experience. I am (imo) a good player. I have solo healed most elite raids including the anniversary elite raid. I battle tank all the time. I have one of each tanking powers for dailies and omni stuff. I did a better job at tanking because even thou I was stats clamped, enough stats pierced through to where I could pull adds. I had enough knowledge to tank even handicapped. That is something that can not be taken away from you. Experience and skill is and always will be the defining factor in whether something is easy or hard.

One of the biggest things that can never be discounted is player experience.

He means that even in DPS gear, with a tank loadout (accessed by using 'switch roles' vs an armory) he had enough stats to tank the run due to the clamp. Not sure if he had any 'switch hitter' artis on, but even so, it just proves that it's not the stats from SP (which I'd guess he didn't re-allocate) or piercing from artis (which he didn't likely have tank ones on), his knowledge of the game was more important.

I've had to do this a few times as well. And like Deity, I have (on all my DPS-ONLY toons) a role loadout set up for this situation. The truth is that a good player in bad gear is sometimes better than a bad player in good gear. This is true on Omni moreso where the stats will be changed anyway and your DPS gear probably has enough overage that it will be brought down to relatively usable stats for a role. You won't carry a run solo, but if missing a troll was the issue, you can troll. If missing a tank is the issue, you can tank. I had to do this not long ago in GOM. I was on a DPS only toon and we dropped our tank and didn't get one in the opening. We were on 2nd boss, so I switched role and chucked agro at the Pheonix till she came over away from the others, then did the same with the Minotaur. However, in this group, the only thing missing was the tank role....the other players seemed to know what to do. If they were doing the wrong things, or doing nothing, it would have failed. This CAN work in a pinch, but is not idea. Long story short, yes you might have been able to tank Oly, even though you had no tank gear or artis as long as you actually could switch to tank (meaning you aren't a troll/heal powerset). It really depends on your loadout and the other 7 people in the group. As he mentioned, the other players were lunging zeus (as they should)...if not I'd guess that he would have gone down in the lightning blast unless the healer was also very good.

In endgame runs, I'd highly suggest against trying this practice you will fail or be booted.

And how other many instances is it in fact “just happening” for them? Of course player skill/investment is a variable, but so is margin for error. Can you honestly tell me that Fire and Brimstone is no more forgiving than DWF?

This is a random video on YouTube that I found of a tank not using any arts or skill points. All tank gear and tank loadout. That player dropped once against Anti-Monitor. Without knowing the battle log I can only guess someone used an orbital. Anyways tanking is a lot more rewarding to those who have experience and knowledge.

Impressive. It would have been a better example if he dropped the 2 legendary Allies, and I'd guess taken 1/2 of his augs off, but yeah....knowledge>gear at least in Reg. Elite is a different animal.

Kudos to the 340 healer too....I've seen higher healers drop more bodies in that Superman fight.

And I'd say that was not an orbital....I didn't see one in the video. Also, the corruption is worse with peeps in the same pool...they should not be there. Tank gets his own pool.

that's right developers, just keep listening only to those small group of people who lick your feet no matter how foolish or worst changes devs do, just give voice to your small group of circus seals clapping when you say, of course the trash clamp making the game tedious,
frustrating, irritating will make a lot of money, when it fails again and desperate to think of the next magic solution I vote here to remember why it failed again, laughing in your face
there's no reason to waste time, those who lose money and players are just one side...

You keep saying people want things handed to them. They don't, literally no one does.

What many of us want is to retain our sense of progression and no, stat piercing, etc. doesn't cut it. You might think it's fine but a lot of folks do not. So having an unclamped OPTION is simply a way for players to enjoy the work they've put in on their characters over time. To write off people who want a CHOICE to have the game playable in a way that it was for a decade+ as "wanting easy mode" is honestly bizarre and the worst kind of toxicity.

Wanting a clamp optional with full rewards is wanting things handed to you. You want feats than work for them. You want them under no clamp than that you asking for freebees. I have proposed an option and you did not like it because it did not include the rewards you wanted. So again, that you wanting things handed to you with little work put in.

EDIT: For anyone reading this. This right here is what I mean by people talking without any real proof. The "stats piercing does not cut it" crowd. These are the people that just will never be happy with how easy they make it until it is one shot easy again. And IMO these type of people should have their feedback ignored because they do not have any feed back but demands.

False.

Please stop misrepresenting others' wishes. Also, I'm not concerned with your "offers" as you are not a developer and you're not in a position to make that kind of overture. I--as clearly many others will as well-- will continue to lobby for an unclamped option with rewards that are commensurate with the way they were structured pre-clamp until that option is implemented in full.

Allie’s don’t make a big difference to the point it’s needed. Sometimes I even forget to use it. I didn’t see or hear anything about that player using augments. That player could have done better such as power management or positioning but nonetheless it’s a funny video because it just proves you don’t need tank arts or max arts and especially skill points to do regular content. The more knowledge you have on your tank powerset the better you become. I love the aspects and uniqueness from each tank power except ice lol

It's honestly funny when most of the folks who are fine with the stat clamp, already got all their feats BEFORE the clamp was initiated. Now, don't get me wrong, I don't mind it, and started on switch after the clamp, and yeah, there are problems, but I actually prefer it this way.
But of course some ppl won't mind it, cuz it won't effect them anyways cuz they already got everything they wanted before it happened. Imo, it doesn't matter to me tho, I'ma get whatever I need. Clamp or not.
I say, if anything, raise the clamp up a dozen CRpoints or something. But I don't think there should be an Option to remove it. Cuz why would I clamp, and work hard for something I can literally just walk and f@rt my way through?? It doesn't really make sense to give an option if the easier route gives the same reward as the hard route.

Agreed. I was just saying, to really show 'it doesn't matter' a set of HOD/Cyborg/Calc/Oracle would be nice to show 'low' is sometimes good enough. I did see him pop Nubia a few times, so she did something, and I'm sure Diana helped as well.

Now if the whole group was no artis/sp....that might have been interesting.

I actually get most of my feats while the DLC is at endgame. The feats that I miss are either because I have not played during that DLC or because I do not care to get them. Take wonderverse for example, I did not play during that DLC but instead got those feats when I returned during flashpoint. I also got most of the 31st century feats when I returned. I am still missing some simple feats too. For example I am missing the Battle for earth duo x amount of times feats because i couldnt care about getting it. I am missing the easy feat to help catwoman or batwoman (forgot which one). Easy feats. I am missing them because I do not really care about going back to finish them. Most of the endgame players get feats while a dlc is fresh. Why? because that is when there is the most amount of players. Are there some feats that people got while no clamp? yes definitely. But to the extent that you think.

Just be honest. You do not care about my opinion because they do not line up with what you want. You have liked and agreed with peoples OPINIONS about what they should offer. So why is one ok and not another? Because it fits with what you want. I am not a dev so I have no say in how they run it. But neither do you. They made the option to add the clamp. They offered to give more wiggle room with the piercing. Buy in your own words "they is not going to cut it". Did I miss something because I am pretty sure you are not a dev either. So your opinions on "what is going to cut it" is also useless by your own standards. "If you are not a dev than what you say is not going to cut it".

Sounds like a challenge.

I'm going to politely point towards the past.

Once upon a time, they introduced a thing called Role Optional Buffs. Queues no longer required the ideal make-up of a group. Some players complained. "Make it optional! I want to make sure that I always have a Healer/Tank/Whatever!" They DID make it optional.

The result was pretty simple. It was discovered almost instantly that the vast majority of players preferred to play with the entire population and get a faster queue. The minority of players who wanted to play in a more restricted situation based upon what they wanted, they either had to wait in the queues quite a bit longer, or they had to custom-build their groups in advance.

The players who are praising the Stat Clamp are the same players who are terrified and opposing it being made optional. That is not a coincidence.

The vast majority of players do NOT want this feature. If the majority of players wanted this feature, then making it optional would not be a big deal. There would just be a handful of outlaying players that would be forced to play with each other at-level, even if they could only muster partial groups, and for everyone else it would be business as usual.

It is only when the majority do NOT want this feature that the minority that wanted it finds themselves disadvantaged. They can queue up for "Extra Whimpy Mode" and discover that the majority of players are not joining in with them, and THEY are the ones stuck waiting forever.

And therein is the rub. The whole concept of not providing an option is based on the idea of forcing a feature upon players that the majority of them do not want, instead of giving a choice and allowing everyone to have fun. What was the DCUO motto: "Play Your Own Way". When you force a change onto players that the majority of players don't like, the result is a net loss of customers. So providing the option always wins out.

With the option, the ten players who claim that they don't want to be carried can still be able to group with each other and run things at level. They can custom build their own groups, the way they should have been doing in the first place, or they can queue up and wait until enough like-minded people are on. They can get what they want, and get it without angering and driving away a large majority of players.

We are not asking "Reverse the Stat Clamp". We are asking "Make the Stat Clamp optional." Anyone who honestly believes that the majority wants it should have nothing to fear. And anyone who knows that the majority hates it should acknowledge their their own opinion and preference should not outweigh the majority of players to the detriment of the game's population.

You seem to be confusing what I'm asking for here and who I'm asking. Here's a hint: It's not you. I'm not "granting" proposed changes to the game as you seem to be positioning yourself to purport to do. I'm stating what I would like to see happen, not saying that I have some ability to grant that either for myself or for others. And no, you're correct, I don't care about your opinion at all-- you've continually demonstrated that you'd prefer fewer choices for an unhappy playerbase so that makes your thoughts easy to disregard.

Btw, I did not make this thread, nor have I made a thread anything like this in a very long time. Funny how other people seem to continue to make this push. *shrug*