Fire/Quantum/Gadgets Midrange Adjustments

The Flaming Cascade results are what really shock me. If Mass Det goes unchanged (or is reduced in damage), I will probably never use Mass Det in any of my rotations. FC will be there instead for long-range purposes.

This is a semi-off-topic rant, but is pertinent to my FC vs. Mass Det decision. In real-game situations with all skill being equal, if all powers' damage is made identical in perfect testing environments, front-loaded powers will always outperform linear-damage powers, and linear-damage powers will always outperform back-loaded powers. Because players' rotations are interrupted all the time, it is technically impossible to make up the difference with slower powers. To make real-game results closer to true balance, continuous powers should be equal to the damage target in perfect testing environments, front-loaded powers should be slightly below that target, and back-loaded powers should be slightly above target. Nothing significant just a small % difference.

Bringing it back to FC vs. Mass Det, my in-game expectation would be that using FC at max range instead of Mass Det would at worst result in equal damage, but most likely lead to better results. The continuous damage FC offers is much more attractive than the risky back-loaded damage Mass Det produces.

Does Flame Cascade do any increased damage at mid or close range?

No I tested FC at all ranges and the results are virtually identical. This is in line with the power descriptions.

I realize I am terribly late to the party with this, but I'm bored so here we go.

Celest AM Parses

CR 126
Appropriate mods (dps white mods, full prec other junk)
Prec - 4700 (just shy of the 4880 goal)

Melee - RcW > AcB > CScWotP. Anoint and Bene kept on cooldown
Max: 40,521
Avg: 34,079

EDIT: Honestly just eyeballing the parses, this barely outperforms RcW spam at melee range. Lame.

Midrange - RcW > AcB > CScWotP. Anoint and Bene kept on cooldown
Max: 37,853
Avg: 33,079

This was super surprising

Max Range - PcDL > RcW spam until either PcDL or Anoint/Bene off CD
Max: 29,9623
Avg: 24,519

Max Range - RcW spam, keeping Anoint/Bene off CD
Max: 29,437
Avg: 28,281

This was also surprising.


I dunno. Interesting parses. I haven't checked out Celest forums to see wht theyre getting, but I figured itd be way off since theyre not standardizing their stats to test server parameters

8 or 3 targets?

Sorry it appears the links to my details aren't working on all browsers. (I don't want to keep posting screenshots directly to avoid cluttering the thread.) They would show that all tests are 20 trials on 3 targets.

All of my tests will be on 3 targets from now on because the spacing of the 8 targets makes accurate mid-range results virtually impossible. 8-target tests skew artificially high for mid-range because some targets wind up being in melee range.

And my expectation would be that MD should be used against scattered adds where it will be more efficient in damaging all of them despite its cast time, as opposed to FC which would hit maybe one or two targets at a time. I'm just adding one more dimension to your argument, really, and it shouldn't be ignored in my opinion. The way I see it, despite the limitations of MD, it ought to be used for a purpose other than just for raw damage. In this case, it's ranged AoE.

There's also one other thing to consider. If I'm right, if you cast Flame Cascade from afar then move closer as you keep casting it, it will deal a smaller base damage increasing over time. In contrast, Mass Detonation done the same way will deal the complete increased damage because it is dealt at the very end. FC ends up being less damaging in this case.

Again, just some thoughts to consider.

I was aware putting points in WM will lower the damage of your regular combos. I didn't know what to do about that. I wanted the bottom tier innates and thought I needed WM unlocked to get them. I was wrong. I didn't realize you could just spec the 21sp (22?) and the bottom row opens up regardless. That doesn't change much for these powersets. It will matter a lot when testing powersets that do use weapons. For simplicity sake, I would have done my spec videos putting that last point in a dump stat rather than WM.

Just to give some info on RcW.
Tunso and the team knows RcW is extremely powerful and is hitting like a bottom tree power.
Problem is, it's way too strong.
WcR even out performs RcW in mobs. Granted not by much, but still..

Quantum mid-range results:

CR: 126
Might:10426
Precision: 3457
Mods: Escalating might, max damage, core strength. I do not use the blast adapter on weapons for testing.
SP: 162
League Hall damage proficiences active
Generator: Might 6.2 x 4

Rotation:

Time Bomb/Warped Reality>Distortion Wave>Warp Barrage>Tachyon Blast
Time Bomb>Warp Barrage>Time Shift>Tachyon Blast
Time Bomb>Warp Barrage>Time Shift>Tachyon Blast...[repeat]

Distance:


Parser:
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 25992/s - 259916 total - 53 hits (28101 max) - 15 (28.3%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 32629/s - 326287 total - 51 hits (29300 max) - 16 (31.4%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 25686/s - 256864 total - 53 hits (27898 max) - 17 (32.1%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 30282/s - 302823 total - 52 hits (24861 max) - 10 (19.2%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 28613/s - 286128 total - 55 hits (28622 max) - 17 (30.9%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 30463/s - 304629 total - 50 hits (29070 max) - 10 (20.0%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 29217/s - 292165 total - 58 hits (23664 max) - 11 (19.0%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 23172/s - 231721 total - 53 hits (25385 max) - 14 (26.4%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 32693/s - 326933 total - 51 hits (28874 max) - 15 (29.4%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 26151/s - 261509 total - 56 hits (26645 max) - 17 (30.4%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 33167/s - 331665 total - 49 hits (29356 max) - 15 (30.6%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 29491/s - 294908 total - 56 hits (30055 max) - 19 (33.9%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 31716/s - 317162 total - 50 hits (26257 max) - 11 (22.0%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 34608/s - 346075 total - 59 hits (27997 max) - 18 (30.5%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 26073/s - 260726 total - 54 hits (28272 max) - 15 (27.8%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 31183/s - 311832 total - 51 hits (24697 max) - 14 (27.5%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 28404/s - 284038 total - 53 hits (29690 max) - 18 (34.0%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 31933/s - 319333 total - 52 hits (29740 max) - 10 (19.2%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 28437/s - 284365 total - 55 hits (29497 max) - 17 (30.9%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 30924/s - 309242 total - 49 hits (24070 max) - 14 (28.6%) crits - 3 targets
[Summary] Damage [10.0s] 34404/s - 344044 total - 59 hits (27897 max) - 20 (33.9%) crits - 3 targets

Average: 29773.24/s
High: 34608/s
Low: 23172/s
[Link to Analyzer Log]

I know the lows can look a bit bad at times but I believe that's a side effect of using 10/s parses with 1234 powers, and the design of those AM's. Gadgets and Mental have the same side effect because of the parses ending/starting in between the big hit at times. The average is the important number to note here but just wanted to point that out.

All in all I would say that's pretty close to the target they're going for but maybe just a tad under. Once the update hits hopefully everything should be sorted out but as of now I wouldn't say it's terribly under-performing on test server based on these results.

*note: sometimes the link to the analyzer doesn't work, if that happens give it some time and try again.

Thanks for running those parses as I can't currently get on test. Something I personally prefer when using 10 second parses is to use the total damage and divide by 10 instead of the Dps given in the parser, because the parser rounds. It is not a requirement, but I like to do it since it helps eliminate some slight skewing do to the rounding.

Given that the Dps comes to 29773.166..... Which is 99.24388...% of the targets. So, it looks like Quantum's mid-range is pretty much on target.

I've had some issues running parses for Quantum midrange. I typically like to use the 3 target set for midrange testing, but they are too far apart for Time Shift to hit at least 2 of them from the correct range. It's definitely a loss in DPS if you can't get the double damage from Time Shift so that might account for the slightly low midrange average.

That's a good idea, I hadn't thought about. I'll update the post with the total damage/10 when I can get a chance.

You're totally right about that, I actually noticed that as well when I did my parses and for whatever reason it totally slipped my mind once I started putting everything in excel and formatting, but that's a good catch and something that should be taken into account.

Im not Quantum DPS savvy (I only controlled with it for a bit) so excuse my noob question..
Is there a good substitute for Time Shift?

Not really. Time Shift is due for a larger cone angle. Arctic Gust used to have the same problem before it was adjusted.

That could do the trick.. but it could use a few extra options for the AM.

Was literately thinking exactly this a second before seeing your post.

If this isn't done, then in actual instances, with all things in a perfect DC world being perfectly equal in a testing environment as you say, the likes of nature & elec to name the obvious 2 are going to massively outperform all of the other powers when it comes to interruptions, stuns, knockdowns, knockbacks etc.

I REALLY hope how each power delivers their respective damage is going to be taken into consideration.

Checklist:

1. 126 CR
2. Full VII Mods (Might)
3. Might 6.2 Generator Mods
4. LH Proficiencies: Damage Out, Critical Attack, Might & Precision
5. HT Mods: Escalating Might, Core Strength, Max Damage
6. Might: 10426
7. Prec: 3457

Quantum Close Range
Mean: 37570
High: 44650
Low: 27537
Quantum Mid Range
Mean: 30683
High: 35977
Low: 25623
Quantum Long Range
Mean: 26080
High: 31679
Low: 23381

Rotation was the usual:
Time Bomb>Distortion Wave>Warp Barrage>Tachyon Blast
Time Bomb>Warp Barrage>Tachyon Blast>Time Shift
etc.

I conducted Mid Range tests at the 8 sparring target set standing at this angle:

This looks like the same angle I used for Fire tests.