Work In Progress Making Stats Matter: Removing CR Differential

Green Lantern Fadi · Feb 22, 2016

Heck yes I'm down !!

Mepps · Feb 22, 2016

Jacob Dragonhunter said: ↑

“So After reading this I have a few questions on the top of my mind:

1) NPC stats goes up higher as we progress, so if I'm at T4 fighting T1 adds, they'll start getting stronger? am I understanding that correctly?

2) With the NPC stat scaling, and Cr Difference Removal (You'd probably expect someone to ask this question anyways)
Will we be able to get marks from older content? or will we still be forced to work with the relevant content window we got in order to earn marks.

3) Does this mean we can actually expect harder content, Not Cheap one shot mechanics?

4) What will happen to Pet powers? Since they are Cr based and do higher damage, will the pets(Fury, Crystal, etc) be scaled too?

5) If we do get marks from older content.(question number 2) will that have any effect on tokens of merit and other rewards, when running older content that's past your relevancy?”

1. No. NPC and player stats increase as their respective level increases.
2. Not related
3. Not related
4. Pet stats will be adjusted with players and npcs

Kill Shot · Feb 22, 2016

Hmmm.. a few questions and concerns.

How will this effect pet powers?

Are y'all going to increase synth mod levels?

Can y'all make all mods cost the same amount of exobytes to make? Decreasing the amount it cost per tier would make it feasible to mod multiple toons.

Skill points are great and I love completing feats... but I just started a new character and I can't play the dang content to get the feats..

You got 1 or 2 150s burning the place down.... You can't even stop it... Me and my wife wanted to kick this 153 out at the beginning of a alert because he wouldn't respond so we could get some feats but you can't start a vote forever and then 2 of us voted yes and the 3rd didn't and it didn't kick him.

So y'all gotta fix that if y'all want feats to matter.

Aqua Surge · Feb 22, 2016

Mepps said: ↑

“1. No. NPC and player stats increase as their respective level increases.
2. Not related
3. Not related
4. Pet stats will be adjusted with players and npcs”

But Robot Side kick will remain the same? Little guy got a little stronger every time you scaled. He's like a small DoT over time that a pet.

Mepps · Feb 22, 2016

Pults said: ↑

“What is the possible impact on gear mods? Current VII mods cost 21 bytes each, recovering them with non-marketplace kits yields 66-100% which compared to total recovery kits is a huge margin. Wouldn't it force players to invest more of their DBC to just get the best possible mods each month? Will the byte costs for mods change or will everything remain as is with crafting?

Also since premium players have no access to equipment interfaces II (soder enchancers as well) and above without a third party, doesn't that punish the premium way of playing the game? (Not bringing up the broker since with the cash limitation it's not a viable source for any in-game items and it's off-topic)

Is stat clamping in out of relevancy instances still under discussion or won't be brought up with these changes?

P.S. Thank You for fixing the league problem I had the other day!”

Nothing is planned for mods with this change, and clamping is not related.

Mepps · Feb 22, 2016

Sivulla said: ↑

“So whose idea of CR thing was in the first place?

anyway, will you keep the CR displayed as level for other characters.
I guess cr wont increase with the mods, but would be nice to have some indication how well character is modded (synth/prefab/exomod or if any mods at all) One thing I like CR thing was it showed atleast general gist how

Will this effect stat clamps/lpve somehow.”

Yes, CR will still be visible as a measure of your gear. Remember, stats themselves come from the gear you are wearing primarily. We're returning to this direct link without the go-between of CR differential.

Burning_Baron · Feb 22, 2016

Patm82 said: ↑

“Quit!! changing things!!”

This is an MMO. It's what they do.

ErnieB · Feb 22, 2016

Mepps said: ↑

“Nothing is planned for mods with this change, and clamping is not related.”

Will a minimum or suggested SP number be added to On Duty?

12AngelOfLife21 · Feb 22, 2016

Phill said: ↑

“I am very excited & disappointed at the same time. The constant change from one direction to another is just horrible. I am here to say that the CR thing while upsetting at first was a pleasant surprise in that players had to no longer grind for hours and months to catch up.
I know exactly why this is happening.
Most of the PS players had no clue that CR was the main factor after GU 47 and now after merge with PC & PS. Most of the PS players are just now finding out that CR is the determining factor. ALMOST ONE YEAR LATER???? WTheck?

Daybreak does not want what happened on the PC side happening here after merge.
The PC side lost over 1/2 the game population in a few months.

Now, that being said.

Now DCUO is going to have a complete 180????? makeup my mind would ya!!!!!!! LOL
I am very excited to see that stats will mean something again......

ALSO...........

Something really needs to be done with the lower instances in a bad way. To many player have no clue and are being carried by higher players through content. There needs to be a way to make old content relevant again. There also needs to be a way to stop the madness of let my buddy carry us BS. It gets old and ruins the lower content for new and old players.

Now DCUO just needs to dump the whole relevance garbage and we will be good to go......”

LOL Really? I assure you, almost every single player on the PS side knew CR was a determining factor. Stop spreading your nonsense please. It's ridiculous.

theforgottenking1576 · Feb 22, 2016

At least make a sp package were new players can purchase it to be even with everyone else i mean this change is in no way fair to players who do not got alot of sps who are new or don't play alot and for people to say just earn them is ridiculous it's boring for 1 and for 2 alot of players who have only worried about cr for so long and not sps this is a smack in the face to them i mean they have already beat this stuff now have to go back to get sps to get stronger when it use to be cr that matter make sps easier to get for players and make a cap whats going to happen is players with high cr and low sps are going to be in stuff trying to do there role and won't be able to plus LFG chat probably will not add you to there group if you have a high cr and low sps we will hzve a hard time completing stuff getting kicked

Phantasy2013 · Feb 22, 2016

YES!!! Thank you Mepps, NerdofPrey and dev team. Again, I can return to true empowerment again in DCUO. Stats should matter more regardless of others opinions. For those of you who feel it will be like a job to farm feats, to improve your Villain or hero, then go play another game and have a great day.

Life isn't fair, deal with it or move on. In this case, its very fair to many who enjoy making their characters powerful.

theforgottenking1576 · Feb 22, 2016

Mepps said: ↑

“Yes, CR will still be visible as a measure of your gear. Remember, stats themselves come from the gear you are wearing primarily. We're returning to this direct link without the go-between of CR differential.”

Yes gear is were players get most there stats but players with low sps will get kicked and not be able to get the gear

12AngelOfLife21 · Feb 22, 2016

theforgottenking1576 said: ↑

“At least make a sp package were new players can purchase it to be even with everyone else i mean this change is in no way fair to players who do not got alot of sps who are new or don't play alot and for people to say just earn them is ridiculous it's boring for 1 and for 2 alot of players who have only worried about cr for so long and not sps this is a smack in the face to them i mean they have already beat this stuff now have to go back to get sps to get stronger when it use to be cr that matter make sps easier to get for players and make a cap whats going to happen is players with high cr and low sps are going to be in stuff trying to do there role and won't be able to plus LFG chat probably will not add you to there group if you have a high cr and low sps we will hzve a hard time completing stuff getting kicked”

1 million times no. That would be stupid. It's fair to even new players because new players can work on their skill points just as older players did. Boring it may be, but it was boring for the vets too and they still did it. Your absolute laziness speaks volumes.

MEBegnalsFan · Feb 22, 2016

Mepps said: ↑

“Hi folks,

Today we would like to share with you a project we are working on, the removal of Combat Rating Differential and the re-adjusting of player and NPC stats. We are undertaking this project with two main goals:

to provide consistent, meaningful progression Episode to Episode

to make stats, and all the activities in the game that impact stats, matter

Combat Rating Differential (How We Got Here)

Last year, as part of our efforts to provide consistent progression, player and NPC stats were adjusted and "flattened." This had the side effect of removing some of that feeling of gaining power, that growth you feel as you progress to higher CR. As a result (based on our internal playtests), we implemented Combat Rating Differential, which most simply made you perform better against enemies below your level and worse against enemies above.

Together, these changes introduced a few unintended results. Instead of chasing gear and skill points and mods across the breadth of the game, the focus for progression became more limited, primarily on gear that increased your Combat Rating. The increase of a few more points of Restoration here or there was little compared to the increase of moving just one Combat Rating closer to (or further away from) the enemy you were facing. The addition of CR differential also introduced a few irregularities, where gaining Combat Rating made you less powerful towards certain enemies far beneath you.

We want stats to matter. We want you to want and need skill points and mods. We want your stat-related decisions to be strategic. We want you to chase down every advantage and then we want you to utilize it to the best of your ability, not rely solely on one number.

Stats Matter (What's Next)

Moving forward, we will remove Combat Rating differential. Simple enough, right? But doing only that would still leave us with stats that are too flat, without that crucial feeling of becoming stronger as you grow. That needs to matter and feel right, too, so we will also adjust player and NPC stats so that both increase at a greater rate as you progress.

After these changes, we expect and intend for progression in the game to feel much like it did during Episodes 12-13 (Amazon Fury Part II). We will have more details on exactly how that will work when the changes make their way to test, where they will definitely need significant testing for feel from the community.

Combat Rating (What It Means)

What does this mean for Combat Rating? Currently, right now, Combat Rating directly impacts how you perform. Your Combat Rating is compared with your enemies' level, and your effectiveness and theirs is increased or decreased depending on which is higher.

After this change, Combat Rating will no longer have any impact on how you perform in combat. We will not be comparing your Combat Rating to your enemies' level. Your results will not be increased or decreased based on that comparison. Your potential to perform in combat will be entirely a result of your stats, not the result of your Combat Rating.

Combat Rating will remain a useful tool for checking in on where you are in the game, like a mile marker on the side of the road. It will note your general whereabouts, how far you have come, how far you have to go, your progress along your road to badassery, and that will be all.

Of course, we are looking to hear your feedback and address any concerns you have, so please use this thread to ask questions and discuss. Thank you!”

Have you tested how this impacts balancing? I'm curious if you did your due diligence here as we saw with GU47, one mis step can cause other issues.

I would hate to find out that after all the mid range updates completed you find out that well, Might power or Precision are stronger ATM and need to adjust stats further.

I'm thinking not of myself but for the whole community. A year GU47 ruined precision powers. I would hate to see this happen again. Just stating.

metalfenix · Feb 22, 2016

I'm even down for downloading the test client when the time comes. You can count with me for testing, devs.

theforgottenking1576 · Feb 22, 2016

12AngelOfLife21 said: ↑

“1 million times no. That would be stupid. It's fair to even new players because new players can work on their skill points just as older players did. Boring it may be, but it was boring for the vets too and they still did it. Your absolute laziness speaks volumes.”

No because when vets earned them the stuff was new and players stayed around to grind for feats now new players are not going to be able to find a group just for a feat run on older stuff LFG chat is already full of people trying to join a group for the newest content as it is you never see a person in lfg asking to join a group for tier 2 stuff or 3 or 4 theres a reason for that

SSeid · Feb 22, 2016

Excellent news. Best news you gave us for a very very long time.

Question/Reminder : Will you include changes to tanks to this update? / Don't forget Tanks, please do not forget to include tanks to whatever update you plan.

Also is this gonna be ready by the time SM will come.. it would be nice to be able to do SM without a predetermined point of no further!

Mepps · Feb 22, 2016

We are not considering changes to how skill points are obtained at this time. Skill points add depth to the game, and that's good for new and veteran players alike.

Cs2005 · Feb 22, 2016

I've been slacking with my sp looks like i have to get back to "the grind" excited about this change

Sun Goddess · Feb 22, 2016

Assuming two players stats are equal, does this help with some powers doing much less damage than others (i.e. Earth > Electric) ?
If so how?
Or is that a separate issue that is being worked on as well?

Work In Progress Making Stats Matter: Removing CR Differential

Green Lantern Fadi Loyal Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Kill Shot Well-Known Player

Aqua Surge Loyal Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Burning_Baron Loyal Player

ErnieB Loyal Player

12AngelOfLife21 Loyal Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

Phantasy2013 Dedicated Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

12AngelOfLife21 Loyal Player

MEBegnalsFan Devoted Player

metalfenix Committed Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

SSeid Committed Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Cs2005 New Player

Sun Goddess New Player

Log in or Sign up

Log in with XBL

Log in with NS

Log in with PSN

Work In Progress Making Stats Matter: Removing CR Differential

Green Lantern Fadi Loyal Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Kill Shot Well-Known Player

Aqua Surge Loyal Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Burning_Baron Loyal Player

ErnieB Loyal Player

12AngelOfLife21 Loyal Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

Phantasy2013 Dedicated Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

12AngelOfLife21 Loyal Player

MEBegnalsFan Devoted Player

metalfenix Committed Player

theforgottenking1576 Active Player

SSeid Committed Player

Mepps Sr. Community Manager

Cs2005 New Player

Sun Goddess New Player

Useful Searches