RIP Precision

Had clipping been not added, or removed early on, people would have found a way to still play. Granted, there would still be people fluffing about it years later, but balance could've likely been more easily obtained, early on.

Trinket swapping during combat has always been something, although more popular it seems recently. I remember swapping my henchmen out for supply drop, mid fight, so I could boost my power pool back up for healing. "If" it, like clipping, was creating huge gaps, then I could foresee it being problematic.

I don't imagine the devs will have a "this is the way" when it comes to swapping artifacts. Artifacts that you've leveled, for benefit, to help, because you still have to take time to swap. Much different than clipping.

Thanks! Since its not specificly intented,can we expect you to fix it in the future? Or leave it as it is?

But no less people who like it (I'm not sure that I myself would have remained in the game if the clipping was completely removed) ... so isn't it better to find a balance between these two playstyles and not go from one extreme to the other? Fixing things that were never intended for such extreme clipping is a good start...then start looking at what can be done next to balance both playstyles...maybe increase the damage somewhere, maybe do a tiny penalty after clipping...but it's possible only if people give up extreme positions and agree to compromises...

art swapping definetly does create a very noticeable gap in damage especially when someone earlier on the forums explained it abit better its a big deal interms of how much damage gap this causes and as mepps said art swapping mid combat wasnt specificly designed to happen so its unintented. I hope they will take fix it.

I like clipping. If you don't like it, don't use it. You change artifacts during combat, ok. I don't need it, okay!

The devs fix something they don't think is appropriate and change their game. Fix your game. You can complain on the forum for missing it, ok.

There is no this is the way. But Git Gud, yes.

I love clipping, the game pre gu36 was dcuo’s prime, especially in terms of combat, the fast past nature of the game was unparalleled, and offered no where else but at the home of dcuo. However, even though I admired that combat system, I also appreciated the fact that people who didn’t like the more skill intensive style of play, could do good/competitive damage during the AM/WM era, even though I hated those playstyles, to the point of quitting during those eras, It was still good to see other playstyles get added to the game that supported a section of the playerbase that didn’t like the hastier
Combat. The more options the better, there shouldn’t just be one way to play the game, streamlining this game any further would just decrease this playerbase more, just like what happened after gu36.

There’s people who like clipping, and people who don’t, so just support both playstyles devs and stop donating bias towards one style of combat.
Devs figure it out!!

No, because at that point you’re touching peoples money, isn’t that the reason why they won’t touch eog, at least that’s what we assume

At this point, we just need a classic server with some of the Qol additions from the present server.
Devs, I would pay y’all my weekly tithes for a classic server lol

Just because it wasn't intended doesn't mean it's broken. So it doesn't need a "fix". I would hope it is left as is because many players spend thousands on arts just to be able to swap them mid-fight.

I’ve actually been ridiculed by players in the past because I noted that some people were not interested in visuals but instead interested in opening and closing their inventory screen quickly. One noted specifically something like “do you really think I want to look at Supergirl? I want to use my artifacts”. It’s a numbers game to them. May as well be a 1982 text adventure game on a Tandy 1000.

A year or two ago, I proposed an idea - Artifact Mastery.

Basically, it would use the old Advanced Mechanic system, but it would provide no direct DPS buff. The only thing a successful powers combo would do is activate a secondary set of 3 artifacts. This would allow you to use up to 6 artifacts, but you would need to play the game to do it (not just open and close your inventory screen).

It makes sense to me. We have pet focused builds. Might focused builds. Precision focused builds. This could be artifact focused builds. I see it especially useful to support roles

The programming work should largely be already done. All that’s needed is to create 3 secondary artifact slots (like the secondary weapon) and change the AM to activate those artifacts instead of a direct DPS buff

The idea would also be a compromise to those who spent money to level extra artifacts for swapping. They’ll still be able to use them, but they’ll have to adjust their play style. And if the artifacts are no longer compatible, there’s next double XP day to feed them into something else that’s useful. All you need is source marks to get the cats, and daily log-ins to get the seals. Players could even be provided with a box of seals to use due to the mechanic change (but you still have to play for marks to get cats)

The bad players are trying so hard to get rid of artifact swapping even tho they'll still be outclassed and looking to nerf whatever is next on the list lmao

i think we have players trying to keep such unintented things,exploits etc in the game to keep the large damage gap up like we have now,Players that are skilled will always be „stronger“ the question is - how much stronger aka damage gaps between players are allowed?

it depends how you see a noticeable damage increase that art swapping causes to be broken or not also considering it originally wasnt designed to be swapped mid combat.

True,is the intention to balance the game in a serious way or just some minor fixxes? Arts are undeniable a very large factor in the big dps gap between players and groups, one group deals double or tripple damage to the boss then the other despite similar stats is that gap really healthy for the game at endgame? The issue here are The buff troll arts and eog id say.

Despite raids being important for me i would say the damage gap, the broken meta,exploits,unintented things etc is probably far more important thing for them to focus on,i would even not take a second raid for next dlcs and have them instead fixxing stuff to really close the gap,the content isnt enjoyable with the way the game has been interms of balancing and it doesnt matter how much effort charon puts into it if the content of the game itself is not balanced and groups,players experiencing the same content completly different due to the unfair balance/huge damage gaps plus we have groups gate keeping other players because they dont have the right arts or dont play as prec.

This is somewhat of a vague answer, it implies despite not being the specific intent it's also not an unacceptable outcome, it just wasn't the immediate thought during design, primarily driven by your use of the word "specifically"

Had it been unacceptable you'd surely have left the word "specifically" out and just been blunt about it.

The real question here Mepps, then, is, do you intend to restrict artifact swapping and if so, to what extent. Do the developers actually have a problem with it? Which isn't actually what you answered. I think that's important because players spend money leveling artifacts for circumstantial benefit, money they'd otherwise not spend in a system that restricts it, a bit of transparency of intent might be appreciated.

That is ultimately one of the primary reasons why you have polarizing views in this thread and the other thread more specifically targeted at that topic.

Since you said „if it becomes a problem“ what needs to happen to see it as a problem?

Do you guys need or gather feedback from players on how much art swapping impacts the damage output from those that do swap arts mid combat vs those that dont?

Thanks!

Thanks Mepps, appreciate the clarity greatly and appreciate it is a balancing act

You are stretching what mepps said once again. It’s not an exploit. Just because you don’t like something doesn’t mean it’s an exploit. You did that with a previous comment by mepps to try and make a point you were arguing.


Mepps said it wasn’t designed with that in mind. That does not answer if it’s intended now or not. It doesn’t answer if they consider it something to be fixed in the future. All it means is that it was not designed with that in mind.

Here is the things that people need to understand. Clipping is a big part of the game. Without clipping the combat would slow down exponentially. Dcuo is already a very niche MMO. One of the different things about this game compared to other MMOs is the combat system. Artifacts is another major point in the. Game. Some artifacts are only viable when swapping them back and forth. I personally do not art swap because I don’t want to. I don’t want to spend half my time in my inventory. That is my personal choice.

People try to project their personal feeling onto what is intended it not. Bots and toys were deemed not intended. They didn’t really cause any major damage increase but it did allow prec to use barely any power to maintain loadouts. Cast abilities were changed for similar reasons. Prec could jump clip out of them to maintain rotations with low power cost. Now when a prec dps jump slips cast abilities they use the power. Now prec dps have to use abilities to clip which means they have to use power. The overall damage wasn’t changed much but the balance with resource cost did change and brought prec in line with might.

Art swapping benefits might more than prec because channel powers favor tac swapping. Popular tac artifacts also scale better with might like deadkings scepter. However both players can use it and both console and pc can use it. It’s also something that players have to spend time/money to obtain. Both things are positive for the game. Does that mean that arts won’t be changed? No. They may make some changes to make it so arts only benefit while equipped. This would make some arts less useful like dead kings orbital mini procs and philosophers ability cooldown ticks. Balance with artifact swapping comes down to whether someone wants to do them. It’s like cosplayers dps not liking others beating them because they refuse to use full loadouts. It’s a personal choice. I choose not to tac swap so I don’t get the benefits. Someone does choose to level those arts and tac swap so they get the benefits of it.

Not to take sides or anything, but the reason why you (devs) removed Advanced Mechanics was because the damage potential was causing the development of content to not be complex and it was too difficult for the average and below players to do/understand. I don't really see a difference here between AMs and Artifact Swapping.