In response to those who tells Eng's and Medics how to do their job

To be honest, I don't think this should be addressed to the people jumping in the air for an engineer's attention etc... It should be addressed to the -very vast- majority of engineers/medics who are unaware that they're playing a support class and are completely disinterested in helping team mates.

If I could come into a cozy corner and have an engineer rock up, throw down an ammo pack (or even, god forbid, one already be there) and repair me when he's done repairing his outfit mate, or done with his next UBGL spam or whatever, we'd be golden. The reality of it is that when I walk into a spawn room with 8 people who COULD switch to engineer, and 4 people who already are engineers, they're too busy spamming ammo packs on top of eachother to try to get the XP from the guys spamming haplessly out of the doors (that's the aforementioned 8), or doing the same themselves to even notice a MAX that needs a repair.

I always send polite /tells to engineers who I treat like morons and then am pleasantly surprised by their exemplary conduct, apologising and wishing them the best with inspiring the rest of our troops to L2P.

we are not rez repiar bots, we have feelings and real life families back home. We also hang out with the other support guys like the cooks on our days off, hope you like that special seasoning they might or might not add to your bag of rations if you fock with us. Remember you heavies and Maxs are nothing without our tool guns, rez grenades and ammo drops

I'm TR Waterson son; if the forums ever tell you anything it's that we don't lose.

Aside from most of that post being absolute crap you did get one thing right. I look out for myself first, my team second, and the rest of you scrubs third. And I do it my way, with my class. That was the entire point of the thread, to let you know that I not just some MAX slave here to do his bidding while he has all the glory and fun. If you have an issue with that feel free to set up an appointment with my secretary, Helen Waite.

About doing the job I'm supposed to do.
I regulary ignore corpses on the floor when I'm needed somewhere else. When I'm an engie I don't follow random MAX'es around. But sometimes when I'm an Engie and a MAX is heading into a direction that I think is valuble, I will be his temporarily pocket engie.

Same when I'm a medic, if a heavy is going somewhere that I deem is important I'll be his temporarily pocket medic.

Sometimes I ignore people, sometimes I go 1 step further. And it all depends on what I think is the best course of action at that specific time. Sorry for the people who I ran over, but I have to look at the bigger picture.

But mostly I try to go out of my way to even get the ones up that are being camped ^_^

You choose to play that way, which is your choice but it does make you a bad support player.

Just cos your faction does well doesn't mean you are doing your job well, because you're not.

If you can't deal with that fact you're in denial.

I'm an awesome support character. You are just a bad reader.

Sometimes I just complain to them but if they continue neglecting their team I don't see how shooting them is so evil. They just respawn nearby, anyways. I mentioned this because I was upset that I was in a tower push and just after dying on my Max because of lack of repairs and respawning as a medic, I notice a critically damaged ZOE spamming "I need repairs" next to an AI MANA turret user that was trying to shoot people in the tower, and was getting killed by snipers constantly. This was literally five steps from the friendly sunderer. I observed him purposefully ignoring the ZOE while trying to get some kills for himself.

It's in these egregious cases that I contemplate shooting them.

I don't think all engineers should instantly become pocket repairmen for maxes but if the zone is safe and a critically damaged max comes asking for help and you purposefully ignore him, there's a big problem, which is worse than teamkilling.

I do have a squad - always. It is still good though when two randoms both get the same idea, click, and make a difference. It's not an expectation: moving towards the enemy is a signal of intent (a primary form of communication). The engi can decide whether to push or not!

All well and good. Three things though.

1. If you roll ANY CLASS EVER I will hold you to that and expect you to do your job. A Medic that don't revive/heal or an Engineer that don't repair/re-fill ammo is as useless to us all as a HA who never bother with enemy armor/air - if you don't want to do that role, grab another class that suits you better.

2. If you roll Engineer and Medic you have a gun for a good reason. I don't want to get shot the moment I get back up because you insist on reviving me with an enemy in the room with us and did not think to kill him first, nor do I want to get my tank C4'ed while your repping it because you did not even consider flipping out your weapon to blow that C4 fairy the hell away. Mind your surroundings and perform your role when you can, if you can.

3. I expect Medics and Engineers and everyone else to pull their weight and do their part. When I play either of these I complete myclass-based objective as fast as I can, but won't neglect killing some hostiles when and if the opportunity presents itself. I will defend myself, and I will expect others to do so as well. Having said that, I keep seeing medics and engineers going ahead of the more attack oriented allies of theirs, getting killed first. No-one can revive either you or me when your dead, YOU WERE THE MEDIC. As a HA my job becomes meaningless once the engie rushes into the gen room first and dies, leaving me to clear the enemies and potentially die doing so, only to guard a broken gen with no engie to fix it. As a Support class you are very valuable to the war-effort and your specialized role CAN NOT BE FILLED BY ANY OTHER CLASS. Do not assume there are other medics and engies to replace you; odds are there isn't.

Having said all that, I will once again agree completely with the OP and simply state that this game has enough different roles to cover everyone's interests. There should be something you can do no matter what it is you want, just try and ensure you do that thing as well as able, you will be an asset to everyone around you.

Having a play-style you enjoy that involves being an unhelpful support class only out for your own good is perfectly fair. You play however you want. I however, will also hold to MY play-style (that is also perfectly fair) and it goes something like this:


If you are one of these types of players and I find you and need your services and you blatantly refuse the team-work chance and experience gain, don't assume for a second that I will not execute you. You will pull your weight or you will be disposed off, to be replaced by those who do. I will V2 V3 V4 once, depending on need. I will ask nicely in voice proximity chat once. *IF* this does not prompt you to take a few seconds out of your busy schedule to help your team out, Que head-shot. If you do help out however, you get a swift V1, and are now free to move on with whatever you were doing, content that you too, are helping.

Griefing is subjective. It don't matter to me at all how good you are at killing the enemy as an Egnineer or Medic, those are merely extra perks. No matter how good you are, it won't take you more than a moment to help heal nearby allies - in fact just press F and people who want healing will gather around and you AOE heal half a dozen guys or more at a time. Certs out the ****. It takes no more time than a single button press. People need ammo? 5, B aim at ground, M1, 1, carry on as you were. Certs out the ****.

There is practically no excuse other than laziness or egocentric behavior to ignore people asking you for help that only your class can provide, and denying people that because you can't be bothered is effectively griefing in and of itself - people rely on you to provide a service, denying it is effectively false advertisement.

Strange, it won't allow me to edit the last two posts to add this. Oh well.

I don't need you: you are a useless waste.

If you have an ammo pack out we are all good and I will move on and be out of your hair in a few short reloady seconds. If not I will ask twice. V4, then a bit later proxy "Would you care to provide me with a bit of ammo, please?" or something along those lines, I will not jump in front of your turret or shoot at you, you *can* hear what's going on around you. Then after this you will get some time to respond. 9 out of 10 times the Engie actually gets off the turret and drops a pack. V1, reload, carry on with a smile and a thankful heart. The 10th time? Emperor to base of skull three times, then move on.

Your help would be greatly appreciated, but I do not need you.

Good thing no one cares what you "expect". As stated, our JOB is to have fun. Not babysit.

Yeah, and we'll use it when we feel like it.

Again, it makes zero to no difference what you "expect". YOU want an engi that badly? Roll one.

Yeah, only no. If you think you can go around "executing" people because they don't play how you want, tough. That's when you'll be TK'd kindly in return. Time and time again. The moment you pull a tank? C4'd. Inject yourself into others play style, expect them to inject themselves right back.

Actually, no. Griefing isn't "subjective". Unfortunately for you the rules are quite clearly stated. There is no "false advertisement" and now your argument got silly.

No, you clearly DO, otherwise you wouldn't be asking. You also DON'T know what I can and can't hear around me, as I already stated, I often listen to music, but often if you're being annoying, I will also blatantly ignore you. Any purpose TK results in the team killer getting it back multiple times, including any vehicle their in.

That right there, that is the phrase that irks me the most. There is no other class that suits me better and is as versatile as the engineer. I choose the class because the class fills so many gaps. At the same time my friend counters it with the medic which allows the 2 of us to run small operations. When a third friend joins he usually plays a recon, which gives us stealth beacons and console stealing. The fourth friend, when we can persuade him to play TR, we try to talk into playing the heavy.
But with just the first 2 classes, we can handle almost anything on our own. Got a tank? No problem, I play decoy while my friend runs behind and C4's you. If it spots him and changes targets then out comes the AV turret. ESF spotted us? No problem, we split up and take turns shooting him with rifles until he smokes and leaves. Got a point to take, we mine one entrance and cover the other. I supply ammo, he heals. We both carry beacons.
When we join larger battles we provide our support to our team wherever we may be, but under no circumstances are we obligated to be held to any standards that somebody else puts on us. If you think I'm there to service you and your precious needs then there is going to be an issue. I work for the greater plan, not the greater of the one.

Forgive me for shamelessly trying to promote my own thread, but this suggestion will help engineers/medics a lot:
https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2...r-medic-icons-for-those-who-need-them.150102/

If more Medics could start using the TAR/TRV, Carnage BR/GR-22 and the H-V45 and kill as many people as they revive, that'd be great. Also, more revive grenades please.

1. Fun fact: I often run about as HA. I have a HUGE ammo reservoir and rarely run completely dry before I manage to reload, either on engies doing their duties or on the ammo packs of enemies - after I kill them. I also carry a large number of medkits so I can live for a bit without medics as well. Except ofc, those cost resources - I would prefer to give an ally score instead, if possible. If I ask you for ammo it's usually because A) There was not a pack already out and B) your an engie and I don't mind letting you get score for getting me ammo. If you refuse, I will simply have to deal - usually this is not hard as I start to actively seek out more ammo at the 50% depleted mark, not later. I do not *need* you to make do, but it would be great to get some more.

2. By all means keep your music up so loud you can't hear the simple V4 request for ammo. By all means, mute voice chats. By all means, ignore the text-request. It your prerogative to be as unhelpful as you possibly can. And it is my prerogative to off you where you stand and move on for more useful companions. Or maybe, if I'm in a good mood, just ignore you. SOMEONE ELSE will get the score and the certs regardless.

3. Unwise. It may lead to Emperor time. Having said that, I make efforts to not be annoying to anyone, but if asking you for something as simple as ammo is annoying to you... well, can't please everyone.

4. Blowing up my vehicle would be ill-advised, 95% of the time it's a Sunderer on the front somewhere. I highly doubt the others relying on it will be happy to listen to your explanations, as opposed to killing you and noting your name down as a toon to kill on sight to prevent you from killing any more friendly sundies. Regardless, if your going to take a lot of time to go out of your way to kill me in reprisal I have no issue just killing you whenever I see you and making this a *** for tat dueling over who's right on the freaking internet about their opinions in a game. It would be annoying, to be sure, but I can deal with that.

Ultimately though this reply is for general players who think like and act like you more than it is for you specifically. I am not asking any of you to ignore your own play-style in favor of anything, I as asking you to take a few measly seconds of your time to actually contribute the things that are unique to your classes. It don't take much time and prevents there being an issue in the first place.

@offtopic

Which server and what nickname? ;o

Holy TLDR Batman, that's a lot of words!

If a baddie engineer or medic doesn't resupply/heal/revive/give you a deep tissue massage, then assume they're bad and move on. Or roll medic and follow them around until they die and spend the next few minutes partially rezzing them then stopping.

Because justice has many forms.

**** if I remember. Phoenix Throne was one of them, I think for my evil army. Probably used Celina for the name. Only thing I remember really about her were many of the match battles, particularly a early one (Flag capture) where her and my buddies WE held the entire empire team at their spawn point. DOK's and Priests were absolutely disgustingly OP during that time.

This + bombing Bright Wizards. Good times (?).