Test Discussion Dual Wield Flurry Shot Update

Like a quote from Dawnbreaker from the DC Alert, "I Got What I Wanted!, I Always Do!" that's how the devs feel when they take your money

Def doesn't smoke it at all.

The top prec dps powers would beat it and the ones that aren't good that light would beat, I def wouldn't call smoking them. This isn't a hard combo either to Say I'm doing it wrong. Say U have a feat run in elite n ur in an instance for a while on a certain boss fight you really see just how much stronger a GD prec flurry user was over lights single.
Precs maneuverability Is also wut made it great. Lights u get planted.

Its good yes but not the way ur sayin.

By seeing the reactions and doing tests on live server the changes sadly wont most likely do much to DWFS will still be too strong for Single Target maybe you guys can do a little tweaking on the damage numbers of DWFS itself. Even after This nerf its still the Best with nature might on ST just shows how much people have been carried by this high hitting ST weapon mastery combo. Also nature might needs to get a close look at its perforimg too good (might) if DWFS gets nerfed abit more people would just go nature which needs a nerf too so fixing these 2 to the point they are equal or closing the gap more between other combos and might powers is the best goal and Thanks to you Developers and have a great day

The people saying that nature is too strong are partially right. The Gorilla Hand claps basically add an average of 9-10k on every hit which is quite strong considering you're only speccing some leftovers in precision and nothing else.
Apart from that I've seen countless Nature dps who thought that they could jump on the wagon performing horrible. Be it either by messing something up and losing all DoTs or not managing their super that well.
I've been nature since before the stats revamp with a little break here and there and I think overall it's very good but not OP. You have to jump through multiple hoops to perform best; other powers don't need to do that to do fairly good (with a few exceptions that suck at might dps).
I wouldn't be mad if they reduced the gorilla hand claps, though. Maybe not to regular taps of below 1000 damage but still a fair bit. The rest of nature, it's abilities and such are fine. If they are not careful with nature we would probabaly have another power that is again fubar like in the days before the revamp.

Another fix that is definitely needed and has to be adressed is the DoT stealing and Roar-bug. They can go for all I care because this is what actually makes Nature the cheese power without any efforts. Regular rotations are very good but not broken.

I’m not saying I found out about flurry, but I was using it during the WM era lol, and that was years ago. And do you you take the time to even comprehend what’s being written to you, because I’ve said three times now that I’m not mad about this, and that it’s a decent change. You really want somebody to be mad so you can have a frequent narrative that you can stick to, and it’s silly to be honest, I can tell you live in 5v5 chat, and you need to keep that toxicity within the wasteland that you and players like you have made it.

Furthermore, I’ll never go nature, I don’t need anything blatantly op to compete, I don’t even use doomspin and I still compete with those who live by that sword. Speaking of mediocre players, if you were getting out dpsed by flurry, you were in fact, a mediocre player, or either had a bad st power or loadout, because most players weren’t even getting 4 ticks beforehand lol.

But I’m done responding to you, because youre exempting strong childlike tendencies, so we can agree to disagree and keep it moving

This is the furthest from GU:36, there isn't even an apples to apples comparison here. Literally the only skill that comes from Precision dpsing, specifically flurry shot is maintaining 4 ticks of damage and jump cancelling before the final tick and dovetail animation to restart flurry. The vast majority of rotations of DWFS contain 3 powers being clipped every 16.5 seconds with phase dodge and then its just simply jumping and tapping your range tap. Super skillful indeed compared to GU:36 and 2011-2013 dpsing.

Also powers being more balanced then ever is the farthest from the truth and shows definitively that you didn't play the game back then. The "balance" is in the damage being dealt not in the powers themselves when nearly every single might rotation involves 1) Heat Vision 2) A Finisher 3) Freezing Breath 4) Robot Sidekick in some manner. Great balance there indeed so when you are a power like Ice that struggles with might single target, don't worry just use Heat Vision-Finisher-Freezing Breath 3 ticks with RSK. Oh Rage Might Ranged is bad? don't worry use Heat Vision - Freezing Breath 3 ticks - Sonic Shout 3 ticks super balanced. Your "balance" only comes from the fact that Solar Amplifier doesn't split damage on the final proc and it is impossible to change after the fact because that would mean adjusting a artifact after it was released and people spent money on which is most taboo thing DCUO can do. It took enormous measures just to adjust VWD and that was the only time an artifact has ever been nerfed, they changed every single healer supercharge before they would adjust EoG Casters Watch. Just because might dps is still 1-2-3-4-5 doesn't mean that because Prec involves 1 extra step it vaults it to GU:36 days.

Your idea of balance for might still revolves around a might dps just sitting in channelled powers back to back to back to back. Fire might can keep up with prec it's already been brought up in this thread, yea Snuff Out>Heat Vision>Absorb Heat back to back to back to back to back the entire fight being locked in animation for 2 of the 3 abilities makes for a enjoyable gameplay experience and lends itself extremely well to elite suitability doesn't it? Where the other part of DWFS always left out of the conversation is the highest ST damage done at MAX range with MAX mobility the entire time, you don't even have to worry about missing your clip with the weapon buff because its extended to 20 seconds from 12 so feel free to block or roll and continue doing the same level of buffed damage.

All this talk about this taking the "skill" away from Precision, where is the skill in getting your stats given to you on a silver platter in the game at every turn?
-Run a raid with a troll? automatic 20% prec buff where a might dps needs a troll to spend $200 on an artifact to match that
-Venom Wrist Dispenser prec buff
-Controllers Parasite Power Harness prec buff
-Controllers can run the Cog of Mageddon (with prec being the overall choice as a meta a minuscule amount of controllers have leveling a tetra to the same degree to run for might groups)
-Sparring AI prec buff
-Strategist Card Procs despite the recent might increase still outpreform might and doomspin and flurry are high multi hit combos which give much more opportunity to crit and proc Strategist where might can only rely on dots to proc or long channels which will still only have 5-6 hits compared to 13 hit doomspin combo and 4 ticks every couple seconds of flurry

Precision easily can have multi layered buffs in all content where for might unless you have a claw troll or find someone to run the tetra you are only left with your personal buffs to try to compensate.

So you can not agree with this change all you want, in the end its still a quick fix because whats really needed is a weapons pass, a proper one not GU:97 but to say there is any sort of balance in the game now its a statement that is the farthest from being factual that I can't even imagine otherwise.

VWD should probably be buffed a tad bit now to compensate for the recent adjustments

Having 11 weapon types with 4 cross-class skills each and only 2 viable spam-strikes in total says for itself. This change is a step in right direction. Lets hope first of many.

Having both ice and sorcery totally agree on these too. And i'm not the first voice here.

I’m all for dps balance, but it kinda makes putting skill points in weapon trees pointless. Why do it (as a prec dps) if I can be just as effective without doing it (as a might dps)? So along with balance, I’d like to see weapon abilities unlocked as we’re leveling up from 1 to 30, just like how powers are unlocked.

While I agree with your point, it's for another reason. In the end, I don't see se "loss" of ~15 SP for WM would make that much of an impact in the content that matters (i.e. where players have enough SP to max out relevant Skillpoints anyways).

Just auto unlocking all weapons seems okay to me, maybe even all regular combos but requirement to spec into specific mastery combos. Not that it is an issue now, but unlocking everything and having prec dps switching weapons multiple times without armories seems weird when might can't do that on the fly - or even midcombat. Not saying that it is relevant right now (since most WMs are fubar) but it could be possible.

Quantum player who used DW/flurry before it was any good. Use it for the mobility and it doesnt hurt that it actually does dmg. Would actually prefer to use bow but for some reason its ranged combos dont come close to it in dmg. Would love to be able to use different weapons but currently its the only one ive found that gives you that flexibility. Id have stayed might but got tired of being locked in long power animations. Having to use heat vision for nearly every powerset for decent single target is a bit lame also.

As a might dps running tetra, with health sitting at 8%, those 15 points would be a major help in covering that 20 point gap to 9%. 1% isn’t game breaking but you’re better off with it than without it.

Won’t do much?? It’s chopping 22.5% of the damage out of the combo!

I know and have ran with most of the best prec DPS players on the US PC/PS4 server, some of which I run with pretty frequently. It doesn’t happen too often, but it DOES occasionally happen that a might DPS will keep up with them in boss damage. And I’ve pretty much seen this happen with every power except for a few (Water, Atomic, Mental, Elec).

The thing people don’t realize is this: yes, it’s pretty much true that top tier prec DPS has been putting up significantly higher single target numbers in than 99% of might DPS. We all have relatively properly functioning eyes, we’ve all see the score cards and noticed that glaring result. But technically speaking, if there exists at least one celestial DPS or Fire DPS or Quantum DPS, etc, ets can produce ST damage on par with top tier DWFS precision, it’s technically possible for anyone to produce that same result iswith that same power. And BELIEVE ME, I’ve personally witnessed that happen with just about every power except for a few. So it is absolutely possible. And that means that the glaring gap we all see in the scorecard boss damage colum isn’t resulting from some kind of tuning Imbalance on a weapnon combo but rather the product of suboptimal might DPS loadouts and rotations.

Hell, where’s FoolsFire at?? He frequents the forums so I hope he’s around to weigh in on this. That dude can absolutely keep up with (if not outperform) the best prec DPS players in the game. He’ll tell ya. As far as I know, he’s not hacking, he’s not using magic or voodoo, he didn’t make some kind of deal with the devil for extra damage. He’s working with the same set of tools and options as every other Fire DPS. So if he can do it, it’s possible for every other Fire DPS to do it as well. Just because 99.9% of them are failing to do so, it doesn’t mean Flurry shot is overpowered. It means people are using mediocre loadouts.

Before adjusting the accuracy or others, we should already adjust the bugs already existing on the game ... Because many bugs are still topical and you do not move ..

I think a nicer way to put this is there is no more reason to be prec.

My main uses Dual-Flurry, because it makes me feel like a ninja, and I have no problem with this change.

That said, I would love to see a mild buff to other prec single-target combos, just for variety. Love to see something single to might ST abilities, so that might users don't feel shoe-horned into Heat Vision.

I understand that a full pass isn't possible, but what about just like a 2% generic increase to all other single target prec combos, and see if that's enough? If something emerges as too strong, just undo its buff. Maybe only 1%, nothing too crazy, I just think that everyone would be happier to see something besides arrows and blue beams.

22.5% from something this strong isnt a huge big deal as mepps said its still a viable option But i love the nerf ! but i hope it can be around 35 to 40% as i said its still the Best single target combo in the game no might except nature which should get nerfed too can keep up with it i did elite raids and no top tier prec dps ever got outdpsed by a Might except nature which on the hand nature atleast consumes power precision has the benefit it used much less power plus more mobility plus less abilities needed( hugely underrated benefit of prec dps) since things like shield and other stuff can be used instead and with this alone its a advantage which has to be considered when talking about balancing you clearly dont want equal things and i as a elite content player dont want such a big gap between end and low players when it comes to abilities if you are skilled you wont be worried about this when FOS 1,2,3 was out things were equal and it was still clear who got skill and who not now the gap is so big due to this DWFS whats the point of having 10 power sets if half of the loadout is from the iconics (talking about Prec dpses)And then DWFS users are probably the type of person to ask for new powers lol. This is DC universe online where you should use your heroic powers of your power (ice,munition and so on) and not flurry shot universe online!

well prec will be still the way to go because what prec makes good is still there, the ability to survive thx to mobility by not having to deal with animations and in the easy/regular/normal content doomspin aka prec all over again